Stolen parcel left unattended by Royal Mail

Teacholic

I made online purchase in 10th of July of value approx £170. I’ve never actually received it. After a week of waiting for it, I checked tracking. Royal Mail  Laine sit delivered and have a photo of a parcel being held in front of  my door number and doors being closed/shut. I was in on the day of apparent delivery and didn’t hear any knock although I work from home so might have been in a meeting. Both my and my partner didn’t see parcel outside that day and since. If it was left there unattended it got stolen as I live in a block of flats. 

I contacted the seller explaining what happened and asked to either resend (via different courier) or refund. He has been uncooperative and by now I have bought the product again. I would prefer refund so don’t need to deal with retailer anymore. 

I found this link: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/delivery-rights/?utm_source=mseios&utm_medium=mobile_app&source=MOB_MSEIOS&utm_campaign=mymse

I asked about the update today for the last time. I’m planning to send breach of contract 14 days email and then recorded letter if not hearing back within a week. I hope that the thread of small claims court is going to scare the retailer and issue refund. However, considering actually making claim. I’m wondering how successful this claim would be if I made it? From my understanding it’s unlikely I’d need to pay for losses if I don’t win. 

Thanks for your advice. 

TadleyBaggie

So have you reported the theft to the police and got a crime reference number?

I'm not surprised the seller is reluctant to resend/refund, the evidence is that it was delivered to the correct address. I wouldn't rate your chances in small claim court, I don't see any breach of contract.

NorfolkCanary

I may be wrong and happy to be corrected, but presumably the seller could claim they no longer has a contract with you on the basis that R.M. have (incorrectly or otherwise) recorded the item as received/delivered?

Have you contacted Royal Mail to investigate? I'm sure if you provide CS the tracking number they may be able to work out who the postie is and whether it's been placed back at the LDO and not recorded by accident.

Have you seen this page? https://www.royalmail.com/help/shown-as-delivered-but-customer-has-not-received

Teacholic

TadleyBaggie said:

So have you reported the theft to the police and got a crime reference number?

I'm not surprised the seller is reluctant to resend/refund, the evidence is that it was delivered to the correct address. I wouldn't rate your chances in small claim court, I don't see any breach of contract.

Hi TedlyBaggie. To be honest I’ve not thought of reporting it to the Police so far not sure why I haven’t thought of that. It was supposedly delivered on the 12th of July, isn’t it too late to report? 

On Royal Mail app it said handed in to the resident, which is untrue. Most couriers take a photo with the parcel with open doorway with person collecting it within it. 

Well, the seller is responsible for my goods being delivered under the consumer rights, isn’t it? That’s what the article say. 

Teacholic

NorfolkCanary said:

I may be wrong and happy to be corrected, but presumably the seller could claim they no longer has a contract with you on the basis that R.M. have (incorrectly or otherwise) recorded the item as received/delivered?

Have you contacted Royal Mail to investigate? I'm sure if you provide CS the tracking number they may be able to work out who the postie is and whether it's been placed back at the LDO and not recorded by accident.

Have you seen this page? https://www.royalmail.com/help/shown-as-delivered-but-customer-has-not-received

Hi NorfolkCanary. I can see your point regarding the contract. The only things I have is the photo of the closed door so they cannot prove anyone actually was handed the parcel. 

I saw the link you posted and checked it as open as I realised parcel was not delivered and none of this helps I’m afraid. It was not left with the neighbours, I checked. so far the seller has contacted the Royal Mail (as they advise on their website “ If you’re the recipient please contact the sender. They will contact us to make enquiries on your behalf”) but the seller claims they were unresponsive. I’ll try myself and see where it gets me. 

Thanks 

soolin

My recent experience would confirm what others have suggested that any claim for INR will automatically be lost . It also shows how poor Royal Mail handle any issues connected with poor delivery.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6451596/my-turn-for-help-with-lost-items-royal-mail#latest

user1977

Teacholic said:

TadleyBaggie said:

So have you reported the theft to the police and got a crime reference number?

I'm not surprised the seller is reluctant to resend/refund, the evidence is that it was delivered to the correct address. I wouldn't rate your chances in small claim court, I don't see any breach of contract.

To be honest I’ve not thought of reporting it to the Police so far not sure why I haven’t thought of that. It was supposedly delivered on the 12th of July, isn’t it too late to report? 

Obviously they're not likely to catch anybody red-handed, but not sure where you've got the idea that it can be "too late" to report a crime? There's no such thing as a statute of limitations in the UK for crimes.

Pollycat

Teacholic said:

I made online purchase in 10th of July of value approx £170. I’ve never actually received it. After a week of waiting for it, I checked tracking. Royal Mail  Laine sit delivered and have a photo of a parcel being held in front of  my door number and doors being closed/shut. I was in on the day of apparent delivery and didn’t hear any knock although I work from home so might have been in a meeting. Both my and my partner didn’t see parcel outside that day and since. If it was left there unattended it got stolen as I live in a block of flats. 

I contacted the seller explaining what happened and asked to either resend (via different courier) or refund. He has been uncooperative and by now I have bought the product again. I would prefer refund so don’t need to deal with retailer anymore. 

I found this link: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/delivery-rights/?utm_source=mseios&utm_medium=mobile_app&source=MOB_MSEIOS&utm_campaign=mymse

I asked about the update today for the last time. I’m planning to send breach of contract 14 days email and then recorded letter if not hearing back within a week. I hope that the thread of small claims court is going to scare the retailer and issue refund. However, considering actually making claim. I’m wondering how successful this claim would be if I made it? From my understanding it’s unlikely I’d need to pay for losses if I don’t win. 

Thanks for your advice. 

Re the bits in bold - you are blaming the wrong person.
What has the retailer done wrong if Royal Mail say that your parcel has been delivered?
Your threat of small claims court would not scare me into refunding you if I was the retailer.
I'm not surprised that the retailer is being uncooperative.

tightauldgit

Risk doesn't pass until the item is in your possession and I can't see how leaving it outside your door is in your possession - as such if it was stolen then it was stolen from the seller and not from you. They should be investigating it/reporting it not you. Unless you've given permission for it to be left somewhere - then that would be at your risk I believe.

I has this very issue with a purchase recently - courier left it in a bin and recycling day came round before I had collected the item! - and got a replacement from the supplier. 

I don't see that a police report would be useful or necessary since it was stolen from you. 

How you go about enforcing your rights is a different matter and how much weight a court would give to RM saying they delivered it vs you saying you never received it I have no idea. If the evidence is that they simply left it at your door that I don't see how that is delivered but if they say it was handed to recipient that might be a different matter. 

I can't say this with certainty but I think the reason RM say 'handed to recipient' is because there isn't an option on their system for 'dumped at the door' the other option would be 'left in a safe place' but this should have been specified by you beforehand and wouldn't carry any weight without that. 

Its all a bit of a mess at the minute especially after all the rules seemed to change with COVID but I don't accept that simply leaving a parcel in the vicinity of the address of the recipient should be considered delivery and I think it's a practice that really should stop. 

Okell

Teacholic said:

...Royal Mail  Laine sit delivered and have a photo of a parcel being held in front of  my door number and doors being closed/shut...

Assuming the photo doesn't show the OP or somebody they had identified holding it (and I presume they are saying it doesn't) then @tightauldgit is right and it's the seller's responsibility to sort this out.

s29(2) of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (legislation.gov.uk) says:

"29  Passing of risk

(1)A sales contract is to be treated as including the following provisions as terms.

(2)The goods remain at the trader’s risk until they come into the physical possession of—

(a)the consumer, or

(b)a person identified by the consumer to take possession of the goods"  [My bold for emphasis]

I don't think the photo the OP describes proves delivery into their possession.  There's really no point couriers taking photos in front of closed doors as unless the photo also shows the consumer it doesn't prove delivery into the consumer's physical possession.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

OP as you mention the word "seller" was this a marketplace purchase such as eBay and if seller is the seller a business or private individual?