Mum wants to gift her house to me

paul2louise

Ok I have actually spoken to mum and she is planning on adding me to the property ownership not gifting the whole house. She just wants me to be joint owner. Is that is ok or is she still doing something wrong.
 I am.sorry that I caused such a fuss I was just asking a question and was quite upset at some of the replies. I would never want her in a care home that is poor standard or see her without enough money to live on. I just came on here and asked a question after her mentioning it to me as I knew nothing about it. Nor do I expect someone else to have to pay for her. So please no more. 

SVaz

You BOTH need to fully understand the potential implications of doing this.
Such as, is the house over the IHT limit?  

Are you aware that you would be liable for CGT when the house is sold as it’s not your home?  

Stay well away from companies charging to make useless property trusts, they arent worth the paper they’re written on , in your situation anyway. 
You have to explain to her that if she needed care,  what she wants to do won’t work and could result in you being taken to court.   You don’t live with her so there is literally no reason  to be a joint owner of her house unless you had a financial interest. 

Mojisola

paul2louise said:

I have actually spoken to mum and she is planning on adding me to the property ownership not gifting the whole house. She just wants me to be joint owner. Is that is ok or is she still doing something wrong.

Although I can understand her wishes to make sure that you inherit something from her, there are many reasons why it's a bad idea.

Would it help if you pointed out that it's more important to you that she will be well-cared for if she needs residential care (and it's only a small percentage of people who do) than having all the complications that part ownership could bring?

Far more important than the house ownership is getting power of attorney done if she hasn't already.

thegreenone

paul2louise said:

Ok I have actually spoken to mum and she is planning on adding me to the property ownership not gifting the whole house. She just wants me to be joint owner. Is that is ok or is she still doing something wrong.
 I am.sorry that I caused such a fuss I was just asking a question and was quite upset at some of the replies. I would never want her in a care home that is poor standard or see her without enough money to live on. I just came on here and asked a question after her mentioning it to me as I knew nothing about it. Nor do I expect someone else to have to pay for her. So please no more. 

Yes, some of the answers have been brutal but for a reason.  Even 50% could get very complicated.  

My late Mum was very financially savvy and owned her own flat.  Her physical health was failing at 89 but her mental health was tip-top.  Memory better than mine!  At her suggestion, many years ago we set up a joint account with my bank so that should she need care or any assistance or to pay for her funeral, I could pay for it with her money.  She alone paid money into that account over a number of years.  I had access from my online banking to the account and would regularly give her print outs so she could keep her records up to date. Edited to add: Mum had updated her Will in Jan 2020 and applied for LPA for me.  The LPA came through just before she died.

During Covid I used the money to buy her shopping.  When she had her fall in May 2020, fracturing her left leg in two places and resulting in a long hospital stay, I was able to use the account to pay her bills.  When she died in a care home in Nov 2020, I was able to pay for her funeral from that account and continue to pay her bills until the flat was sold in Oct 2021.  She was in a council care home for her last three months, which was okay (post Covid government initiative paid for it), but sadly she was too ill to be moved to somewhere better.

What I'm trying to say is, there are simpler ways of doing things.  

theoretica

There is also the issue that the councils and government keep catching up with loopholes and shutting them - things that used to work don't any more!

sheramber

If you had to sell the house to avoid her being in a poor care home you would pay CGT on your share so there would be less money available to support her.

For council care  she would be allocated a space in whatever care home had availability, which might be some distance away. 

paul2louise

The house is a bungalow worth less than 300k, similar property with more work done it on is on the market for £280k. 

Sea_Shell

paul2louise said:

The house is a bungalow worth less than 300k, similar property with more work done it on is on the market for £280k. 

To be honest, all the more reason NOT to fiddle around with ownership.   50% of a much bigger (more expensive) house, would stand less chance of being exceeded by care costs.

 

Does she have much cash savings?

Sea_Shell

Exodi said:

I just find these types of threads very hard to comment on, my last warning was given in a similar thread.

There's certainly a sense of irony asking taxpayers (by and large) what the best way is to ensure that taxpayers pay for their parents care, instead of them.

In my opinion these types of threads which are unequivocally asking for advice on how to deprive oneself of assets to avoid paying for care should not even be allowed on MSE, there's no ambiguity in the intention.

You don't get people asking for advice on robbing banks here, we shouldn't allow people to ask for advice on robbing taxpayers.

But that's just my opinion. I know this sort of practice is regrettably common, e.g.:

njkmr said:

But there are ways around it.
We did it with my mothers house.
It used to be so many years elapsing before it became safely transferred (7 or 11 years i think ) but im not sure of the exact details now.
Others may advise.

We simultaneously wonder why we have a social care problem in this country.

On the contrary, I think these threads should be allowed, so that more people are aware of the issue and that deliberate DOA will not work.   

It would be a good topic for one of Martin's shows IMO.    So as to "spread the word".   @MSE_Kelvin  @MSE_James
 

Unfortunately, it is a subject that can get peoples heckles up (on both sides), and answers can be....blunt, but are mostly just trying to get a point across, in no uncertain terms.

RAS

OP, does your mum understand that if

you die before her
you need care yourself
you have to apply for means-tested benefits
you divorce
you go bankrupt

your part-ownership of the house could become very problematic. It's not anything you intend or expect, but none of us expect to divorce, have a stroke etc

She's not in IHT territory, her house would fund 5-6 years of care at current rates and the average care home stay is half that. Not guaranteed as the eldest person l know has exceeded that.

The other big advantage with self funding is that you get to choose where mum stays. The council wanted mine to go into a very cheap one near where she lived because her care package (for which she paid) cost more. We refused because she lived hundreds of miles away and eventually moved her closer to family.