Subsidence & insurance

funny_bones

Hello,

I’m in the process of buying a property and the coal mining search has come back that there was a subsidence claim in 1994 which was settled 17/11/1997 at just under £1,500.

My solicitor has requested the following: 

 Our Coal Mining Search has revealed that the Property was part of a 1994 claim for Coal Mining related subsidence damage our clients survey also confirmed that the Property had been affected by past structural movement.  Please provide information and evidence as to what remedial works were carried out.  As the Seller did not reply to 6.4 of the Property Information Form please now specifically confirm that the subsidence issues have been reported to their insurer and whether this has affected the premium payable.   

My solicitor has advised me to see if I can get an insurance quote for the property. I tried Direct Line first and had to speak to someone. They told me they would need the following before they could quote me: Inhad to scribble quickly so wording is thereabouts 

1) Is the current buildings insurance with them?

2) Has the property or adjoining property been underpinned?

3) Has the subsidence damage due to coal mining been repaired?

4) Is there a survey for the property and the adjoining property? I asked what level survey and the guy just said it didn’t say, it only said the wording ‘survey’.

5) Was the subsidence repair over 20 years ago & has no ongoing issues? 

6) Does the survey state the property has past structural movement and the movement appears to be longstanding? 

I had a level 2 survey which stated ‘’The property has been affected by past structural movement as evidenced by misalignment to a window opening at the rear. So far as can be seen from this single inspection the movement appears to be longstanding. We would not expect it to be progressive, beyond acceptable tolerances.’’

- When they state adjoining property, if a property is detached, does that mean there is no adjoining property? 

- Does anyone have a property which is similar and have you had problems getting insurance? Or if the insurance premiums are stupidly high? 

- Is it better to just walk away? 

Thanks in advance of any replies.

funny_bones

Thought I’d also add the sellers are the power of attorneys so I’m wondering if they were even aware

tooldle

That seems a very small claim. We bought our first house in 1996. That house had recently been underpinned (roughly a year prior to our purchase). The cost of the works was significantly more. No impact to our insurance other than staying with the existing insurance until the works were 5 years old. 

Whatever has happened in your situation would seem very minor. 

How old is the house?


Do you have reason to doubt the surveyor?  “ I had a level 2 survey which stated ‘’The property has been affected by past structural movement as evidenced by misalignment to a window opening at the rear. So far as can be seen from this single inspection the movement appears to be longstanding. We would not expect it to be progressive, beyond acceptable tolerances.’’

funny_bones

tooldle said:

That seems a very small claim. We bought our first house in 1996. That house had recently been underpinned (roughly a year prior to our purchase). The cost of the works was significantly more. No impact to our insurance other than staying with the existing insurance until the works were 5 years old. 

Whatever has happened in your situation would seem very minor. 

How old is the house?


Do you have reason to doubt the surveyor?  “ I had a level 2 survey which stated ‘’The property has been affected by past structural movement as evidenced by misalignment to a window opening at the rear. So far as can be seen from this single inspection the movement appears to be longstanding. We would not expect it to be progressive, beyond acceptable tolerances.’’

Yes, I thought it was a small amount too and wasn’t initially too worried. It’s only after I tried to get a quote and they were asking me all the questions most of which I don’t have an answer right now. 

It’s a 1960s bungalow.

No reason to doubt the surveyor. Just a case of how I answer the insurance questions and trying to gage others in similar situations. 

Thanks for sharing your experience, it does ease my mind a bit. Just hope the POA can provide the information requested by my solicitors. 

propertyrental

My current house had the original conservatory demolished due to subsidence (inadequate foundations) and re-built.

However I was given a Certificate of Structural Adequacy to sign off the rectification work.

I also checked for insurance quotes. The number of insurers who quoted was significantly reduced, but the quotes I did get were all reasonable once they seen the CSA so I was happy to purchase.

funny_bones

propertyrental said:

My current house had the original conservatory demolished due to subsidence (inadequate foundations) and re-built.

However I was given a Certificate of Structural Adequacy to sign off the rectification work.

I also checked for insurance quotes. The number of insurers who quoted was significantly reduced, but the quotes I did get were all reasonable once they seen the CSA so I was happy to purchase.

Thank you for sharing. I think it’s going to come down to if the POAs are aware.

I’ve had another look at the property information form and they haven’t answered the questions if the buildings insurance has an abnormal rise in premiums, high excesses, unusual conditions or refused. Also the question if any buildings insurance claims have been made, they’ve answered unknown! 

I am worried the POA don’t know enough about it all and if that’s the case, I can’t answer the questions needed by the insurers. I might try phoning another insurance company to see what type of questions they ask. 

silvercar

5) Was the subsidence repair over 20 years ago & has no ongoing issues? 

Whereas you may think that this is true, it could be that the elderly owners decided they couldn’t face the hassle of any further claims and just ignored any issues that appeared.

propertyrental

POAs often have little knowledge so 'Not Known' is a perfectly normal, if unhelpful, response. You must rely on own investigations.

* check for insurance quotes. Insurers share information, so in my case all the insurers knew of the claim and many of them pre-filled the answer to the Q 'Has there been any subsidence'?

* get your solicitor to ask if there is a Certificate of Adequacy

mark_cycling00

From experience, you'll get high excesses for subsidence from comparison sites but a local insurance broker can often get the excess down to £1,000 or so. 

Unpopular choice as they add on a small commission but they'll have dealt with lots of similar issues and know who can provide decent cover 

funny_bones

silvercar said:

5) Was the subsidence repair over 20 years ago & has no ongoing issues? 

Whereas you may think that this is true, it could be that the elderly owners decided they couldn’t face the hassle of any further claims and just ignored any issues that appeared.

I’ve had a level 2 survey done and it’s not picked up any issues. It does mention past structural movement which appears to be longstanding and they don’t expect any further movement within normal tolerance levels.

propertyrental said:

POAs often have little knowledge so 'Not Known' is a perfectly normal, if unhelpful, response. You must rely on own investigations.

* check for insurance quotes. Insurers share information, so in my case all the insurers knew of the claim and many of them pre-filled the answer to the Q 'Has there been any subsidence'?

* get your solicitor to ask if there is a Certificate of Adequacy

Thanks, I’ll ask about the certificate of adequacy. 

mark_cycling00 said:

From experience, you'll get high excesses for subsidence from comparison sites but a local insurance broker can often get the excess down to £1,000 or so. 

Unpopular choice as they add on a small commission but they'll have dealt with lots of similar issues and know who can provide decent cover 

I’ve gone onto compare the market and it only came back with 11 quotes. All the cheap quotes were from companies I’d not heard of before starting at £176. The only one I’d heard of is Admiral and that was £500. 

A bit of an update - I popped round to the property this morning as I’d booked an electrician to do an electrical inspection. One of the POA was there and we ended up chatting. We were both frustrated with the lack of communication. 

They weren’t aware I’d asked the EA if I could book in a flooring company to do an estimate same time as the electrician. The EA never came back to me. They also weren’t aware my solicitor had asked a load of questions. They told me they’d signed the contracts for the sale 3 weeks ago. It also sounded like they were not aware of the subsidence and I get the impression they may not have declared it to the insurers. She just said ‘we’ve not had problems getting insurance’, ‘I don’t think they asked the question’! I did explain when I tried to do an online quote with Direct Line, the question did come up and I ended up having to phone them.

We have swapped phone numbers now so we can try to keep each other updated and she also said it’s ok for me to book in tradespeople for quotes. 

She went home and has found some paperwork relating to the mining subsidence claim. I’ve told her to keep copies before she passes the, to her solicitor. She told me the owner who is now in a care home (EA told me she’d moved in with relatives), kept all paperwork but it just wasn’t filed that well. They just passed all the folders to their solicitors to go through. She also mentioned the paperwork for the new roof should be with their solicitors too - but according to my solicitors correspondence they were told that I should do my own searches with the local authority. 

funny_bones

Going back to my original post, if a property is detached does that mean there is no adjoining property?