NHS free dental treatment expensive mistake

baz8755

Even though I thoroughly explained the circumstances and they sympathised the complaints department have still ruled that I must pay the £100 penalty. Stating it was my responsibility to know what I could claim for, I'd have been better off talking to a robot.

_Jem_

I suppose I can see in what they are saying its up to you to find out. But if ESA isn't clear then I would suggest contacting complaints for ESA as that's the only thing left to do.

Kenzone_62

Same thing happy to me today £100 fine ESA. Confusing letter ,I even phoned DWP before treatment asking if I was entitled and was told yes .and now fine spent 45 minutes trying to get through both times very unhelpful and sound like there reading a rehearsed script.Another Broken Government Department.
Took me 2 years for them to sort my National insurance out .Broken Britain 

baz8755

Kenzone_62 said:

Same thing happy to me today £100 fine ESA. Confusing letter ,I even phoned DWP before treatment asking if I was entitled and was told yes .and now fine spent 45 minutes trying to get through both times very unhelpful and sound like there reading a rehearsed script.Another Broken Government Department.
Took me 2 years for them to sort my National insurance out .Broken Britain 

Unfortunately I ended up paying the fine even though I escalated my complaint and explained how it occurred and was an honest mistake. It seems that common sense,reasoning, logic and compassion is something the NHS is lacking in this department. I am sure they get a lot of people making the same mistake with the multiple ESA types and probably just treat it as a cash cow catching unsuspecting members of the public who can ill afford to pay the fine (otherwise why would they be on this meagre benefit). Any other organisation would either have a more robust and understanding appeals procedure or at the very least have reduced fines for early payment. As such anyone making an honest mistake is treated in exactly the same manor as someone who is intentionally trying to deceive the system.

Danien

Maybe take this up with your MP, making these arguments and lobby for either the DWP letter to be changed or for dentists/opticians to need to be more specific when asking the question. I recently went to optician and had to provide rhe letter itself in order to get NHS voucher. I don’t know why dentists don't request you bring benefit letters with you to appointment- it would be a simple change and put the onus on them.

kaMelo

Danien said:

Maybe take this up with your MP, making these arguments and lobby for either the DWP letter to be changed or for dentists/opticians to need to be more specific when asking the question. I recently went to optician and had to provide rhe letter itself in order to get NHS voucher. I don’t know why dentists don't request you bring benefit letters with you to appointment- it would be a simple change and put the onus on them.

 Dentists and their staff are not benefit advisors and highly unlikely to want to be, why on earth would they agree to such a change? 
The bottom line is that people who claim a benefit are ultimately responsible for knowing what benefit they are claiming and whether or not this qualifies them for other things such as free prescriptions or dental treatment. You cannot offload that responsibility to someone else.

Spoonie_Turtle

Danien said:

Maybe take this up with your MP, making these arguments and lobby for either the DWP letter to be changed or for dentists/opticians to need to be more specific when asking the question. I recently went to optician and had to provide rhe letter itself in order to get NHS voucher. I don’t know why dentists don't request you bring benefit letters with you to appointment- it would be a simple change and put the onus on them.

The form itself already specifies income-based, and explicitly says contributions-based doesn't count.  (Incidentally the same as the form for prescriptions.)

ESA letters are notoriously confusing, granted, but that's entirely on DWP for not bothering to make them clearer.

Dentists are already struggling enough with NHS contracts making it impossible to stay in business*, they really don't need any extra responsibility foisted on them just because another government department is apparently too incompetent to have different letter wordings for different benefits.

*Not an exaggeration, the members on the forum who are dentists have explained numerous times that remuneration for NHS treatment is well below cost.

sheramber

Dental receptionists may know less about benefits than the person claiming the benefit.

They may not know there are income based and contribution based or what each means.

That will not b epart of their training. 

Danien

kaMelo said:

Danien said:

Maybe take this up with your MP, making these arguments and lobby for either the DWP letter to be changed or for dentists/opticians to need to be more specific when asking the question. I recently went to optician and had to provide rhe letter itself in order to get NHS voucher. I don’t know why dentists don't request you bring benefit letters with you to appointment- it would be a simple change and put the onus on them.

 Dentists and their staff are not benefit advisors and highly unlikely to want to be, why on earth would they agree to such a change? 
The bottom line is that people who claim a benefit are ultimately responsible for knowing what benefit they are claiming and whether or not this qualifies them for other things such as free prescriptions or dental treatment. You cannot offload that responsibility to someone else.

No. I was saying the DWP letters should be more specific about what is being awarded and what that entitles them to and doesn't and to keep the letter to provide when seeking treatment. Dentists and opticians should then have to request the letter as proof. No onus on anyone to be a 'benefit adviser'. And knowing that esa and jsa come in two different types hardly requires intensive training - just a simple conversation with the receptionist staff to be aware and require proof of which one. A simple change of process - my optician receptionist manages it, are dentist receptionists unable to retain a single sentence of information?

Person phones up for dentist appointment - receptionist process requires them to ask if they require NHS treatment to provide proof they are on an income based benefit, and if unsure for client to check with DWP. 

DWP would soon update letter for clarification, if they got constant calls checking.

kaMelo

Danien said:

kaMelo said:

Danien said:

Maybe take this up with your MP, making these arguments and lobby for either the DWP letter to be changed or for dentists/opticians to need to be more specific when asking the question. I recently went to optician and had to provide rhe letter itself in order to get NHS voucher. I don’t know why dentists don't request you bring benefit letters with you to appointment- it would be a simple change and put the onus on them.

 Dentists and their staff are not benefit advisors and highly unlikely to want to be, why on earth would they agree to such a change? 
The bottom line is that people who claim a benefit are ultimately responsible for knowing what benefit they are claiming and whether or not this qualifies them for other things such as free prescriptions or dental treatment. You cannot offload that responsibility to someone else.

No. I was saying the DWP letters should be more specific about what is being awarded and what that entitles them to and doesn't and to keep the letter to provide when seeking treatment. Dentists and opticians should then have to request the letter as proof. No onus on anyone to be a 'benefit adviser'. And knowing that esa and jsa come in two different types hardly requires intensive training - just a simple conversation with the receptionist staff to be aware and require proof of which one. A simple change of process - my optician receptionist manages it, are dentist receptionists unable to retain a single sentence of information?

Person phones up for dentist appointment - receptionist process requires them to ask if they require NHS treatment to provide proof they are on an income based benefit, and if unsure for client to check with DWP. 

DWP would soon update letter for clarification, if they got constant calls checking.

But it isn't just a simple conversation, by asking for proof they qualify and, to quote your previous post, "putting the onus on them" (make the dentist responsible for any mistakes) makes them gatekeepers to the system which would require training for the dentist and all their staff. Again I ask, why would any dentist agree to such a proposal?  

I'd agree sometimes benefit letters are less than clear but that doesn't negate the responsibility of a claimant to know what benefits they're claiming and what, if any, extra help they qualify for and if they're unsure then they should clarification
You cannot offload that responsibility onto someone else