Octopus Cosy 6 actually ready for market?

koru

Octopus's own-brand ASHP, the Cosy 6, looks like it is getting close to actually being ready for the market, since it now has MCS certification. You can see it by going to https://mcscertified.com/product-directory/, then Search By Product, then insert the certification number HP0255/03.

On the face of it, the SCOP figures look underwhelming. Compared, for instance, with Aira's own brand (number HP0372/02), it will use about 20% more electricity to produce the same heat output. Perhaps Octopus prioritised cost over performance?

Interestingly, for the Aira (or the Vaillant Arotherm) the SCOP figures stop at 55C, but with the Cosy 6 they go up to 65C. Does this suggest Octopus contemplate designing systems that run at 65C (despite a SCOP of 2.72)?

DougMLancs

I’m sure they would have had to make some compromises to keep unit costs lower. The manufacturer requests what temp their unit is tested to but I’m not sure it shows particular intention on Octopus’ part since Samsung and Mitsubishi Electric both have all their units tested up to 65 C too.

MP1995

Someone correct me if I am wrong but yes Octopus wanted to design a heatpuml that mimicked a gas boiler so perhaps they have had to compromise on lower flow efficiency to reach the dizzy heights of 65oCfor that too hot to touch radiator feel.

This will mean lots of free installs under the current £7.5 BUS grant scheme. Especially if radiators don't have to be replaced.

I don't advocate this myself as we run our heatoumo at 32oC flow temp in winter at a cop of 4.2 for the year. 

Reed_Richards

Replacing a gas boiler with a heat pump without changing the radiators pretty much guarantees that the heat pump will cost more to run than the gas boiler it replaced.  Knowing Octopus, they'll probably devise a special cheaper electricity tariff exclusive to this situation so people don't pay more.  

DougMLancs

They have said the Cosy 6 will have an exclusive tariff. They include 2 rad upgrades in their online quick quote and then make a judgement after the survey about further upgrades based on the house and customer funds (from the quotes I’ve seen about anyway). The market Octopus are trying to crack are those who will just go and buy another gas combi if they can’t get a comparable quote to gas with comparable running costs and no one wants that. 

wrf12345

The whole point of thing as far as cost goes is that you can turn it on when electric is cheap and turn it off when it is expensive, so if the COP is only 3 rather than 4 but the electric rates are half price you still win out, assuming you have enough insulation to keep the house reasonably warm in such a scenario. If you run it like a gas boiler, set to a certain temp all day long then it may well be more expensive.

koru

DougMLancs said:

They have said the Cosy 6 will have an exclusive tariff. They include 2 rad upgrades in their online quick quote and then make a judgement after the survey about further upgrades based on the house and customer funds (from the quotes I’ve seen about anyway). The market Octopus are trying to crack are those who will just go and buy another gas combi if they can’t get a comparable quote to gas with comparable running costs and no one wants that. 

I had not heard the 2 rad bit, but I think you are right that Octopus are responding to what the mass market wants, which is installation and running costs no higher than a new gas boiler. They appear to have made the low installation costs the priority, which makes sense, because the customer can easily, objectively compare the price with a new gas boiler. 

This probably means running costs will be higher than they would have been with a more expensive ASHP, but that's not going to be the main concern for the mass market. Your average householder is just going to want to see some figures from Octopus plausibly claiming that their heating costs will not be any higher than with gas and that the Cosy 6 will keep them warm. With a tariff that gives them cheaper electric for the Cosy 6 and, say, a design SCOP of 3 (which requires a design temperature of 56 degrees), Octopus should be able to argue that the Cosy 6 will cost no more to run than gas and be just as warm.

Even if the Cosy 6 is less efficient than (some) other ASHPs, it may be a better decision, financially speaking. If the Cosy 6 uses, say, 20% more electric than a more efficient ASHP, that's only about £200 extra electric per year. I don't think most householders are going to be willing to pay £thousands more for a different ASHP simply because it might save them £200 per year. (In my case, Octopus are £5-10k cheaper than other installers, even before they are offering the Cosy 6.) 

The strategy also makes sense in terms of carbon reduction, because most people are still installing new gas boilers, so the way to make the biggest impact on carbon is to address the reasons people are making that choice. A Cosy 6 might not reduce carbon emissions as much as other ASHPs, but it is a lot better than a gas boiler. 

Reed_Richards

So you end up with a less-efficient-than-usual heat pump system and you are tied into Octopus because only they are supplying you with electricity at a sufficiently low tariff to make the system cost-competitive with a gas boiler?  If Octopus can supply the electricity at a price that still makes them money it would be a win for Octopus, gaining a whole slew of customers that can't go anywhere else.   

smallblueplanet

Reed_Richards said:

So you end up with a less-efficient-than-usual heat pump system and you are tied into Octopus because only they are supplying you with electricity at a sufficiently low tariff to make the system cost-competitive with a gas boiler?  If Octopus can supply the electricity at a price that still makes them money it would be a win for Octopus, gaining a whole slew of customers that can't go anywhere else.   

Even if true, what stops other suppliers competing with Octopus' low HP tariff? Profit? 

MP1995

I suspect the default is the Octopus cosy tariff for their jn house heat pumps.

Looking at the specs of the cosy 6 and some power management around the cosy dips it woukd work out cheaper that price cap gas just not cheaper than tracker gas at current levels.

wrf12345

Bear in mind, new Labour govn may be climate warming crazy and tax gas out of existence, either directly or by increasing council tax for non-heat-pump homes, which if it ramps up demand will perhaps triple rather than double actual costs...