Retirees -- Day 1 -- Bull or Bear Market...

ChesterDog

I retired (early forties) in 2007, right into the teeth of the 2008 crash.

It did me a huge favour, as I realised I hated having my investments managed by somebody other than me (especially as the "other" was my bank...).

It also did me a huge additional favour, by forcing me to take a deep dive into investments in order to learn how to take it on, what to do and (even more importantly) what not to do.

It all passes through in the end.

Millyonare

Hoenir said:

Millyonare said:

dunstonh said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market

Never heard that said before.      Its a completely bizarre thing to say as well.   Perhaps the people saying it have no understanding of planning, markets or real life.

It's a very common debate in the US, where investors and researchers tend to be a bit more sophisticated than in the UK and Europe.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/14/success/retiring-into-a-bear-market/index.html

US debate tends to be very US centric. As for more sophisticated I'd say it's American Exceptionalism that shines through. Currently it's like watching someone in a Tesla travelling along a motorway at high speed in thick fog.  

The UK always follows what the US does. Like two peas in a pod.

The US has been wildly outperforming the UK economically and financially now for more than a century. There's no Warren Buffett $100b sage in the UK. Microsoft alone (one firm) is bigger than the entire UK total stockmarket. The London Stock Exchange (LSE) is not even among the world's top-10 largest anymore. LSE has plunged from 3rd to 11th worldwide in just a couple of decades.

The trend is clear -- US investors are on a whole different level to UK investors.

There's no shame in admitting it. The US is simply better than the UK.

dunstonh

It's a very common debate in the US, where investors and researchers tend to be a bit more sophisticated than in the UK and Europe.

Well, this is not the US and sophisticated is not the right word.   This is Europe which has higher regulations and standards and a better global awareness.  Expectations tend to be more realistic.

If that is a real debate and not journalistic rubbish of the type you see across the world. then it shows that there is insufficient knowledge and that American investors lack the sophistication of European investors.       I suspect it is more likely to be journalists filling pages rather than real debates.

The UK always follows what the US does. Like two peas in a pod.

No it doesn't.

The US has been wildly outperforming the UK economically and financially now for more than a century. 

So, not like two peas in a pod.

The US spent much of that century as an emerging market, while the UK went in the opposite direction. However, the US is starting to face the same issues that the UK did at the start of its decline.

There's no Warren Buffett $100b sage in the UK. Microsoft alone (one firm) is bigger than the entire UK total stockmarket.

These are all irrelevant points when it comes to retirement planning decisions.

The trend is clear -- US investors are on a whole different level to UK investors.

They are.  US investors tend to be insular, whereas European investors tend to be global.

There's no shame in admitting it. The US is simply better than the UK.

One country is turning its back on populism and the other is preparing to repeat its mistake.      Each has its pros and cons.

However, again, this is totally irrelevant when it comes to when to retire. Comparing the UK stock market to the US stock market does not form any part of the discussion.   

LHW99

Millyonare said:

dunstonh said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market

Never heard that said before.      Its a completely bizarre thing to say as well.   Perhaps the people saying it have no understanding of planning, markets or real life.

It's a very common debate in the US, where investors and researchers tend to be a bit more sophisticated than in the UK and Europe.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/14/success/retiring-into-a-bear-market/index.html

But that link discusses retiring in a bear market - the OP originally said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market...

Or have I missed something somewhere?

masonic

LHW99 said:

Millyonare said:

dunstonh said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market

Never heard that said before.      Its a completely bizarre thing to say as well.   Perhaps the people saying it have no understanding of planning, markets or real life.

It's a very common debate in the US, where investors and researchers tend to be a bit more sophisticated than in the UK and Europe.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/14/success/retiring-into-a-bear-market/index.html

But that link discusses retiring in a bear market - the OP originally said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market...

Or have I missed something somewhere?

Indeed, I thought it was highlighting additional challenges associated with retiring in a bear marker. Maybe the article is just too sophisticated for us to get our heads around

Albermarle

masonic said:

LHW99 said:

Millyonare said:

dunstonh said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market

Never heard that said before.      Its a completely bizarre thing to say as well.   Perhaps the people saying it have no understanding of planning, markets or real life.

It's a very common debate in the US, where investors and researchers tend to be a bit more sophisticated than in the UK and Europe.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/14/success/retiring-into-a-bear-market/index.html

But that link discusses retiring in a bear market - the OP originally said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market...

Or have I missed something somewhere?

Indeed, I thought it was highlighting additional challenges associated with retiring in a bear marker. Maybe the article is just too sophisticated for us to get our heads around

Or it just a lot of bull !

boingy

I just assumed this was an April Fool thread.

Hoenir

Millyonare said:

Hoenir said:

Millyonare said:

dunstonh said:

Most commentators say never retire in a bull market

Never heard that said before.      Its a completely bizarre thing to say as well.   Perhaps the people saying it have no understanding of planning, markets or real life.

It's a very common debate in the US, where investors and researchers tend to be a bit more sophisticated than in the UK and Europe.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/06/14/success/retiring-into-a-bear-market/index.html

US debate tends to be very US centric. As for more sophisticated I'd say it's American Exceptionalism that shines through. Currently it's like watching someone in a Tesla travelling along a motorway at high speed in thick fog.  

The UK always follows what the US does. Like two peas in a pod.

The US has been wildly outperforming the UK economically and financially now for more than a century. There's no Warren Buffett $100b sage in the UK. Microsoft alone (one firm) is bigger than the entire UK total stockmarket. The London Stock Exchange (LSE) is not even among the world's top-10 largest anymore. LSE has plunged from 3rd to 11th worldwide in just a couple of decades.

The trend is clear -- US investors are on a whole different level to UK investors.

There's no shame in admitting it. The US is simply better than the UK.

On so many levels it isn't.  Being totally money centric makes for a form of capitalism that suggests the model is broken.