Pension Credit - when to notify of 'excess' savings

scottleag

As it draws closer to the expiry of the first disregard in early December I find this preying on my mind more and more. I'm not sure if my original idea of informing the DWP shortly before this is a good one or whether I should let them know earlier so they can put in motion the necessary changes. And while I was confident before I could submit figures for food, clothing, travel etc now I'm not so sure. I mean would just a weekly shop be the right thing to quantify or would it be permissible to eat out a couple of times per month? In fact how much would the DWP expect a couple to spend on food? Would going to the cinema, sports events or theatre for example be classed as capital deprivation as it isn't necessary expenditure. It would be per your mention of treats Newcad. Acceptable or not? TV subscriptions? We have a few of those, though far from everything on offer. How many is too many?  Internet and mobile phones are a necessity these days but is that regarded as excess expenditure? Clothes? We don't spend a great deal and we don't have a monthly budget for clothing, we just buy as and when needed/appropriate. 

Travel? Neither of us drives so everything is by public transport or taxis. We have bus passes and disabled persons railcards but we do use more taxis than previously. Does that count as excessive, getting a taxi when there's a bus half an hour later? Bearing in mind we both receive mobility PIP I'd say getting a taxi was exactly the kind of thing PIP is intended for. 

Holidays? While we are nowhere near as mobile as a few years ago, after almost three years cooped up first due to Covid then illness we want to get away when we get the chance. Hotels now are asking three times as much as they were pre-pandemic so that looks like a big expense too. We don't stay at fancy top of the range places but we do book somewhere decent and we NEED somewhere decent on account of our disabilities. How often would be regarded as permissible? Four weeks per year as it would be if we were still working? Getting away is good for our mental health too. Would the DWP recognise that?

Visiting family? My wife's closest relations are 150 miles away. My son is incapable of travelling due to his own disabilities. He lives 450 miles away. Obviously visits to see him are expensive affairs. How often am I 'allowed' to do this and do I need to keep train tickets and hotel receipts? Or would showing bank transactions be enough?

Then there's the question of proving an expenditure was necessary. Our nine years old TV went on the blink last week so we bought a new one. Inexpensive, same size and manufacture as old one. But how is it possible to prove it was bought as a replacement for an old set that had given up the ghost and not 'capital deprivation.' Same happened with my wife's computer a few months back. Unrepairable so a new one was needed and that WAS an expensive business.  If say the cooker or washing machine were to conk out then the same question arises. 

Possibly I'm worrying too much but all these questions (and others) are increasingly occupying my mind and it's getting more and more confusing. 

Alice_Holt

None of the above (IMO) would ever be likely to be classed as deprivation of capital by the DWP.

You are worrying too much. 

Newcad

Alice is right, you are worrying too much. (Can I say again? )

We totally understand that.

But everything you said above would be regarded as reasonable, everyday, spending that anyone would do whether on benefits or not.

One of the things to remember about 'Deprivation of Capital/savings' is that it must be spending that is done to deliberately entitle you to get more in benefits than would otherwise be the case.

None of the above would be regarded as being done to deliberately for benefits purposes. It's all just how people live their normal lives.

As for any change when a disregard ends - the DWP don't want to know about any change until it has actually happened. And as it is a benefits disregard then it is entirely their change so they already know about it and you don't need to tell them.

Spoonie_Turtle

Newcad said:

And as it is a benefits disregard then it is entirely their change so they already know about it and you don't need to tell them.

I wouldn't rely on different departments of DWP talking to each other like that, that would be far too sensible and joined-up making life easier for claimants(!).  I'd assume the OP should still tell them, just to make sure.

(Agree with all the rest of your comment though.)

scottleag

Yes, Nuke, you can say again. I thought long and hard about my last post and if I was being paranoid about it. Thanks to you, Alice and Spoonie for responding, I think I'm going to go with Spoonie_Turtle's last point. I'm thinking of writing to them one month before the expiry of the first disregard, attaching current and savings account balances as of that date, giving the dates when the disregards expire and what the level of permitted savings are at each stage until reaching £10K after the final one ends and basically saying 'over to you.'

Newcad

No problem with doing that, and it is covering yourself - but don't be too surprised if they get back to you saying something like "tell us again after it has happened".

As an example I'm in social housing and we get a letter every March saying how much our rent will go up on April 1st. The DWP don't want to know. and if you try to tell them won't even accept it, until after it has actually gone up.

HillStreetBlues

@scottleag
Being on PC you should have had the Cost Of Living payments, just in case you didn't know (or I missed it somewhere) all theses payments are ignored and do not count towards any capital.

scottleag

Newcad said:

No problem with doing that, and it is covering yourself - but don't be too surprised if they get back to you saying something like "tell us again after it has happened".

That's exactly what I fear might happen. Having to tell them four times over the course of seven weeks as the disregards expire. That's why I thought giving them the heads up might give them some time to adjust payments.

scottleag

HillStreetBlues said:

@scottleag
Being on PC you should have had the Cost Of Living payments, just in case you didn't know (or I missed it somewhere) all theses payments are ignored and do not count towards any capital.

Yes, thanks. Haven't had the second one yet but did receive the others. There's also the winter fuel payment which I assume is the same, i.e. not counted as capital

Spoonie_Turtle

scottleag said:

Newcad said:

No problem with doing that, and it is covering yourself - but don't be too surprised if they get back to you saying something like "tell us again after it has happened".

That's exactly what I fear might happen. Having to tell them four times over the course of seven weeks as the disregards expire. That's why I thought giving them the heads up might give them some time to adjust payments.

Maybe get your letters and paperwork in order, send each letter in the week before, and phone on the specific day to tell them and that the paperwork/letter is in the post? 

If they're like other departments then decision makers won't make decisions on things until they've already happened, and while in the worst case scenario you might end up with small overpayments if they take too long to sort out the new payments, it shouldn't be too bad.