No longer eligible for ESA (Contribution based - support group)

AdamPD

NedS said:

AdamPD said:

No change in circumstances, no, I'm working on a very part time basis bringing in around £300-£400 a month, I'm on a zero hours contract so the income varies quite a bit, but rarely higher than £400ish.

That income shows up each month in my UC panel, but has only affected my benefit entitlement once (I believe it was December/January) where I went over the max earnings for one month and the benefit for UC at least was £0 for one month.

I did fill out the permission for permitted work form when I first applied for ESA

For your UC to have been £0 in that one month, you must have earned in excess of the permitted work allowance on ESA. Could that have been the reason they have closed your ESA claim?

CAB say that your ESA will stop and you would need to re-apply if you exceed your permitted work:

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/employment-and-support-allowance/while-youre-getting-esa/working-while-getting-esa/

Yea, that would make sense wouldn't it?
I didn't consider that right away as she said it was due to a lack of NI contributions.

Jyana

I have to admit that I am not confident enough to advise when it comes to PAYE and new style ESA. It may be that they mean NI but depending on when you sent in your P60 to HMRC and they processed it, or the £0 month you mentioned, it may even be a tax thing and the advisor is mixed up themself. 

I think you are going to have to contact them and get more information on the situation to see what exactly has happened I'm afraid. 

AdamPD

Still waiting for a response from the UC journal system.
Taking a while it seems.

NedS

AdamPD said:

Still waiting for a response from the UC journal system.
Taking a while it seems.

On the ESA system (Opstrat), they should have entered a reason for the claim closure when closing the claim, however most UC staff would not have access to this which would explain why they are unable to answer you. The ESA phone line should be able to tell you why your claim was closed, or if not they should be able to arrange a callback from someone who can. Alternatively, wander into your local Jobcentre and ask - they can look your ESA claim up on the system and tell you the reason for closure.

AdamPD

Thanks for the info Ned,yea I didn't query why my ESA claim was closed, I asked them if my record would be automatically updated on UC to take into account I no longer have the ESA money coming in.
I assume it's automatic? But you never know with the DWP.
Still no response to that, or my query about SMI from 5 days ago now.

AdamPD

Got a UC notification email today, still no reply to my two journal entries, but I got the usual "Other benefits affecting your Universal Credit" note, which says:

"Some benefits can affect how much Universal Credit you receive. Our records show that you are not getting any of these benefits."

That was a big relief, but then I checked my September statement which shows:

As this is an average of other benefits that you're continuing to claim

Employment and Support Allowance minus‑ £561.17

Urgh, so I called up UC, the CS rep noted I hadn't received any replies and had escalated the case to my case manager, saying i'll get a reply before 6pm tomorrow
But I need to call ESA to ask them to close the ESA claim, which sounds odd, as they ended that claim as per my original post back in July
So I'm on hold now for the ESA line for around 35 minutes so far.

AdamPD

So I called up ESA, explained that I needed the claim closing down completely as it was interfering with UC, I said the claim ended on the 27th of July this year but I didn't find out until I noticed payments had stopped in August.

The lady informed me the claim had already been closed, but back in June of 2022.

She was really confused, she said she's never seen an "overpayment" going on over a year after the claim was closed.

I asked if that meant the money had to be paid back, as the previous person I spoke to said it was a mistake on their end, not mine, she didn't know if it would or not.
Sure hope not, that's a lot of money over 13ish months and the money had been deducted from my UC from that period anyways, so it's not really an overpayment.

She's emailed the DWP and UC team about it. Joy.

Newcad

You really need to find out just why they say that the ESA was closed (on whatever date).

You need to know what they say was the exact reason for it being closed - because from what you say they are not even sure themselves. (They don't even seem to be sure what date it was closed).

AdamPD

Yea I'm about to fill out the form to get a written explanation, because I was told April of this year, due to lack of NI contributions, but now it's June of last year.

Alice_Holt

AdamPD said:

Yea I'm about to fill out the form to get a written explanation, because I was told April of this year, due to lack of NI contributions, but now it's June of last year.

         That lack of NI contributions explanation was nonsensical. 
       I'd thought it was established that ESA  stopped when you went over the permitted work limits? 
     
  These being:     

• work for less than 16 hours each week
• earn no more than £167.00 each week (23/24 tax year), after tax and National Insurance has been taken off
  
  For 22/23 the earnings limit was £152.   Did you exceed that in June of last year?
  
  
  If your UC payment for the next assessment is still being reduced by an assumed ESA payment, I'd be inclined to ask for a MR of the decision to reduce your UC payments. Back it up with any documentation from ESA confirming your actual ESA payments stopped in July, and a copy of bank statements evidencing this.
  
  I would have thought the immediate issue is to restore UC payments (and get them corrected) from when ESA payments actually stopped being paid.
  
  The confusion around ESA  and when it ended or not (but continued to be paid) is (IMO) less important than remedying the immediate UC underpayments.  Can ESA confirm in writing that your ESA payments ended on 27th July, and you then pass this onto UC / include in your MR?
  It would appear that getting a correct explanation out of ESA may be difficult with different dates / reasons / potential overpayments clouding the issue.
  If earning over the permitted work in July was the cause of the ESA payments ending, and you can show this via payslip / bank statement then I'd be inclined to do this on your UC journal / MR request in order to get your UC paid at the right level.