Help with wiring an Ikea light fitting

FFHillbilly

ashe said:

ThisIsWeird said:

The connector for the earths can be a physically separate single Wago if that's easier - it'll be just used to safely terminate the earth wires. But all three earth wires MUST be connected together.

Don't get the other ones mixed up...

Yes, that sleeve will be to give added protection to the cable, and likely add to the 'double' too. If you use the existing flex cable from the rose, you should find it slim and super-easy to thread through.

Connected together as in threaded into a single wago port, or just inside a wago? I figured if all 3 go inside a wago that would connect them to allow the earth to function?

Anyways I try and be prettty thorough, once I've got what I need from the store today I'll post a diagram before acting. 

you aren't supposed to put more than one conductor into a wago port. Wagos will connect all conductors together.
the one you have posted a picture of is a bit different it's more of a joint, it will connect blue to blue, brown to brown and yellow to yellow, but you still can't put more than one conductor in the individual ports

Risteard

ThisIsWeird said:

ashe said:

Ikea live chat have just confirmed that it is double insulated, although I've not yet received it as still our for delivery. Are you saying something about the installation would negate that somehow risteard?

No. You are good to go

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

These luminaries are supplied with a tiny box around the connectors for their Class II self-certification. You CANNOT have non-sheathed cores within the luminaire outside of this tiny connection point.

Please don't give advice if you don't understand the issues.

GDB2222

What the op needs is one of these, plus some wago connectors.

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/QFJB4.html?source=adwords&ad_position=&ad_id=&placement=&kw=&network=x&matchtype=&ad_type=pla&product_id=QFJB4&product_partition_id=&campaign=shopping_cable_accessories&version=finalurl_v3&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0IGnBhDUARIsAMwFDLktzmhagzBR3WKC1cvaNgjrv_exJYtO4lBhP15pATBjBxot_lGbPgwaAmDeEALw_wcB

Given No access from above, He will need to make a hole in the plasterboard ceiling big enough to push it through. That’s not ideal, as holes are meant to be kept as small as possible.  Maybe, you have a better way of doing it, @Risteard ?

ashe

GDB2222 said:

What the op needs is one of these, plus some wago connectors.

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/QFJB4.html?source=adwords&ad_position=&ad_id=&placement=&kw=&network=x&matchtype=&ad_type=pla&product_id=QFJB4&product_partition_id=&campaign=shopping_cable_accessories&version=finalurl_v3&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0IGnBhDUARIsAMwFDLktzmhagzBR3WKC1cvaNgjrv_exJYtO4lBhP15pATBjBxot_lGbPgwaAmDeEALw_wcB

Given No access from above, He will need to make a hole in the plasterboard ceiling big enough to push it through. That’s not ideal, as holes are meant to be kept as small as possible.  Maybe, you have a better way of doing it, @Risteard ?

I'm thinking to make as small a hole as possible and feed it up through. That, and then tape over said hole with duct tape to minimise any draft / dust issues.

i may try and use my multitool to cut out a small shape and then once this is fed back up through, file off a mm or so and just put some jointing compound round the gaps and replace the piece, it won't be seen as the light base is quite wide 

ashe

Risteard said:

ThisIsWeird said:

ashe said:

Ikea live chat have just confirmed that it is double insulated, although I've not yet received it as still our for delivery. Are you saying something about the installation would negate that somehow risteard?

No. You are good to go

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

These luminaries are supplied with a tiny box around the connectors for their Class II self-certification. You CANNOT have non-sheathed cores within the luminaire outside of this tiny connection point.

Please don't give advice if you don't understand the issues.

I had read this also however now the light has arrived it is definitely double insulated and the supplied sleeving tube from the connector box is quite long, and will easily fit some sheathed wire so I can feed some through that which would provide some additional protection, and run this to the junction box of choice. 

I bought a few today but the one posted above does look better 

ThisIsWeird

Risteard said:

ThisIsWeird said:

ashe said:

Ikea live chat have just confirmed that it is double insulated, although I've not yet received it as still our for delivery. Are you saying something about the installation would negate that somehow risteard?

No. You are good to go

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

These luminaries are supplied with a tiny box around the connectors for their Class II self-certification. You CANNOT have non-sheathed cores within the luminaire outside of this tiny connection point.

Please don't give advice if you don't understand the issues.

Tell us, Risteard, that this luminaire is not d-i'd, and that running the pendant flex through to that wee box is wrong.

ThisIsWeird

FFHillbilly said:

ashe said:

ThisIsWeird said:

The connector for the earths can be a physically separate single Wago if that's easier - it'll be just used to safely terminate the earth wires. But all three earth wires MUST be connected together.

Don't get the other ones mixed up...

Yes, that sleeve will be to give added protection to the cable, and likely add to the 'double' too. If you use the existing flex cable from the rose, you should find it slim and super-easy to thread through.

Connected together as in threaded into a single wago port, or just inside a wago? I figured if all 3 go inside a wago that would connect them to allow the earth to function?

Anyways I try and be prettty thorough, once I've got what I need from the store today I'll post a diagram before acting. 

you aren't supposed to put more than one conductor into a wago port. Wagos will connect all conductors together.
the one you have posted a picture of is a bit different it's more of a joint, it will connect blue to blue, brown to brown and yellow to yellow, but you still can't put more than one conductor in the individual ports

Good point, and thanks for the clarification.
A screw-down terminal would be ok for more than one conductor, but not as good in other ways. 
GDB's suggestion looks to be ultimate?

GDB2222

ThisIsWeird said:

FFHillbilly said:

ashe said:

ThisIsWeird said:

The connector for the earths can be a physically separate single Wago if that's easier - it'll be just used to safely terminate the earth wires. But all three earth wires MUST be connected together.

Don't get the other ones mixed up...

Yes, that sleeve will be to give added protection to the cable, and likely add to the 'double' too. If you use the existing flex cable from the rose, you should find it slim and super-easy to thread through.

Connected together as in threaded into a single wago port, or just inside a wago? I figured if all 3 go inside a wago that would connect them to allow the earth to function?

Anyways I try and be prettty thorough, once I've got what I need from the store today I'll post a diagram before acting. 

you aren't supposed to put more than one conductor into a wago port. Wagos will connect all conductors together.
the one you have posted a picture of is a bit different it's more of a joint, it will connect blue to blue, brown to brown and yellow to yellow, but you still can't put more than one conductor in the individual ports

Good point, and thanks for the clarification.
A screw-down terminal would be ok for more than one conductor, but not as good in other ways. 
GDB's suggestion looks to be ultimate?

If you hide the connector box away above the ceiling, it really ought to be "maintenance free". Wagos are classed as maintenance free, but screw terminals are not, as they can work loose.

Risteard

ThisIsWeird said:

Risteard said:

ThisIsWeird said:

ashe said:

Ikea live chat have just confirmed that it is double insulated, although I've not yet received it as still our for delivery. Are you saying something about the installation would negate that somehow risteard?

No. You are good to go

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

These luminaries are supplied with a tiny box around the connectors for their Class II self-certification. You CANNOT have non-sheathed cores within the luminaire outside of this tiny connection point.

Please don't give advice if you don't understand the issues.

Tell us, Risteard, that this luminaire is not d-i'd, and that running the pendant flex through to that wee box is wrong.

I didn't claim that it's not Class II - I pointed out that this is only if installed precisely as designed. This can only work using the supplied connection box if only one cable is brought into the luminaire and into that box. The existing pendant wiring cannot be inside the base of the luminaire.

There's a reason Electricians despise these fittings and want them banned - they simply aren't fit for purpose for UK-style wiring and are often connected up dangerously.

ThisIsWeird

Risteard said:

I didn't claim that it's not Class II - I pointed out that this is only if installed precisely as designed. This can only work using the supplied connection box if only one cable is brought into the luminaire and into that box. The existing pendant wiring cannot be inside the base of the luminaire.

There's a reason Electricians despise these fittings and want them banned - they simply aren't fit for purpose for UK-style wiring and are often connected up dangerously.

I'm confused. Where did I say there would be non-sheathed cores within the luminaire?
My suggestion was to use the existing pendant flex coming from the new JB in the ceiling, and that is what comes into the new light fitting.

Ah, I think I understand - you were agin the T&Es coming into the fitting and being junctioned there? My 'solution' employing the existing rose as the wiring terminal box, had it screwed to a joist above the ceiling, with only the pendant flex coming down through into the new Ikea light - that is surely ok?

If so, I see what you mean, and agree.