Gas or electric company recommendations with no smart meter

Skint_yet_Again

The mse energy club comparison shows tariffs requiring smart meters but doesn’t mention them for British Gas ?
(I am not making a recommendation just pointing this out)

Spoonie_Turtle

Marvel1 said:

A smart meter offers the cheapest tariffs.

However apprantely they are supposed to send readings every 30 mins for this time of use for money off, don't seem to work for my parents though.

A pedantic point but just in case it's helpful, to my knowledge suppliers only pull data once a day, whether they've been given access to the half-hourly data or not.

[Though one would have thought the T&Cs for joining a smart tariff would include allowing access to the HH data if it's needed for that tariff.  Perhaps not.]

thedrumdoctor

Tumtitums said:

I've already told my company e.on that i don't want one but they just don't seem to want to take no for an answer. I'm on their variable rate but all their fixed rate tariffs which seem better seem to require that you install a smart meter

I can sympathise with your POV because I was dead against having a smart meter and told every new supplier that I didn't want one and was happy to provide monthly readings. 

To add to my stubbornness, I also refused to pay by direct debit and did bank transfer every month. 

The harsh reality was, by choosing to do things "my way or the highway", I was missing out on the most cost-effective tariffs. 

So, I decided, "what the heck" and went with EDF's offer to fit a meter. I mean, barring conspiracy theories, what had I got to lose with having one? They had their own SIM card, so no need to become one of those 'Internet of things' devices on my private network and being Gen.2, no problems when switching suppliers. 

It's also really interesting for the first month watching the meter in real-time to receive a visual display of what's hammering the juice. 

I had no problems with EDF or Utility Warehouse as they took only what they were owed. However, I'm having issues with Outfox the Market who seem to ignore the readings for the amount they need to take. They actively operate so their customers build up a surplus and keep taking cash based on the previous month's useage rather than actual. They are about to be booted as soon as I can gather a more extensive list of suppliers who actually bother to use the smart meter readings correctly. 

If you don't like your smart meter, I believe you can choose to use it in 'dumb mode' as they term it. There's nothing to lose really, especially if you want access to the competitive tariffs. 

bob2302

thedrumdoctor said:

I had no problems with EDF or Utility Warehouse as they took only what they were owed. However, I'm having issues with Outfox the Market who seem to ignore the readings for the amount they need to take. They actively operate so their customers build up a surplus and keep taking cash based on the previous month's useage rather than actual. They are about to be booted as soon as I can gather a more extensive list of suppliers who actually bother to use the smart meter readings correctly. 

When you pay by monthly direct debit, by default you pay an averaged amount each month and build up credit over the summer that you use-up in the winter. If you want a variable DD you have to tell them that's what you want.

thedrumdoctor

bob2302 said: When you pay by monthly direct debit, by default you pay an averaged amount each month and build up credit over the summer that you use-up in the winter. If you want a variable DD you have to tell them that's what you want.

In my experience EDF and Utility Warehouse didn’t take a fixed amount and I never had to contact them to ask for a variable rate.

Outfox the Market take fixed DD and as of July 2024, refuse to change to variable unless I go to their highest standard tariff.

Octopus have just told me they do fixed DD on set-up but will switch to variable after your account is live without changing tariff.

Incidentally, my time with EDF and UW were when there were no deals and everyone was on the maximum price-cap tariff. Maybe they all dropped the fixed DD back then because the average amount during summer was too horrific and people could barely afford to pay what they were being charged for using. No chance of building up surplus on the crippling price-cap tariffs….

bob2302

thedrumdoctor said:

bob2302 said: When you pay by monthly direct debit, by default you pay an averaged amount each month and build up credit over the summer that you use-up in the winter. If you want a variable DD you have to tell them that's what you want.

In my experience EDF and Utility Warehouse didn’t take a fixed amount and I never had to contact them to ask for a variable rate.
...
Incidentally, my time with EDF and UW were when there were no deals and everyone was on the maximum price-cap tariff. Maybe they all dropped the fixed DD back then because the average amount during summer was too horrific and people could barely afford to pay what they were being charged for using. No chance of building up surplus on the crippling price-cap tariffs….

You have this wrong way around. If you go on a variable DD the amount you pay in winter can be several times the fixed DD rate. Anyone who struggles with a fixed DD isn't going to get through winter on a variable DD.

I very much doubt you were on a variable rate with  EDF and Utility Warehouse - unless you explicitly asked them for it. Fixed DD doesn't literally mean fixed; the exact amount has to be varied in response to changing prices and updated estimates about how much gas and electricity you will use over the year.

thedrumdoctor

bob2302 said:

You have this wrong way around. If you go on a variable DD the amount you pay in winter can be several times the fixed DD rate. Anyone who struggles with a fixed DD isn't going to get through winter on a variable DD.

I very much doubt you were on a variable rate with  EDF and Utility Warehouse - unless you explicitly asked them for it. Fixed DD doesn't literally mean fixed; the exact amount has to be varied in response to changing prices and updated estimates about how much gas and electricity you will use over the year.

I checked the bills from day 1. UW only took what I had used as sent by the smart meter. In fact, I was always 'in arrears' - but there were no other tariffs on offer as we were in 'energy crisis' mode. I've just logged back in to my account and every bill was paid in full after the meter reading was sent at the end of the month leaving a zero balance from Nov 21 - Jan 24.

January 2023 was a peach....£615 after the £67 contribution from the government for the period 30/11/22 - 31/12/22. No reserves in my account, no overpayment during the summer months. They took the lot in one hit - as I was expecting and had prepared for.

When I switched from EDF to UW in 2021, UW were the second supplier to take readings from my new smart meter. They didn't take any money up front via DD and I ran up my first bill of £56 in arrears. This was taken and the balance set to zero and so on and so forth. The switch was done facelessly online on their so-called 'Value' tariff.

bob2302

It sounds like you were paying quarterly in arrears. This is distinct from fixed and variable monthly DDs. It's largely a legacy way of paying; a lot of companies don't support it anymore, and those that do charge extra for it  

thedrumdoctor

bob2302 said:

It sounds like you were paying quarterly in arrears. This is distinct from fixed and variable monthly DDs. It's largely a legacy way of paying; a lot of companies don't support it anymore, and those that do charge extra for it  

It was definitely monthly in arrears looking at the bill list in my old account. As you say, things have changed since then! Ah well, nothing stays still so we adapt and overcome. I stayed with UW for a long time because there was simply no point swapping until late last year.