Dividend history info for Accumulating Funds / ETF ?

masonic

BlisteringBarnacles said:

https://www.vanguard.co.uk/professional/product/etf/equity/9679/ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-usd-accumulating?cmpgn=DP0523UKCENPA0001EN says VWRP which I thought had GBP as base currency but spreadsheet shows currency as USD.

The base currency is USD, but it has various listings with different trading currencies (including the other codes you mention). The ERI will be in USD and you are correct that you should convert using HMRC exchange rates.

BlisteringBarnacles

Thanks again to everyone. There is a mismatch here that I am unable to explain. Can someone please help ? I am unable to reconcile trustnet dividend info with the excess reporting income spreadsheet.

Taking an example : FTSE 100 UCITS ETF (VUKG) Accumulating :
                                   
From here : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-100-ucits-etf-gbp-accumulating/overview
- I got the ISIN number : IE00BFMXYP42

Then went to : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/Q7RD/vanguard-ftse-100-ucits-etf-acc-gbp
clicked on Dividends Tab.

Focus on Dividends from 01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023, I got :

Amount   ex-dividend-date  payment-date

0.4073     15.09.2022     28.09.2022
0.1915     15.12.2022     28.12.2022
0.3334     16.03.2023     29.03.2023
0.4114     15.06.2023     28.06.2023

Add up the dividends and you get : 1.3436

This is not exactly matching the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income.

I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx

I searched for Vanguard FTSE 100 UCITS ETF, GBP Accumulating, so I can cross-check the info here. I see :

Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 1.3708

Under column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023

Under column : Reporting Period : I see : 01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023

Why are the dollar amounts not matching ?

Also, the spreadsheet has no entry at all for these funds :
*) FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund Accumulating (VAFTGAG) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-global-all-cap-index-fund-gbp-acc/overview
*) FTSE U.K. All Share Index Unit Trust (VUKASSA) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-uk-all-share-index-unit-trust-gbp-acc/overview

Thanks

BlisteringBarnacles

Did the same exercise for a distributing fund. Here I know the trustnet info is correct because it is matched by Vanguard's main page info.
But here also I am unable to reconcile the info in the excess reporting income spreadsheet.
Just looked at VWRL : [ FTSE All-World UCITS ETF : Distributing]  : to verify the numbers :
Focussing on period : [01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023]

1) Under https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-usd-distributing/distributions I see :
Amount Ex-dividend date    Record date    Payable date
$0.4956   15-Sep 2022   16-Sep 2022    28 Sep 2022
$0.3785   15-Dec 2022   16-Dec 2022    28 Dec 2022
$0.4092   16-Mar 2023   17-Mar 2023    29 Mar 2023
$0.7273   15-Jun 2023   16-Jun 2023    28 Jun 2023

2) The above matches trustnet exactly : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/G2HB/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-inc-usd  if you click on Dividends Tab

3) However I am unable to reconcile this with the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income. Dates are matching but the amounts are not ??!! What am I missing ?
I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx
I searched for Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF Distributing, so I can cross-check the info here against (1) and (2) above. I see :
Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Column 1 below is : Income distributed per share in respect of the reporting period2   
Column 2 below is : Ex-date on which distribution was declared₃ DD/MM/YYYY
0.2642    15-09-2022
0.2596    15-12-2022
0.2856    16-03-2023
0.2749    15-06-2023  
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 0.0162
Under Column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023
Why are the dollar amounts under (1) not matching (3) at all  ?

Aidanmc

BlisteringBarnacles said:

Did the same exercise for a distributing fund. Here I know the trustnet info is correct because it is matched by Vanguard's main page info.
But here also I am unable to reconcile the info in the excess reporting income spreadsheet.
Just looked at VWRL : [ FTSE All-World UCITS ETF : Distributing]  : to verify the numbers :
Focussing on period : [01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023]

1) Under https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-usd-distributing/distributions I see :
Amount Ex-dividend date    Record date    Payable date
$0.4956   15-Sep 2022   16-Sep 2022    28 Sep 2022
$0.3785   15-Dec 2022   16-Dec 2022    28 Dec 2022
$0.4092   16-Mar 2023   17-Mar 2023    29 Mar 2023
$0.7273   15-Jun 2023   16-Jun 2023    28 Jun 2023

2) The above matches trustnet exactly : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/G2HB/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-inc-usd  if you click on Dividends Tab

3) However I am unable to reconcile this with the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income. Dates are matching but the amounts are not ??!! What am I missing ?
I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx
I searched for Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF Distributing, so I can cross-check the info here against (1) and (2) above. I see :
Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Column 1 below is : Income distributed per share in respect of the reporting period2   
Column 2 below is : Ex-date on which distribution was declared₃ DD/MM/YYYY
0.2642    15-09-2022
0.2596    15-12-2022
0.2856    16-03-2023
0.2749    15-06-2023  
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 0.0162
Under Column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023
Why are the dollar amounts under (1) not matching (3) at all  ?

In (3) the values you quoted are for S&P 500 rather than the All world etf?

The eri value 0.0162 was for the All world etf though

Aidanmc

Also, the spreadsheet has no entry at all for these funds :
*) FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund Accumulating (VAFTGAG) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-global-all-cap-index-fund-gbp-acc/overview

*) FTSE U.K. All Share Index Unit Trust (VUKASSA) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-uk-all-share-index-unit-trust-gbp-acc/overview

I think these funds are UK domiciled and thats why they are not on the ERI spreadsheet.

EthicsGradient

BlisteringBarnacles said:

Thanks again to everyone. There is a mismatch here that I am unable to explain. Can someone please help ? I am unable to reconcile trustnet dividend info with the excess reporting income spreadsheet.

Taking an example : FTSE 100 UCITS ETF (VUKG) Accumulating :
                                   
From here : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-100-ucits-etf-gbp-accumulating/overview
- I got the ISIN number : IE00BFMXYP42

Then went to : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/Q7RD/vanguard-ftse-100-ucits-etf-acc-gbp
clicked on Dividends Tab.

Focus on Dividends from 01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023, I got :

Amount   ex-dividend-date  payment-date

0.4073     15.09.2022     28.09.2022
0.1915     15.12.2022     28.12.2022
0.3334     16.03.2023     29.03.2023
0.4114     15.06.2023     28.06.2023

Add up the dividends and you get : 1.3436

This is not exactly matching the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income.

I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx

I searched for Vanguard FTSE 100 UCITS ETF, GBP Accumulating, so I can cross-check the info here. I see :

Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 1.3708

Under column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023

Under column : Reporting Period : I see : 01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023

Why are the dollar amounts not matching ?

Also, the spreadsheet has no entry at all for these funds :
*) FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund Accumulating (VAFTGAG) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-global-all-cap-index-fund-gbp-acc/overview
*) FTSE U.K. All Share Index Unit Trust (VUKASSA) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-uk-all-share-index-unit-trust-gbp-acc/overview

Thanks

It's hard to know what TrustNet thinks it's reporting here. By its nature, the accumulating FTSE 100 ETF did not have any dividends, and they could not be given quarterly dates, nor defined as "final" or "interim".  Possibly what they're doing is taking the real dividends of the income version (see Vanguard FTSE 100 UCITS ETF Inc GBP Fund factsheet | Trustnet ) and multiplying them by the ratio of the price of the income and accumulation versions at that time (if you compare the two, you'll see the ratio grow from 1.065 in Sept 2022 to 1.127 in March 2024; the current price ratio is 1.134).

This would then give people a rough idea of what the income that is accumulating over the year will eventually turn out to be when it really is calculated as the ERI. It is, however, not a figure with any meaning for tax, and cannot be used in any tax return. You could email TrustNet and ask them what the dividends in an accumulating fund are supposed to be.

Aidanmc

EthicsGradient said:

BlisteringBarnacles said:

Thanks again to everyone. There is a mismatch here that I am unable to explain. Can someone please help ? I am unable to reconcile trustnet dividend info with the excess reporting income spreadsheet.

Taking an example : FTSE 100 UCITS ETF (VUKG) Accumulating :
                                   
From here : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-100-ucits-etf-gbp-accumulating/overview
- I got the ISIN number : IE00BFMXYP42

Then went to : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/Q7RD/vanguard-ftse-100-ucits-etf-acc-gbp
clicked on Dividends Tab.

Focus on Dividends from 01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023, I got :

Amount   ex-dividend-date  payment-date

0.4073     15.09.2022     28.09.2022
0.1915     15.12.2022     28.12.2022
0.3334     16.03.2023     29.03.2023
0.4114     15.06.2023     28.06.2023

Add up the dividends and you get : 1.3436

This is not exactly matching the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income.

I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx

I searched for Vanguard FTSE 100 UCITS ETF, GBP Accumulating, so I can cross-check the info here. I see :

Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 1.3708

Under column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023

Under column : Reporting Period : I see : 01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023

Why are the dollar amounts not matching ?

Also, the spreadsheet has no entry at all for these funds :
*) FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund Accumulating (VAFTGAG) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-global-all-cap-index-fund-gbp-acc/overview
*) FTSE U.K. All Share Index Unit Trust (VUKASSA) : https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-uk-all-share-index-unit-trust-gbp-acc/overview

Thanks

It's hard to know what TrustNet thinks it's reporting here. By its nature, the accumulating FTSE 100 ETF did not have any dividends, and they could not be given quarterly dates, nor defined as "final" or "interim".  Possibly what they're doing is taking the real dividends of the income version (see Vanguard FTSE 100 UCITS ETF Inc GBP Fund factsheet | Trustnet ) and multiplying them by the ratio of the price of the income and accumulation versions at that time (if you compare the two, you'll see the ratio grow from 1.065 in Sept 2022 to 1.127 in March 2024; the current price ratio is 1.134).

This would then give people a rough idea of what the income that is accumulating over the year will eventually turn out to be when it really is calculated as the ERI. It is, however, not a figure with any meaning for tax, and cannot be used in any tax return. You could email TrustNet and ask them what the dividends in an accumulating fund are supposed to be.

I was wondering what was going on there also.

masonic

It is worth noting that even distributing ETFs can have ERI (this is in addition to the dividends), so a declared notional dividend for an accumulating ETF should not be expected to match its ERI. There are things that need to be treated as income for tax purposes that fall outside of a dividend. What you are seeing is therefore not surprising.

If you add the distributed dividends to the ERI then that is the figure to report as taxable income.

BlisteringBarnacles

Aidanmc said:

BlisteringBarnacles said:

Did the same exercise for a distributing fund. Here I know the trustnet info is correct because it is matched by Vanguard's main page info.
But here also I am unable to reconcile the info in the excess reporting income spreadsheet.
Just looked at VWRL : [ FTSE All-World UCITS ETF : Distributing]  : to verify the numbers :
Focussing on period : [01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023]

1) Under https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-usd-distributing/distributions I see :
Amount Ex-dividend date    Record date    Payable date
$0.4956   15-Sep 2022   16-Sep 2022    28 Sep 2022
$0.3785   15-Dec 2022   16-Dec 2022    28 Dec 2022
$0.4092   16-Mar 2023   17-Mar 2023    29 Mar 2023
$0.7273   15-Jun 2023   16-Jun 2023    28 Jun 2023

2) The above matches trustnet exactly : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/G2HB/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-inc-usd  if you click on Dividends Tab

3) However I am unable to reconcile this with the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income. Dates are matching but the amounts are not ??!! What am I missing ?
I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx
I searched for Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF Distributing, so I can cross-check the info here against (1) and (2) above. I see :
Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Column 1 below is : Income distributed per share in respect of the reporting period2   
Column 2 below is : Ex-date on which distribution was declared₃ DD/MM/YYYY
0.2642    15-09-2022
0.2596    15-12-2022
0.2856    16-03-2023
0.2749    15-06-2023  
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 0.0162
Under Column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023
Why are the dollar amounts under (1) not matching (3) at all  ?

In (3) the values you quoted are for S&P 500 rather than the All world etf?

The eri value 0.0162 was for the All world etf though

Did I ?  : I see it on Line 274 in the spreadsheet at 

https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx

It is Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF. I'm not where you saw S&P 500.

Anyway coming back to my original question, Hargreaves has told me that they will send out Tax Certificate even after I become non resident, so I can eventually obtain the dividend information for Accumulating Funds.

Probably easy to just hold distributing units in UK-taxable account. 

Thanks

Aidanmc

BlisteringBarnacles said:

Aidanmc said:

BlisteringBarnacles said:

Did the same exercise for a distributing fund. Here I know the trustnet info is correct because it is matched by Vanguard's main page info.
But here also I am unable to reconcile the info in the excess reporting income spreadsheet.
Just looked at VWRL : [ FTSE All-World UCITS ETF : Distributing]  : to verify the numbers :
Focussing on period : [01 July 2022 - 30 June 2023]

1) Under https://www.vanguardinvestor.co.uk/investments/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-usd-distributing/distributions I see :
Amount Ex-dividend date    Record date    Payable date
$0.4956   15-Sep 2022   16-Sep 2022    28 Sep 2022
$0.3785   15-Dec 2022   16-Dec 2022    28 Dec 2022
$0.4092   16-Mar 2023   17-Mar 2023    29 Mar 2023
$0.7273   15-Jun 2023   16-Jun 2023    28 Jun 2023

2) The above matches trustnet exactly : https://www.trustnet.com/factsheets/O/G2HB/vanguard-ftse-all-world-ucits-etf-inc-usd  if you click on Dividends Tab

3) However I am unable to reconcile this with the spreadsheet of Excess Reporting Income. Dates are matching but the amounts are not ??!! What am I missing ?
I first went to : https://www.vanguard.co.uk/uk-fund-directory/documents/ie-domiciled-funds/tax-reporting as advised : Then Scrolled down to "Vanguard Funds plc Excess Reportable Income reports " and downloaded the first spreadsheet : 30 June 2023
This is : https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx
I searched for Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF Distributing, so I can cross-check the info here against (1) and (2) above. I see :
Fund : Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF
Column 1 below is : Income distributed per share in respect of the reporting period2   
Column 2 below is : Ex-date on which distribution was declared₃ DD/MM/YYYY
0.2642    15-09-2022
0.2596    15-12-2022
0.2856    16-03-2023
0.2749    15-06-2023  
Under column : Excess of reporting income over distribution : I see : 0.0162
Under Column : Fund distribution date : I see : 31 December 2023
Why are the dollar amounts under (1) not matching (3) at all  ?

In (3) the values you quoted are for S&P 500 rather than the All world etf?

The eri value 0.0162 was for the All world etf though

Did I ?  : I see it on Line 274 in the spreadsheet at 

https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/Vanguard_Funds_Plc_ERI_30_06_23.xlsx

It is Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF. I'm not where you saw S&P 500.

Anyway coming back to my original question, Hargreaves has told me that they will send out Tax Certificate even after I become non resident, so I can eventually obtain the dividend information for Accumulating Funds.

Probably easy to just hold distributing units in UK-taxable account. 

Thanks

Yes, Line 274 is the ERI value for  FTSE All World

Line 275-278  is the quarterly distributing values for FTSE All World

The line underneath the fund name leaves it a bit confusing.