Fighting a 3 yr old alleged Euro Car Parks PCN via DCBL

Bergmann

I would be grateful for all help and advice in fighting what I regard as an unreasonable fine and belated follow up.

The alleged offence occurred, wait for it - 8th January 2021 at Shell Garages Kings Lynn (Petrol not a service station).   Apparently I overstayed their self determined 20 minute stay limit by exactly 10 mins.  I was not aware of this at the time but more on that later.

So you can imagine my surprise when I received a letter from DCBL (debt recovery firm) on the 26th April acting on behalf on their client Euro Car Parks, demanding £170 or they will take me to court to recover it.  The original fine was apparently £100 for this 10 minute infraction.

So three years later (the eagle eyed will have spotted this occurred in the infamous post Christmas Bojo lockdown  - I travelled to collect a puppy) this alleged 'debt' has likely been bought up with 1000s of others and DCBL only have to make a few stick etc to make it profitable.

I've asked DCBL to see the relevant documents as it was such a long time ago.  They have so far supplied - 

a. The original PCN sent by Euro Car Parks on the 13.1.21
b. Time stamped photos of my vehicle showing the 30 minute stay which is over their permitted 20 mins

I would like some advice on the legalities involved and the best way of closing this down without having to pay.

My thoughts so far - 

• I have no record of receiving the written PCN at my address.  
• Neither Euro Car Parks nor DCBL have provided proof of posting etc (it was lockdown after all) and only supplied electronic copies which do not by themselves prove that they were actually sent, let alone received
• This was three bloody years ago!   By not giving me opportunity at the time to appeal I now cannot prove whether the signage was visible and appropriate (remember this was at a petrol station, I'd not seen one have a time limit like this before)
• I do not think a 10 minute delay incurred anything like £100 of inconvenience to Shell Garages and is over the top
• I think DCBL are going in strong to try to scare me with threat of court action to hand over £170

What do folks think?   Fight this, make an offer, or give up and pay in full?

Gr1pr

A lot of assumptions there, Its not been bought up at all , not allowed, the responsibility remains with the parking company, the debt collectors or legal firms are contractor's working on behalf of the parking company 

The data controller remains with the parking company, in this case , ECP

Also, they don't have to prove anything, any PCN was posted to the address obtained from the DVLA database, they don't have to prove that it was received, its presumed delivered 2 working days later 

They have 6 years to sue you in civil court 

You keep saying DCBL , without clarification, it's either the debt collectors DCB LTD, or DCB Legal, lawyers, so similar initials but different arms of the business, so which is it. ? And what does the latest letter say exactly. ?

Post a redacted picture of it, because I believe that its only a worthless debt collector letter, worthless junk mail 

Also post a redacted picture of both sides of the PCN from ECP 

Confirm if your name and address are correct or not on that PCN, yes or no. ?

Note, I have tried to unpick the facts about the case from the assumptions and initialisms 

Bergmann

Thanks and yes to confirm DCBL is the debt collector DCB Ltd.

As suggested here is the letter - 

[Image removed by Forum Team]

KeithP

Just a debt collector's letter, The clue is "You now have 14 days...".

 The fourth post of the NEWBIES thread explains exactly how to deal with debt collector's letters, but to summarise that post - ignore them.

Gr1pr

Post redacted pictures of both sides of the NTK PCN letter leaving all dates and times and contravention showing 

Confirm if the name and address on the front are the correct details as obtained from the DVLA database, your details 

Either those details are correct, or not correct 

A common cause of not receiving the pcn is moving and not updating the details promptly 

Meanwhile, nothing can be done at the debt collectors stage, its an impasse 

Bergmann

First, apologies in hindsight now having read the newbies thread I regret posting yet another debt collection letter thread.

Sounds like the advice is to ignore it completely - I assume with the reassurance that they cannot actually take any further action to try to extract monies from me via the courts etc?

@Gr1pr - the reverse of the DCBL letter just has ways to pay and I expect statutory links to sources of advice, and a logo saying they are members of the British Parking Association etc.

The original letter from ECP is addressed to the correct place at the time even though I moved house 18 months later.

I've made the bloody mistake of responding via email to the original letter saying that I didn't recognise the original PCN and why the bloody hell are they chasing me for something 3 years later.

Gr1pr

The debt collectors cant, but the parking company can , typically using lawyers like DCB Legal as I mentioned earlier 

If the parking company and their lawyers win in court, they can definitely use enforcement by a warrant of control application to the court, do some research on MCOL if this is in England and Wales 

They have 6 years to issue a court claim in England and Wales, 5 years in Scotland, been that way for several decades 

So they issued the NTK PCN letter to the correct DVLA registered keeper address, it will be assumed to have been posted out, on the balance of probabilities, and presumed delivered 2 working days later, despite all the royal mail issues 

3 years is nothing in these cases, its only halfway 

Bergmann

So basically I sit tight and wait and see if ECP decide to move from debt collection to legal action?

I suspect that DCBL debt firm has this late on maybe bought a chunk of debt from ECP to see if they can bluff people into paying?

Coupon-mad

No they have not bought the debt.  The first reply told you that.  It is not allowed.

Sounds like the advice is to ignore it completely - I assume with the reassurance that they cannot actually take any further action to try to extract monies from me via the courts etc?

No.  You will get a claim. Then you win.

AS LONG AS YOU TELL THEM TO ERASE ANY OLD ADDRESS ON THEIR DATABASE.

See the 2nd post of the NEWBIES thread.

  

LDast

DCBL or any other DRA cannot "buy debt". They offer their services to the PPC on a no-win, no-fee basis. Their "service" is to get the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree to poop their pants and pay up, the now inflated charge.

DCBL are not a party to the contract you have allegedly breached with ECP and so cannot take you to court or do anything else for that matter. You can safely use any correspondence from DCBL or any other DRA as kindling.

What is eventually going to happen, assuming you are not low-hanging fruit, is that ECP will ask the other branch of the DCB empire, DCB Legal, to act on their behalf and send you a Letter of Claim. The second post of the Newbies/FAQ thread tells you how to deal with that.

Whether you respond to the LoC or not, DCB Legal will issue a county court claim on behalf of ECP. You must respond to a claim. Again, all explained in the Newbies/FAQ thread and the Template Defence thread.

Luckily for you, as you are not gullible because you are here seeking advice, you will follow all the steps as advised and eventually, you will see your username in lights in this thread once they discontinue:

DCB LEGAL RECORD OF PRIVATE PARKING COURT CLAIM DISCONTINUATION

Le_Kirk

Bergmann said:

The original letter from ECP is addressed to the correct place at the time even though I moved house 18 months later.

Did you inform the DPO of the PPC of your new address for service and require them to inform all any of their agents and sub-contractors of same and tell them to erase your old data? If, as @Coupon-mad predicts, the PPC decides to issue a LOC/LBC and then a N1 claim form you don't want it to  go to somewhere that you no longer live at!