Supplier Failure - Advice re Supplier of Last Resort (SoLR) process not fit for purpose

Qyburn

PowerDev said:

Octopus did indeed end up as the SoLR for Neo Energy's Customers but that was not confirmed by OFGEM until Septermber 7 2022.  Charging Neo Customers for Energy from July 9. 

So, Octopus contacted you well before the SoLR process got going.  As OFGEM first have to first send a request to find out which Suppliers are prepared to act as SoLR for Neo customers and under what conditions.  Including a declaration as to whether they will or will not cover any shortfall in Customer credit with Neo, when they receive payment from Neo's assets to cover same.   

Is that a criticism or complement? The handover in that case went pretty smoothly. I don't understand the detail behind your comment "not confirmed by OFGEM until September 7 2022" but I suspect it's some form of nit picking over details that don't affect end users. OFGEM's statement dated 11th July 2022 is unambiguous in stating that Octopus had been appointed. 

PowerDev

Qyburn said:

PowerDev said:

Octopus did indeed end up as the SoLR for Neo Energy's Customers but that was not confirmed by OFGEM until Septermber 7 2022.  Charging Neo Customers for Energy from July 9. 

So, Octopus contacted you well before the SoLR process got going.  As OFGEM first have to first send a request to find out which Suppliers are prepared to act as SoLR for Neo customers and under what conditions.  Including a declaration as to whether they will or will not cover any shortfall in Customer credit with Neo, when they receive payment from Neo's assets to cover same.   

Is that a criticism or complement? The handover in that case went pretty smoothly. I don't understand the detail behind your comment "not confirmed by OFGEM until September 7 2022" but I suspect it's some form of nit picking over details that don't affect end users. OFGEM's statement dated 11th July 2022 is unambiguous in stating that Octopus had been appointed. 

A little more complicated than it appears . 

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 
https://www.neo-energy.co.uk/
So, a smooth termination with Neo still trading and paying out Domestic Customer Credit.

And then Neo ceased trading by 7 September 2022.   


 

Qyburn

PowerDev said:

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 

Glad you now agree. I didn't understand where you were coming from claiming Octopus had jumped the gun, but now you can see that wasn't the case.

PowerDev

Qyburn said:

PowerDev said:

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 

Glad you now agree. I didn't understand where you were coming from claiming Octopus had jumped the gun, but now you can see that wasn't the case.

Did Octopus inform you you could safely initiate a switch to any Supplier as at 11 July?  As at the time you did not need to be protected by SoLR because Neo were able and intending to pay you back your credit.  Which I assume they did, either directly or to a new supplier you did or could have voluntarily switched to.  I take it you read that Neo Energy website page I posted the link to.  When Neo did cease trading completely in September 2022 OFGEM did indeed appoint Octopus as SoLR.   

Octopus of course had knowledge of Neo's decision to stop supplying Domestic Customer as from July 9 and contacted you.  

This was a unique situation as it indicates Voluntary Switching after the event. 
Not the processes of either Voluntary switch before or SoLR after the event.   

And it did take a while for the SoLR appointment to cover UKIEH Customers and Neo customers who hadn't switched by September?, to be confirmed.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/update-solr-uk-energy-incubator-hub-customers-now-supplied-octopus-energy

CSI_Yorkshire

PowerDev said:

Qyburn said:

PowerDev said:

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 

Glad you now agree. I didn't understand where you were coming from claiming Octopus had jumped the gun, but now you can see that wasn't the case.

When Neo did cease trading completely in September 2022 OFGEM did indeed appoint Octopus as SoLR.   

No.

OFGEM appointed Octopus as SoLR on 9 July 2022.

They are very clear about that point.

There was additional communication in September because UKIEH were chasing customers for debt payment and OFGEM felt the need to clarify that customers should not comply with those requests.

Can this issue please be dropped now?  Good luck with your campaign, but endless posts here will not help it.

PowerDev

PowerDev said:

Qyburn said:

PowerDev said:

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 

Glad you now agree. I didn't understand where you were coming from claiming Octopus had jumped the gun, but now you can see that wasn't the case.

Did Octopus inform you you could safely initiate a switch to any Supplier as at 11 July?  As at the time you did not need to be protected by SoLR because Neo were able and intending to pay you back your credit.  Which I assume they did, either directly or to a new supplier you did or could have voluntarily switched to.  I take it you read that Neo Energy website page I posted the link to.  When Neo did cease trading completely in September 2022 OFGEM did indeed appoint Octopus as SoLR.   

Octopus of course had knowledge of Neo's decision to stop supplying Domestic Customer as from July 9 and contacted you.  

This was a unique situation as it indicates Voluntary Switching after the event. 
Not the processes of either Voluntary switch before or SoLR after the event.   

And it did take a while for the SoLR appointment to cover UKIEH Customers and Neo customers who hadn't switched by September?, to be confirmed.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/update-solr-uk-energy-incubator-hub-customers-now-supplied-octopus-energy

And there is a danger under here which takes me back to my posts on the Outfox the Market Blog of 2018.  Basically, that if a customer suspects their Supplier is failing they should not switch voluntarily before the failure occurs.  In which case they would only be a normal creditor of the failed Supplier company and not covered by the SoLR process which protects their credit....  I take it Neo sent the Domestic Customer credits out well before they failed.

(Outfox did not actually fail in 2018 but their attempt to change the DDR basis in November from an even charge every month to 70% Winter, 30% Summer was reversed when the FCA stepped in; and OFGEM!!)   

ArbitraryRandom

PowerDev said:

QrizB said:

If we've all finished measuring bits of anatomy ...

... we seem to be on page 6 of this thread, and so far we haven't found anyone other than the OP who thinks the specific topic that he's wound up about is a major issue.

Perhaps we can let the thread die now?

Because most customers treat OFGEMs advice as mandatory not a lot of them will switch before SoLR completes although there are two of us on this thread who did.  And a lot of people do not like switching anyway because of the issues I cited, especially in the early days from 1998.  Thus no one appreciates the issue and what it has cost them; including the other 349998 customers of my Supplier C.    

But isn't that exactly the point? 

Most customers don't shop around - and wouldn't shop around if the change you are proposing was made. 

Hence, for the majority, there's no issue; for the minority there maybe an issue in some specific and rare circumstances... but only a minority of that minority would actually behave differently if given the chance. 

Meaning the existing process is entirely fit for purpose in all but a tiny number of cases. 

PowerDev

ArbitraryRandom said:

PowerDev said:

QrizB said:

If we've all finished measuring bits of anatomy ...

... we seem to be on page 6 of this thread, and so far we haven't found anyone other than the OP who thinks the specific topic that he's wound up about is a major issue.

Perhaps we can let the thread die now?

Because most customers treat OFGEMs advice as mandatory not a lot of them will switch before SoLR completes although there are two of us on this thread who did.  And a lot of people do not like switching anyway because of the issues I cited, especially in the early days from 1998.  Thus no one appreciates the issue and what it has cost them; including the other 349998 customers of my Supplier C.    

But isn't that exactly the point? 

Most customers don't shop around - and wouldn't shop around if the change you are proposing was made. 

Hence, for the majority, there's no issue; for the minority there maybe an issue in some specific and rare circumstances... but only a minority of that minority would actually behave differently if given the chance. 

Meaning the existing process is entirely fit for purpose in all but a tiny number of cases. 

The point is that a lot of customers dont switch, partly because of the murky history with Supplier behaviour.  Those that do will mainly have obeyed OFGEMs advice and that, as you can clearly see from the figures posted, will have cost them dearly.  As the Fixed 2 year tariff, which I took out quickly in October 2021 when my Supplier failed, ends I will be paying 55% more than I asm now.  Had I not switched rapidly the overall cost for the 2 year period sould hav been worse!!   

PowerDev

CSI_Yorkshire said:

PowerDev said:

Qyburn said:

PowerDev said:

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 

Glad you now agree. I didn't understand where you were coming from claiming Octopus had jumped the gun, but now you can see that wasn't the case.

When Neo did cease trading completely in September 2022 OFGEM did indeed appoint Octopus as SoLR.   

No.

OFGEM appointed Octopus as SoLR on 9 July 2022.

They are very clear about that point.

There was additional communication in September because UKIEH were chasing customers for debt payment and OFGEM felt the need to clarify that customers should not comply with those requests.

Can this issue please be dropped now?  Good luck with your campaign, but endless posts here will not help it.

Would you please read the Neo link I posted properly.  On 11 July 2022 Ofgem appointed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH, not NEO.  Thus I was curious as to when NEO passed the Domestic Customer Credit across to Octopus before they finally ceased trading in September and Octopus was confirmed as SoLR.   As you see on the OFGEM link. 

Now, at the beginning of this thread there were various posts on the Customer credit held by Suppliers.  As they have of course a not inconsiderable Cash Balance (although on tight margins) they can use that for End of Day high interest short term loans as the 'Treasury' departments of major companies balance their End of Day positions.  I went through the 'Treasury' process in 1983....         

CSI_Yorkshire

PowerDev said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

PowerDev said:

Qyburn said:

PowerDev said:

OFGEM indeed confirmed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH Customers on 11/7/22.  
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/ofgem-appoints-octopus-energy-take-customers-uk-energy-incubator-hub-ukeih
And in consequence Neo Energy stopped supplying Domestic Customers. 

Glad you now agree. I didn't understand where you were coming from claiming Octopus had jumped the gun, but now you can see that wasn't the case.

When Neo did cease trading completely in September 2022 OFGEM did indeed appoint Octopus as SoLR.   

No.

OFGEM appointed Octopus as SoLR on 9 July 2022.

They are very clear about that point.

There was additional communication in September because UKIEH were chasing customers for debt payment and OFGEM felt the need to clarify that customers should not comply with those requests.

Can this issue please be dropped now?  Good luck with your campaign, but endless posts here will not help it.

Would you please read the Neo link I posted properly.  On 11 July 2022 Ofgem appointed Octopus as SoLR for UKIEH, not NEO.  Thus I was curious as to when NEO passed the Domestic Customer Credit across to Octopus before they finally ceased trading in September and Octopus was confirmed as SoLR.   As you see on the OFGEM link. 
    

As you are an expert in all of these things, you will, of course, know that NEO was only a brand and not a supplier and, therefore, not party to the SoLR process directly.

The licence holder was UKIEH.  All of UKIEH's brand names (NEO was not the only one) entered the SoLR process on 9 July 2022, as OFGEM, Octopus, UKIEH and several posters here have all told you.

What do inter-company loans of the early 1980s have anything to do with?  In fact, what does anything on the last 5 pages of this thread have anything to do with?

Anyway, I'm done correcting your random nonsense now, have a nice day.