IHT 402 - unused nil rate band

deewillow

Hi, newbie here and thankful to find this forum and read through the previous messages for guidance. But I have a question please...... completing the IHT400 and associated forms for my mum who passed away and we want to use my deceased dads nil rate band too. He died in 1997 and left everything to my mum. Looking at form IHT402 it says 'Fill in this form if: • the deceased died on or after 9 October 2007'
So what do you do if the deceased date is before then? With it being so long ago i'm not even sure if my dad had a will or where a copy of it would be as he died quite young and suddenly. thanks for any assistance given

Keep_pedalling

That 2007 date is referring to your mother’s date of death not your father’s so unless this is a very late application for your mother this is the correct form.

If your father’s estate went to probate you can obtain the records on line (unless he lived in Scotland).

https://www.gov.uk/search-will-probate

What is the total value of your mother’s estate?

smk77

deewillow said:

Hi, newbie here and thankful to find this forum and read through the previous messages for guidance. But I have a question please...... completing the IHT400 and associated forms for my mum who passed away and we want to use my deceased dads nil rate band too. He died in 1997 and left everything to my mum. Looking at form IHT402 it says 'Fill in this form if: • the deceased died on or after 9 October 2007'
So what do you do if the deceased date is before then? With it being so long ago i'm not even sure if my dad had a will or where a copy of it would be as he died quite young and suddenly. thanks for any assistance given

The deceased is your Mum. It's her details you enter on the top right:

 Name of deceased (person who has died now)

Read the heading "Background" on this link

https://www.mandg.com/pru/adviser/en-gb/insights-events/insights-library/transferable-nil-rate-band-facts

deewillow

arh - ok..... sorry I thought it was referring to the spouses (my dads) deceased date. Mum's was July this year and her estate including property is about £525k so we need to use my dads nil rate residence element or his nil rate band to make sure she doesnt have to pay any IHT. Which option is easier in terms of finding past paperwork? thanks for the quick replies - much appreciated

Keep_pedalling

deewillow said:

arh - ok..... sorry I thought it was referring to the spouses (my dads) deceased date. Mum's was July this year and her estate including property is about £525k so we need to use my dads nil rate residence element or his nil rate band to make sure she doesnt have to pay any IHT. Which option is easier in terms of finding past paperwork? thanks for the quick replies - much appreciated

If you can find his probate records from the link I provided then it should be simple, but if probate was not required then it becomes trickier as somehow you have got to estimate the value of his estate which is not going to be easy.

The other option you have is to use your mother’s residential NRB and the transferable RNRB. This has the advantage of avoiding the difficult task of calculating the value of his estate, but it would mean you need to do a full IHT return.

deewillow

Thanks Keep Peddling, No i cant find his probate records from that link and suspect that mum didnt do probate back then. I'll go with the option mums NRB and the transferable RNRB, I'm already doing multiple IHT forms as part of the IHT400 process so another one to add to the pile. Thanks again for the advice on this

smk77

Keep_pedalling said:

deewillow said:

arh - ok..... sorry I thought it was referring to the spouses (my dads) deceased date. Mum's was July this year and her estate including property is about £525k so we need to use my dads nil rate residence element or his nil rate band to make sure she doesnt have to pay any IHT. Which option is easier in terms of finding past paperwork? thanks for the quick replies - much appreciated

If you can find his probate records from the link I provided then it should be simple, but if probate was not required then it becomes trickier as somehow you have got to estimate the value of his estate which is not going to be easy.

The other option you have is to use your mother’s residential NRB and the transferable RNRB. This has the advantage of avoiding the difficult task of calculating the value of his estate, but it would mean you need to do a full IHT return.

Sorry for jumping on this but it's relevant to my position. I have valued my Mum's estate (she died before my Dad) as half the house value at the time (they'd moved less that a year before she died to relatively easy). I know she had some investments but only small (maybe about £10k) so, I was thinking about half the value of the house plus £10k.

poppystar

Am I missing something here but if father left everything to mother and her estate is under £650k now isn’t this an excepted estate and no completion if IHT400 forms needed? 

@Keep_pedalling - sure you’ll know the answer and what I’m missing here! 

Keep_pedalling

poppystar said:

Am I missing something here but if father left everything to mother and her estate is under £650k now isn’t this an excepted estate and no completion if IHT400 forms needed? 

@Keep_pedalling - sure you’ll know the answer and what I’m missing here! 

You are correct, if the OP can manage to use the transferable NRB rather than the residential NRBs then no IHT return needs to be used.

deewillow

thanks Poppystar - yes dad left everything to mum in 1997. no further marriage. Looking at the transferable NRB that seems to require more info (which i will struggle to get) rather than the residential NRB. Id pretty much finished the IHT400 form and the various offspring anyway now. I did originally look at being an excepted estate but presumed I still needed to go through the IHT400 and calculations to prove it?
Apologies if I am asking questions that may seem obvious and entry level  - but first time I have dealt with this and finding this forum has been a god send

poppystar

deewillow said:

thanks Poppystar - yes dad left everything to mum in 1997. no further marriage. Looking at the transferable NRB that seems to require more info (which i will struggle to get) rather than the residential NRB. Id pretty much finished the IHT400 form and the various offspring anyway now. I did originally look at being an excepted estate but presumed I still needed to go through the IHT400 and calculations to prove it?
Apologies if I am asking questions that may seem obvious and entry level  - but first time I have dealt with this and finding this forum has been a god send

No, if it’s an excepted estate no need for forms other than probate AIUI - so no need to find values or use RNRB.