NatWest investments team APS ISA transfer from an external S&S provider

wmb194

dunstonh said:

wmb194 said:

In my experience NatWest and RBS Investments *invest* in Coutts branded funds but the ISA/GIA is managed by NatWest/RBS.

It is badge engineering.   i.e. Natwest product with a Coutts badge.   It uses a multi-asset fund.  I transferred one out a few years back as it was basic and expensive with no justification to retain.    It appeared to be their way of competing with robos.

Yes. As you say, they’re not very good anyway. NatWest is doing the OP a favour if they’re pushed to another provider.

pjs493

Malthusian said:

You do not have to use Coutts to use your Additional Permitted Subscription. Is getting Aviva and the wealth management firm to open an ISA in your name and transfer your husband's investments across an option? Or opening an account with a different provider entirely?

If you insist on keeping the Coutts branding, at least then you would be dealing with a normal Aviva S&S ISA -> RBS S&S ISA transfer, which their call centre might find a bit easier.

I just want all my ISA money in the same place - the NatWest Invest S&S ISA I opened years ago. I could have opened an Aviva ISA or and RBS Collective Investment Fund ISA if I’d wanted to, but I just want my money in one place. I’ve already got the funds from Aviva. I just need NatWest to add the APS allowance to my ISA allowance so I can add the funds to my ISA. 

pjs493

xylophone said:

Are you  actually a Coutts client? Do you have a private banker?

but instead it’s languishing in an easy access savings account with a rubbish interest rate waiting for me to be able to move it. In the meantime I’m going to end up paying tax on that interest when the money should be in an ISA. 

It seems from your post that you have opened a Natwest Cash ISA?   Although why, under normal circumstances,  anyone would choose an account offering such poor rates is beyond me.

https://www.natwest.com/savings/isa-overview.html

I bank with NatWest and I’m a Premier customer due to the amount of money I have with them. I have a named Premier manager, but she’s faced the same road blocks as I have when she’s tried to look into it for me. 

NatWest have a number of different investment departments. My investments are managed by Coutts, but they also have the RBS Collective Investment Fund (which I’ve never used so have no idea why they entered the picture when I’ve been trying to get the APS allowance added to my existing ISA). NatWest also have their Cash ISA investment option. I only opened a Cash ISA account because NatWest told me it was the only way I could get the APS allowance, because my S&S ISA couldn’t have an APS allowance added to it for reasons unknown to me. 

I’ve not transferred any of the money into the Cash ISA because I’ve already hit the £20k ISA limit for this tax year so I need the APS allowance before I can add my late husband’s money. It was paid into my NatWest current account and I moved it to one of my easy access savings accounts so it could at least gain some interest while this drags on. Most of my savings are in my S&S ISA or fixed term savings accounts to take advantage of good interest rates. I also have a couple of easy access savings accounts where I hold money for unexpected expenses that might crop up from time to time. 

pjs493

wmb194 said:

dunstonh said:

wmb194 said:

In my experience NatWest and RBS Investments *invest* in Coutts branded funds but the ISA/GIA is managed by NatWest/RBS.

It is badge engineering.   i.e. Natwest product with a Coutts badge.   It uses a multi-asset fund.  I transferred one out a few years back as it was basic and expensive with no justification to retain.    It appeared to be their way of competing with robos.

Yes. As you say, they’re not very good anyway. NatWest is doing the OP a favour if they’re pushed to another provider.

I’ve found that my NatWest investments have worked well for me. The fees are significantly lower than what my husband was paying with a wealth management firm and my ISA always seemed to do better than his. I also have JISAs for our children with NatWest. As a NatWest Premier customer I could never understand why my husband was paying such high fees to get essentially the same service I was for a fraction of the cost. He only ended up using the wealth management company in the first place because his parents use it and it’s owned by a friend of theirs.  

xylophone

I’ve found that my NatWest investments have worked well for me. The fees are significantly lower than what my husband was paying with a wealth management firm and my ISA always seemed to do better than his. I also have JISAs for our children with NatWest.

But have been you paying more than you need to be through Natwest?  Did you or your FA (is this an Independent FA) ever check/make comparisons?

Re JISA

https://www.natwest.com/investments/junior-isa.html?extcam=N_PPCB_GGL_INV_BAUQ42022_0_0_{​keyword}​_Search&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1oPCocyAhQMVXwt7Bx1CYw-gEAAYAiAAEgKwCfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Compare Fidelity or Hargreaves Lansdown JISA

As for stocks and shares isa 

https://moneytothemasses.com/saving-for-your-future/investing/the-best-stocks-and-shares-investment-isa-the-cheapest-fund-platform

badger09

@pjs493
I feel your pain & frustration. There has clearly been a lot of confusion within thin the NatWest group. 

A few questions:
1 When did AVIVA pay the proceeds of your late husband’s S&S ISA into your NatWest current account 
2 Why did they do that
3 Do you have a letter from AVIVA showing the value of your late husband’s S&S ISA ie the amount of your APS? 

pjs493

badger09 said:

@pjs493
I feel your pain & frustration. There has clearly been a lot of confusion within thin the NatWest group. 

A few questions:
1 When did AVIVA pay the proceeds of your late husband’s S&S ISA into your NatWest current account 
2 Why did they do that
3 Do you have a letter from AVIVA showing the value of your late husband’s S&S ISA ie the amount of your APS? 

1 Aviva paid my late husband’s S&S ISA into my NatWest current account in February after they received the Grant of Probate. 

2 I’m not sure exactly what you’re asking here. They paid it because as far as they were concerned I was the right person to pay it to and that had been confirmed with Probate. I’m not sure why it was paid into my current account or why they didn’t wait until they had information of my ISA from NatWest. 

3 I do have a letter from Aviva confirming the figure on the day they closed my late husband’s ISA and transferred the funds to me. I’ve explained this to NatWest and offered them a copy of the letter, but they insist they need the information directly from Aviva. NatWest claim they’ve contacted Avivia multiple times. Aviva have told me they’ve not heard from NatWest. 

dunstonh

I’ve found that my NatWest investments have worked well for me. The fees are significantly lower than what my husband was paying with a wealth management firm and my ISA always seemed to do better than hi

In reality, you lack of experience with alternatives.   So, you don't know what else is out there to compare against.

And in respect of fees, the one I took over and moved ended up cheaper without the ongoing adviser charge but better returns after charges by some margin.  So, you need to look at the overall solution and not one bit in isolation.

As a NatWest Premier customer I could never understand why my husband was paying such high fees to get essentially the same service I was for a fraction of the cost. 

Cost is just one bit (as mentioned above). Plus, yours wasn't personalised or had a personal service, whereas he did. In scenarios like this, you are finding the non-personalised service to be rubbish, whereas a personalised service would have sorted it.

He only ended up using the wealth management company in the first place because his parents use it and it’s owned by a friend of theirs.  

Wealth management doesn't have a proper definition.  Some of the expensive salesforces call themselves wealth management and they should be avoided.   However, some low-cost IFAs use that tagline and are very good value.

xylophone

I’ve not transferred any of the money into the Cash ISA because I’ve already hit the £20k ISA limit for this tax year so I need the APS allowance before I can add my late husband’s money. 

The difficulties being placed in your way are hard to understand - Natwest is perfectly well aware  that the APS is an allowance

https://supportcentre.natwest.com/Searchable/913257282/What-is-the-ISA-inheritance-allowance.htm

What is the ISA inheritance allowance?

From 6th April 2015, a bereaved spouse or civil partner of anyone who died from 3rd December 2014 onwards, can apply to receive an additional ISA allowance up to the value of the deceased's ISA savings at the time of death. This is called Additional Permitted Subscription (APS).

Please note: this is not inheriting the actual money in the ISA. It is inheriting an allowance equal to the balance (including all interest) on the date of death.

Instructions to ISA managers here

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/manage-additional-permitted-subscriptions-into-an-isa

Has the old manager provided you or Natwest with an APS eligibility declaration? Could this be the source of the problem?

pjs493

xylophone said:

I’ve found that my NatWest investments have worked well for me. The fees are significantly lower than what my husband was paying with a wealth management firm and my ISA always seemed to do better than his. I also have JISAs for our children with NatWest.

But have been you paying more than you need to be through Natwest?  Did you or your FA (is this an Independent FA) ever check/make comparisons?

Re JISA

https://www.natwest.com/investments/junior-isa.html?extcam=N_PPCB_GGL_INV_BAUQ42022_0_0_{​keyword}​_Search&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1oPCocyAhQMVXwt7Bx1CYw-gEAAYAiAAEgKwCfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Compare Fidelity or Hargreaves Lansdown JISA

As for stocks and shares isa 

https://moneytothemasses.com/saving-for-your-future/investing/the-best-stocks-and-shares-investment-isa-the-cheapest-fund-platform

I did my own research admittedly and really only compared between what high street banks had to offer and what my husband was paying with a small wealth management firm. Compared to what my husband was paying in fees I’m paying pennies and my money (and the JISAs I’ve got for the children) have seen good growth. Much better growth than what my husband got with someone actively managing his money for him. 

His financial advisor did try to encourage me to use the firm during my husband’s annual meetings, but I never really saw the point and actually tried to convince my husband to move away from the firm because of how much he was paying them to get less of a return than what I was seeing with my NatWest investments. Even since his death the financial advisor had tried to bring me on board to manage the ring-fenced private pension I inherited from my husband. He wants a £1500 admin fee just to bring me on as a client, and then really high quarterly fees to manage the pension for the next 25 years when I reach retirement age. But that’s another story. I’m still looking for a provider that can look after that money for me, I’m also still waiting to find out if NatWest can look after that money for me. Obviously I could withdraw it and pay it into my own private pension, but then I’d lose the tax-free element when I come to use it in retirement. 

We did you joint banking through NatWest so it seemed the easiest way to keep everything in one place and track everything. 

I’m sure I could get better deals elsewhere, but with the death of my husband, and having my hands full with two small children, I haven’t really had the breathing space to reassess following my husband’s unexpected death. It’s something for me to do once things settle down a bit. 

Even when I set up savings accounts and JISAs for the children when they were newborn babies, it was just easier at the time to stick with NatWest when we were in the throes of dealing with newborn babies.