Protect our assets

KxMx

SVaz said:

The care burden and the State pension burden will only grow over the next decade and beyond,  it was only designed to provide for 5% of the population , over 70’s will soon be 20%,  it’s simply not sustainable.
I don’t want the younger generations to have to shoulder the huge tax burden of caring for those who think that because they’ve paid a pittance (in real terms) into the system, they get to keep their half million pound plus houses instead of funding their own care.  It’s a disgusting and entitled attitude.
I’ll be happy to fund my own care from my own modest house and pensions if I need to.   Of course I’d rather it go to my Daughter and Grandson but in my eyes it’s akin to fraud to put your assets in trusts instead of using them for your own benefit. 

The sooner such trusts and avoidance schemes are made illegal, the better in my opinion.

It's also a contradicting attitude - those proud of working hard and paying their own way for decades, suddenly turn around and expect current taxpayers to fund any care they need once they hit older age. 

Newly_retired

So in short, the best advice so far seems to be to sell the cheaper property and gift that money to your children now to make sure they get something.  But if one of you has to go into care, and the other is living in the remaining property, its value won't be taken into consideration, so you are back to relying on whatever the local authority can fund. Except that they will consider giving the other property away as Deprivation of Assets. When your spouse has died, the house will be taken into consideration at that point.
The so-called trusts that firms claim to set up to avoid care home fees do not work. It is still Deprivation of Assets. There is no time limit, though the LA does have to show that you did it in order to avoid care costs for which this thread is evidence. No judgement, just facts.

Brie

Newly_retired said:

So in short, the best advice so far seems to be to sell the cheaper property and gift that money to your children now to make sure they get something.  But if one of you has to go into care, and the other is living in the remaining property, its value won't be taken into consideration, so you are back to relying on whatever the local authority can fund. Except that they will consider giving the other property away as Deprivation of Assets. When your spouse has died, the house will be taken into consideration at that point.
The so-called trusts that firms claim to set up to avoid care home fees do not work. It is still Deprivation of Assets. There is no time limit, though the LA does have to show that you did it in order to avoid care costs for which this thread is evidence. No judgement, just facts.

Yes but I think that if the LA does say it's DoA then they will simply put a lien on the house that the one spouse is still living in until they go into care or sell it for whatever reason.  It will only become an issue for the children if the care costs exceed the value of the remaining property.  

Mojisola

Brie said

Yes but I think that if the LA does say it's DoA then they will simply put a lien on the house that the one spouse is still living in until they go into care or sell it for whatever reason.  It will only become an issue for the children if the care costs exceed the value of the remaining property.  

What usually happens if it is decided that a person is self-funding is the council have nothing more to do with the case.  It would be up to the family how any care would be funded.

bobster2

Mojisola said:

Brie said

Yes but I think that if the LA does say it's DoA then they will simply put a lien on the house that the one spouse is still living in until they go into care or sell it for whatever reason.  It will only become an issue for the children if the care costs exceed the value of the remaining property.  

What usually happens if it is decided that a person is self-funding is the council have nothing more to do with the case.  It would be up to the family how any care would be funded.

I have found that even when you tell them that the person going into care will be self-funding - the LA still tries to get you to complete a financial assessment. I assume in preparation for a time when funds might run out - so they have a record of what the person had (so they can keep an eye on possible DoA).

Pollycat

bobster2 said:

Mojisola said:

Brie said

Yes but I think that if the LA does say it's DoA then they will simply put a lien on the house that the one spouse is still living in until they go into care or sell it for whatever reason.  It will only become an issue for the children if the care costs exceed the value of the remaining property.  

What usually happens if it is decided that a person is self-funding is the council have nothing more to do with the case.  It would be up to the family how any care would be funded.

I have found that even when you tell them that the person going into care will be self-funding - the LA still tries to get you to complete a financial assessment. I assume in preparation for a time when funds might run out - so they have a record of what the person had (so they can keep an eye on possible DoA).

My Dad spent a brief few months in a care home before he died.
He was self-funding.
County Council came to their home do a financial assessment where we split his & Mum's income/assets.

km1500

silly question but what happens if the person in self funding care home refuses to disclose financial.info.ie refuses to cooperate

bobster2

km1500 said:

silly question but what happens if the person in self funding care home refuses to disclose financial.info.ie refuses to cooperate

While you're self-funding - not much happens. They just pester you (or relatives) to complete a financial assessment.

They can only compel you to complete one at the point when you're asking for LA funding.

Mojisola

bobster2 said:

Mojisola said:

What usually happens if it is decided that a person is self-funding is the council have nothing more to do with the case.  It would be up to the family how any care would be funded.

I have found that even when you tell them that the person going into care will be self-funding - the LA still tries to get you to complete a financial assessment. I assume in preparation for a time when funds might run out - so they have a record of what the person had (so they can keep an eye on possible DoA).

The decision that a person is self-funding is taken after the financial assessment is done.

Mojisola

km1500 said:

silly question but what happens if the person in self funding care home refuses to disclose financial.info.ie refuses to cooperate

If everything is arranged privately, there's no reason for the council to have any input.

Dad needed a deferred payment scheme to be arranged and so we had to go through the process.

If his funds had been available immediately, we wouldn't have involved them - just made the arrangements ourselves.  

They are so overloaded with cases, I can't see ours would have gone out their way to ask about Dad's personal finances if we had done so.

If the money starts to run down, it's up to the person managing the money to get in touch with the council well before the limits are reached as it takes quite a while for the case to progress through the system.