Land Registry Update Submission Query

formwrangler

Looking for a couple of pointers please @Land_Registry

My brother and I have recently been granted probate on my Fathers house which he owned outright at the time of his death.

1. We are both named on the certificate of probate as executors, is it still the case that we therefore do not need to complete the ID1 form when we submit the AP1 and AS1 forms to update the Land Register?

2. My Father had to move into a care home for just under a year before he died and the certificate of probate lists the care home as his last permanent residence at the time of his death (rather than the house we have now inherited).  When we submit AP1 and AS1 do you need any additional paperwork to clarify this?

3. As an aside, my Mother died a few years ago and her name still appears as joint owner with my Father as we neglected to have it removed at the time.  When we submit AP1 and AS1 to update the registry to my Brother and I should we also include a DJP form to have her name removed or is that now irrelevant?

Thanks for any help!

Land_Registry

formwrangler said:

Looking for a couple of pointers please @Land_Registry

My brother and I have recently been granted probate on my Fathers house which he owned outright at the time of his death.

1. We are both named on the certificate of probate as executors, is it still the case that we therefore do not need to complete the ID1 form when we submit the AP1 and AS1 forms to update the Land Register?

2. My Father had to move into a care home for just under a year before he died and the certificate of probate lists the care home as his last permanent residence at the time of his death (rather than the house we have now inherited).  When we submit AP1 and AS1 do you need any additional paperwork to clarify this?

3. As an aside, my Mother died a few years ago and her name still appears as joint owner with my Father as we neglected to have it removed at the time.  When we submit AP1 and AS1 to update the registry to my Brother and I should we also include a DJP form to have her name removed or is that now irrelevant?

Thanks for any help!

1 - you need your identities verified. The requirements changed last September 
2 - no. Where he was living isn’t a registration issue here. Probate is both proof of death and the legal authority needed for his executors to deal with his estate 
3 - no DJP needed but we will need a certified/official copy of her death certificate 

formwrangler

Thanks @Land_Registry, appreciate the help.

Just to be clear, when we complete box 4 on AP1 should we use "Transfer" or "Assent" as the application type?  Both come under the Scale 2 fees but want to be sure we're getting the wording correct.

Then in box 5 the documents lodged with AP1 would be AS1 and 2 x ID1 (one ID form each for me and my brother?)

Land_Registry

formwrangler said:

Thanks @Land_Registry, appreciate the help.

Just to be clear, when we complete box 4 on AP1 should we use "Transfer" or "Assent" as the application type?  Both come under the Scale 2 fees but want to be sure we're getting the wording correct.

Then in box 5 the documents lodged with AP1 would be AS1 and 2 x ID1 (one ID form each for me and my brother?)

An Assent is a transfer so your use of either isn’t crucial but as you are using a form AS1 I’d be putting Assent in panel 4
And panel 5 should list the docs you are submitting so yes re form AS1 and ID forms. Plus the copies of death certificate I mentioned and of course probate  

formwrangler

Just one last general question @Land_Registry ... Are these changes to the current deeds actually necessary in order for us to sell the property to a third party?  

As you said:

Probate is both proof of death and the legal authority needed for his executors to deal with his estate

Does that therefore mean we can sell the property as is (currently under my late Father and Mothers name but legally ours) and then use AP1 / TR1 and the supporting death / probate / ID certificates to swap the names on the deeds to the new owners in one go?

We have no intention of living in the property ourselves.

Land_Registry

formwrangler said:

Just one last general question @Land_Registry ... Are these changes to the current deeds actually necessary in order for us to sell the property to a third party?  

As you said:

Probate is both proof of death and the legal authority needed for his executors to deal with his estate 

Does that therefore mean we can sell the property as is (currently under my late Father and Mothers name but legally ours) and then use AP1 / TR1 and the supporting death / probate / ID certificates to swap the names on the deeds to the new owners in one go?

We have no intention of living in the property ourselves.

There’s usually no need to update the register before selling as the deaths are sadly factual and can be proven. So a buyer can generally rely on the current register plus the death certificate for the first parent to pass away and probate for the second. The ex3cutors then sell/transfer 

formwrangler

Land_Registry said:

formwrangler said:

Just one last general question @Land_Registry ... Are these changes to the current deeds actually necessary in order for us to sell the property to a third party?  

As you said:

Probate is both proof of death and the legal authority needed for his executors to deal with his estate 

Does that therefore mean we can sell the property as is (currently under my late Father and Mothers name but legally ours) and then use AP1 / TR1 and the supporting death / probate / ID certificates to swap the names on the deeds to the new owners in one go?

We have no intention of living in the property ourselves.

There’s usually no need to update the register before selling as the deaths are sadly factual and can be proven. So a buyer can generally rely on the current register plus the death certificate for the first parent to pass away and probate for the second. The ex3cutors then sell/transfer 

Thanks for this, seems more straight forward than updating things now only to do them again once we sell to a third party (Unless you think it might hold up a potential sale for any reason?)

Appreciate the help.

Land_Registry

formwrangler said:

Land_Registry said:

formwrangler said:

Just one last general question @Land_Registry ... Are these changes to the current deeds actually necessary in order for us to sell the property to a third party?  

As you said:

Probate is both proof of death and the legal authority needed for his executors to deal with his estate 

Does that therefore mean we can sell the property as is (currently under my late Father and Mothers name but legally ours) and then use AP1 / TR1 and the supporting death / probate / ID certificates to swap the names on the deeds to the new owners in one go?

We have no intention of living in the property ourselves.

There’s usually no need to update the register before selling as the deaths are sadly factual and can be proven. So a buyer can generally rely on the current register plus the death certificate for the first parent to pass away and probate for the second. The ex3cutors then sell/transfer 

Thanks for this, seems more straight forward than updating things now only to do them again once we sell to a third party (Unless you think it might hold up a potential sale for any reason?)

Appreciate the help.

Shouldn’t hold up the sale if the registered names match the official certificate/probate. If they do then the buyer can normally rely on the paperwork to complete knowing the named executors are the people they need to be dealing with 

Albert_owley

What luck. All my queries already answered in this post. The gov.uk page referencing 'update property records when someone dies' still says..The beneficiary must fill in ID1. You'll also need to complete the form if you're transferring the property and you're not the executor...ie implying executors don't need to. Glad I found out they now do before submitting my forms.