Power Of Attorney: spouses rights?

phonek

Trying to work out if doing a LPA (Lasting Power of Attorney) is worth doing for myself+wife.

Background: Recently did LPAs (financial & health ones) with my sister without a solicitor as Attorneys for my elderly mother (who is actually fully compos mentis as this time, hence able to do!), so know what they are. But am uncertain of the worth of doing one for me & wife in our late-40s with one 10yo child. 

I know Martin Lewis has been broadcasting about how he+wife have them, and how they may be important for many people at similar age. But some questions remain unclear... 

Points: 

What rights exactly does a a spouse actually have if partner incapacitated? 
eg. We have our own personal bank ac's with a shared ac for bills (eg. mortgage). If one of us is incapacitated, can the other spouse do anything on the other's personal ac? 

Are there any other things that are pertinent here that I haven't thought about? 

I'd greatly appreciate others information here.
(yes I know how expensive Court of Protection is, but am after others thoughts on the costs vs. benefits analysis of doing an LPA is what I'm after, as doing even the latter can cost hundreds too). 

Keep_pedalling

Without an LPA in place a spouse will be able to do nothing with those sole accounts.

sheramber

No, a  spouse cannot access your personal account.

Nor can they make any enquiries about any services/ bills in your name. 

A POA can be done online without costing hundreds. 

https://www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney/make-lasting-power

you also should make wills which include appointing a guardian to look after your child in the event you both die. 

phonek

Keep_pedalling said:

Without an LPA in place a spouse will be able to do nothing with those sole accounts.

sheramber said:

A POA can be done online without costing hundreds. 

https://www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney/make-lasting-power

you also should make wills which include appointing a guardian to look after your child in the event you both die. 

Thanks for responses. That matches my thoughts re. personal ac's vs. shared ones.

Yes, previously used the Gov.uk website for my mother's LPAs, due to her affairs being relatively simple. But we're considering a solicitor might be better (though more costly, obvs) for me and my wife, to take advise at same time. 

Do solicitors often offer deals for doing (mirrored) Wills+LPAs? 

I presume if your child is under the age of majority (18, or maybe you might decide 21 or 23 might be better!), most people set family members/friends as Attorney until then, then (if they want to, potentially) redo the LPAs at that time to make their children at least one of the Attorneys – is that typical practice (presuming your grown children aren't a nightmare then!)? 

Any other considerations...? 

elsien

A spouse also can’t make decisions around health care treatment and where the person lives without a health and welfare power-of-attorney.
People have this idea that being next of kin confers some sort of special status on them, but next of kin has no legal meaning and is really just a point of contact. Without a health welfare, power-of-attorney spouse/family would be consulted but they would not be the ultimate decision maker.

phonek

elsien said:

Without a health welfare, power-of-attorney spouse/family would be consulted but they would not be the ultimate decision maker.

So who would be then?? (if no health LPA)

EnPointe

phonek said:

elsien said:

Without a health welfare, power-of-attorney spouse/family would be consulted but they would not be the ultimate decision maker.

So who would be then?? (if no health LPA)

  A best interests decision would be made by   the   responsible clinicans  or if it was contentious a court order sought 

elsien

 It depends on the decision.
If it was a medical decision, it would be the doctor taking your views into account. Unless there was a living will in place.

 If it was an accommodation decision, then it would be health or the local authority, unless the person was self funding, in which case it would probably slide under the radar until the money ran out. 

And in the case of serious disputes, ultimately the court of protection.

But the reality is there is no legal authority without the power-of-attorney.

https://www.gnlaw.co.uk/news/health-and-welfare-lpa/

phonek

Interesting, re. health incapacity... 

But unless the ill person has specific dislikes regarding care (eg. cancer patients not wanting future care near end of life) how would having a health LPA improve your decision rights (as the spouse) compared to clinicians decisions? [can of worms opened!]

elsien

If I am in a car accident where I am left cognitively and physically impaired with what to me is no quality of life, I would not want the doctors to give me a PEG feed keep me alive to just lie in a chair for years in a care home. For example.

My power-of-attorney would give my representative consent for me not to be resuscitated if that was a likely outcome. Or to decline antibiotics if I got a chest infection.
And this is an example of how I absolutely would not want to live,

Doctors wouldn’t let my sister die https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-42627210

For lesser medical decisions, there are always options - mastectomy versus hormone medication. Do you get your cataract treated or leave them? What about the Covid vaccination that some people are very suspicious about? 

And if there’s a choice between where I live, do I stay at home? Do I look at housing with care do I go into residential care and if so, which one? Big place or little place? Which family member is it going to be closest to?  What if there decisions to be made about what I eat, or what I have in my bedroom, or who can visit me? Some of them are very small decisions that can still have a big impact on the person so who would you want to make those decisions for you?

phonek

So if spouse (with general health LPA decision rights) of (for arguments sake) 'brain dead' partner effectively said turn on/off life support; dr's would have to do as spouse said, rather than the dr's being able to make the final decision? 

elsien said:

And if there’s a choice between where I live, do I stay at home? Do I look at housing with care do I go into residential care and if so, which one? Big place or little place? Which family member is it going to be closest to?  What if there decisions to be made about what I eat, or what I have in my bedroom, or who can visit me? Some of them are very small decisions that can still have a big impact on the person so who would you want to make those decisions for you?

Yeah sure, but would a spouse having decisions authority via a health LPA be the deciding factor in all (most) of such situations?