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64% cut from Partial Refund while in Warranty
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I think there is a significant possibility that if the OP doesn't take what the retailer is offering they will decide that the OP broke the card themselves when they did the modification, withdraw their offer, and leave it at that.
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OP - I think that there's a lot of confusion here, with contradicting information. I'll put the two scenarios that I believe are being conflated. This is going to be a long post - I'll post a tl;dr at the bottom.
Scenario 1: Claiming Under CRA- Your rights: repair, replace or refund - this is the retailers choice in what they give you. You can ask for another option, but the retailer is under no obligation to provide as such. Your refund (if offered) is not based on market value, but the condition of your card.
- My opinion: You have modified the product, but the fault is known to the community (based on reports from 2021); and appears to be firmware related (i.e. if this is the issue on the board, it is likely an inherent fault). But the retailers are not 'experts' to judge this and may ask the manufacturer to assess it to see if it is an inherent fault. This is reasonable, and not the retailer acting punitively.
- My second opinion: If there are any signs of damage to the fans; they may well argue that this is the cause of the fan issue.
- My third opinion: EVGA is no longer producing graphics cards - you may not be able to get a brand new card (depending on how many they have left for RMA's etc.), but the retailer could offer you an alternate card. Additionally, I don't think offering a refund based solely on the amount of time remaining of the warranty is fair - I would expect a top-of-the-line card, under normal operating conditions, to last longer. But again, this may come down to the professional opinion of the supplier.
- Bottom line: sending back to EVGA is likely the best option to get the best outcome from the CRA; assuming the card is still in pretty good working condition.
Scenario 2: Claiming Under EVGA warranty- This is far more generous than the CRA - and exceeds your rights via the CRA (but does not replace them - hence why I said that the warranty time is a poor method of working out the lifetime of the product). As you have said before, sometimes you can get far more back via this warranty (you said you got 85% as an RMA).
- EVGA states in their warranty to go back via the retailer for a refund; if that's your desired outcome. Their warranty only covers direct refunding on purchases made through them. They look like they still repair or replace through the warranty.
- You can contact EVGA to see what their recommendation is - and even ask if the offer from the retailer is fair or not. The worst they'll say if you call them is to go back to the retailers, so nothing to lose.
- EVGA will likely want to inspect the board first, before offering any solution through their warranty - completely fair.
TL;DR:
The bottom line is - I am very surprised that the retailer offered a solution without first inspecting the board, but as this is a community-known issue, I would suggest that this isn't their first time dealing with this issue. But inspecting the product is a fair request from their end. If you aren't happy with the solutions offered by them; tell them what your ideal solution would be and maybe find a compromise. Or send it to EVGA. But I think either way, it is fair for either the retailer or the manufacturer to ask to inspect the board.1 -
MattMattMattUK said:Otter23 said:Okell said:MattMattMattUK said:Your major issue is going to be that you modified the card, you took it apart and added a third party cooling solution. Any modifications at that kind of scale are going to become an issue when trying to return, even more so if you then claim that there was an intrinsic fault before you took the card apart, but you did not notice until you attempted reassembly, it just sounds like you messed up.
As others have said it is down to you to prove an inherent fault, which is going to be difficult to impossible.
I don't know if the retailer (and/or manufacturer) are yet aware that the OP carried out this modification (which I understand he subsequently reversed) but if they are aware of it - or if it's obvious that he had done it - aren't they going to wash their hands of this and say the OP caused the fault himself?
(I know absolutely nothing about computer tech but the diy modification seems a rather daft, or at the very best risky, thing to have done...)Alderbank said:Okell said:MattMattMattUK said:Your major issue is going to be that you modified the card, you took it apart and added a third party cooling solution. Any modifications at that kind of scale are going to become an issue when trying to return, even more so if you then claim that there was an intrinsic fault before you took the card apart, but you did not notice until you attempted reassembly, it just sounds like you messed up.
As others have said it is down to you to prove an inherent fault, which is going to be difficult to impossible.
I don't know if the retailer (and/or manufacturer) are yet aware that the OP carried out this modification (which I understand he subsequently reversed) but if they are aware of it - or if it's obvious that he had done it - aren't they going to wash their hands of this and say the OP caused the fault himself?
In the first post the OP said
I have now been told because I opened my Graphics card up to repaste and use a different cooling solution for 23 months. (The manufacturer allows this) And only now noted the stock fans were faulty after reinstalling the stock fans last week, they now need "manufacturer needs to look at it and make sure your cooler didn't break it"
To clarify, Scan were made aware of the fact I changed the cooler from the very start.
They offered the refurbished card first, which i declined as they provided no details on it, as I mentioned above. Scan don't do repairs apparently, despite them offering "system built for you".
Then when I asked for a alternative such as a fair partial refund or a exchange to another brand that would be as close to equivalent performance/value, they ignored the exchange and offered a ridiculous cut price refund. And only when I pointed out the refurbished card they offered me was listed on thier website for £800, did they suddenly see my swap of the cooler as a problem. Retaliation for simply highlighting the blatant undercut in the refund they offered. There is simply no way a gpu loses that much value while still in warranty.
I can look on numerous sites and that very same product new ranges from the cheapest cooler model of £999, to the same exact cooler as mine £1,397.Otter23 said:I can't post a link, but a google search of "Scan evga warranty" top most link shows that EVGA allows buyers to "Change your Thermal paste or install another cooler and keep your warranty" on Scans website. And again, Scan only switched the script after I mentioned the switcheroo they were trying to pull off.
You have a choice, accept the partial refund which is fair under the CRA, accept the warranty claim process and see if EVGA can resolve it, or been being stubborn and get nowhere.MattMattMattUK said:Otter23 said:Okell said:MattMattMattUK said:Your major issue is going to be that you modified the card, you took it apart and added a third party cooling solution. Any modifications at that kind of scale are going to become an issue when trying to return, even more so if you then claim that there was an intrinsic fault before you took the card apart, but you did not notice until you attempted reassembly, it just sounds like you messed up.
As others have said it is down to you to prove an inherent fault, which is going to be difficult to impossible.
I don't know if the retailer (and/or manufacturer) are yet aware that the OP carried out this modification (which I understand he subsequently reversed) but if they are aware of it - or if it's obvious that he had done it - aren't they going to wash their hands of this and say the OP caused the fault himself?
(I know absolutely nothing about computer tech but the diy modification seems a rather daft, or at the very best risky, thing to have done...)Alderbank said:Okell said:MattMattMattUK said:Your major issue is going to be that you modified the card, you took it apart and added a third party cooling solution. Any modifications at that kind of scale are going to become an issue when trying to return, even more so if you then claim that there was an intrinsic fault before you took the card apart, but you did not notice until you attempted reassembly, it just sounds like you messed up.
As others have said it is down to you to prove an inherent fault, which is going to be difficult to impossible.
I don't know if the retailer (and/or manufacturer) are yet aware that the OP carried out this modification (which I understand he subsequently reversed) but if they are aware of it - or if it's obvious that he had done it - aren't they going to wash their hands of this and say the OP caused the fault himself?
In the first post the OP said
I have now been told because I opened my Graphics card up to repaste and use a different cooling solution for 23 months. (The manufacturer allows this) And only now noted the stock fans were faulty after reinstalling the stock fans last week, they now need "manufacturer needs to look at it and make sure your cooler didn't break it"
To clarify, Scan were made aware of the fact I changed the cooler from the very start.
They offered the refurbished card first, which i declined as they provided no details on it, as I mentioned above. Scan don't do repairs apparently, despite them offering "system built for you".
Then when I asked for a alternative such as a fair partial refund or a exchange to another brand that would be as close to equivalent performance/value, they ignored the exchange and offered a ridiculous cut price refund. And only when I pointed out the refurbished card they offered me was listed on thier website for £800, did they suddenly see my swap of the cooler as a problem. Retaliation for simply highlighting the blatant undercut in the refund they offered. There is simply no way a gpu loses that much value while still in warranty.
I can look on numerous sites and that very same product new ranges from the cheapest cooler model of £999, to the same exact cooler as mine £1,397.Otter23 said:I can't post a link, but a google search of "Scan evga warranty" top most link shows that EVGA allows buyers to "Change your Thermal paste or install another cooler and keep your warranty" on Scans website. And again, Scan only switched the script after I mentioned the switcheroo they were trying to pull off.
You have a choice, accept the partial refund which is fair under the CRA, accept the warranty claim process and see if EVGA can resolve it, or been being stubborn and get nowhere.
That's clearly taking what i said out of context, I never said I wanted the refund to equate to a new card today price, because I'm fully aware of real market value of a 3080ti compared to a modern model today. My point was the refund offered, doesn't even get me a second hand 3 year 3080ti from a mining farm. So please explain how Scan can say "we looked at the market and all the 3080tis are either used £650+ with no warranty and older than your product, or they are over £1000 to replace with a unboxed one. so here's £509" Now I've already stated that they offered the refurb first which is 800 on the Scan store, which shows they value the card as more than £509. They should not be profiteering on my card in this manner.
"You can make a claim under the CRA against Scan, they should give you a response in accordance with the CRA"
They didn't they went straight to "here's our card, but we don't know the condition or history" with no attempt to offer a repair themselves or a replacement of a equivalent product. As I said before, it's a nice money maker to low ball offer a refund and then take a users product, get it repaired themselves, and then resell for a vastly marked up price.
Can you clarify what part in the CRA does it state a parital refund can be so low it would be deemed almost criminal? Because seems like the CRA would leave a giant void for retailers to offer 1% refunds if they can just say "We don't do repairs, and we don't have any replacements, here's £12 on your £1200 purchase :^)"
Evga have also stated I would be entitled to a repair or replacement from Scan. Even the Manufacturer is saying to get Scan to resolve the issue first. And EVGA are also aware in writing I opened the card up, no issue at all.
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outtatune said:I think there is a significant possibility that if the OP doesn't take what the retailer is offering they will decide that the OP broke the card themselves when they did the modification, withdraw their offer, and leave it at that.
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RefluentBeans said:OP - I think that there's a lot of confusion here, with contradicting information. I'll put the two scenarios that I believe are being conflated. This is going to be a long post - I'll post a tl;dr at the bottom.
Scenario 1: Claiming Under CRA- Your rights: repair, replace or refund - this is the retailers choice in what they give you. You can ask for another option, but the retailer is under no obligation to provide as such. Your refund (if offered) is not based on market value, but the condition of your card.
- My opinion: You have modified the product, but the fault is known to the community (based on reports from 2021); and appears to be firmware related (i.e. if this is the issue on the board, it is likely an inherent fault). But the retailers are not 'experts' to judge this and may ask the manufacturer to assess it to see if it is an inherent fault. This is reasonable, and not the retailer acting punitively.
- My second opinion: If there are any signs of damage to the fans; they may well argue that this is the cause of the fan issue.
- My third opinion: EVGA is no longer producing graphics cards - you may not be able to get a brand new card (depending on how many they have left for RMA's etc.), but the retailer could offer you an alternate card. Additionally, I don't think offering a refund based solely on the amount of time remaining of the warranty is fair - I would expect a top-of-the-line card, under normal operating conditions, to last longer. But again, this may come down to the professional opinion of the supplier.
- Bottom line: sending back to EVGA is likely the best option to get the best outcome from the CRA; assuming the card is still in pretty good working condition.
Scenario 2: Claiming Under EVGA warranty- This is far more generous than the CRA - and exceeds your rights via the CRA (but does not replace them - hence why I said that the warranty time is a poor method of working out the lifetime of the product). As you have said before, sometimes you can get far more back via this warranty (you said you got 85% as an RMA).
- EVGA states in their warranty to go back via the retailer for a refund; if that's your desired outcome. Their warranty only covers direct refunding on purchases made through them. They look like they still repair or replace through the warranty.
- You can contact EVGA to see what their recommendation is - and even ask if the offer from the retailer is fair or not. The worst they'll say if you call them is to go back to the retailers, so nothing to lose.
- EVGA will likely want to inspect the board first, before offering any solution through their warranty - completely fair.
TL;DR:
The bottom line is - I am very surprised that the retailer offered a solution without first inspecting the board, but as this is a community-known issue, I would suggest that this isn't their first time dealing with this issue. But inspecting the product is a fair request from their end. If you aren't happy with the solutions offered by them; tell them what your ideal solution would be and maybe find a compromise. Or send it to EVGA. But I think either way, it is fair for either the retailer or the manufacturer to ask to inspect the board.
Appreciate the clear explanation of both sides of my options.
Currently, I have sent a email in with the facts of the matter. Outlined what I expect to be fair and reasonable, asked if they would consider mediation and a few other issues I have had with different reps telling me one thing to the other.
So I guess it's up to them to respond in the timeframe, and then yeah, I will go through EVGA if need be. Next time I'll buy on credit card or Amazon. Never had such a farce with a RMA in all my years.
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Otter23 said:RefluentBeans said:OP - I think that there's a lot of confusion here, with contradicting information. I'll put the two scenarios that I believe are being conflated. This is going to be a long post - I'll post a tl;dr at the bottom.
Scenario 1: Claiming Under CRA- Your rights: repair, replace or refund - this is the retailers choice in what they give you. You can ask for another option, but the retailer is under no obligation to provide as such. Your refund (if offered) is not based on market value, but the condition of your card.
- My opinion: You have modified the product, but the fault is known to the community (based on reports from 2021); and appears to be firmware related (i.e. if this is the issue on the board, it is likely an inherent fault). But the retailers are not 'experts' to judge this and may ask the manufacturer to assess it to see if it is an inherent fault. This is reasonable, and not the retailer acting punitively.
- My second opinion: If there are any signs of damage to the fans; they may well argue that this is the cause of the fan issue.
- My third opinion: EVGA is no longer producing graphics cards - you may not be able to get a brand new card (depending on how many they have left for RMA's etc.), but the retailer could offer you an alternate card. Additionally, I don't think offering a refund based solely on the amount of time remaining of the warranty is fair - I would expect a top-of-the-line card, under normal operating conditions, to last longer. But again, this may come down to the professional opinion of the supplier.
- Bottom line: sending back to EVGA is likely the best option to get the best outcome from the CRA; assuming the card is still in pretty good working condition.
Scenario 2: Claiming Under EVGA warranty- This is far more generous than the CRA - and exceeds your rights via the CRA (but does not replace them - hence why I said that the warranty time is a poor method of working out the lifetime of the product). As you have said before, sometimes you can get far more back via this warranty (you said you got 85% as an RMA).
- EVGA states in their warranty to go back via the retailer for a refund; if that's your desired outcome. Their warranty only covers direct refunding on purchases made through them. They look like they still repair or replace through the warranty.
- You can contact EVGA to see what their recommendation is - and even ask if the offer from the retailer is fair or not. The worst they'll say if you call them is to go back to the retailers, so nothing to lose.
- EVGA will likely want to inspect the board first, before offering any solution through their warranty - completely fair.
TL;DR:
The bottom line is - I am very surprised that the retailer offered a solution without first inspecting the board, but as this is a community-known issue, I would suggest that this isn't their first time dealing with this issue. But inspecting the product is a fair request from their end. If you aren't happy with the solutions offered by them; tell them what your ideal solution would be and maybe find a compromise. Or send it to EVGA. But I think either way, it is fair for either the retailer or the manufacturer to ask to inspect the board.
Appreciate the clear explanation of both sides of my options.
Currently, I have sent a email in with the facts of the matter. Outlined what I expect to be fair and reasonable, asked if they would consider mediation and a few other issues I have had with different reps telling me one thing to the other.
So I guess it's up to them to respond in the timeframe, and then yeah, I will go through EVGA if need be. Next time I'll buy on credit card or Amazon. Never had such a farce with a RMA in all my years.1 -
Otter23 said:
That's clearly taking what i said out of context, I never said I wanted the refund to equate to a new card today price, because I'm fully aware of real market value of a 3080ti compared to a modern model today. My point was the refund offered, doesn't even get me a second hand 3 year 3080ti from a mining farm. So please explain how Scan can say "we looked at the market and all the 3080tis are either used £650+ with no warranty and older than your product, or they are over £1000 to replace with a unboxed one. so here's £509" Now I've already stated that they offered the refurb first which is 800 on the Scan store, which shows they value the card as more than £509. They should not be profiteering on my card in this manner.
"You can make a claim under the CRA against Scan, they should give you a response in accordance with the CRA"
They didn't they went straight to "here's our card, but we don't know the condition or history" with no attempt to offer a repair themselves or a replacement of a equivalent product. As I said before, it's a nice money maker to low ball offer a refund and then take a users product, get it repaired themselves, and then resell for a vastly marked up price.
Can you clarify what part in the CRA does it state a parital refund can be so low it would be deemed almost criminal? Because seems like the CRA would leave a giant void for retailers to offer 1% refunds if they can just say "We don't do repairs, and we don't have any replacements, here's £12 on your £1200 purchase :^)"
Evga have also stated I would be entitled to a repair or replacement from Scan. Even the Manufacturer is saying to get Scan to resolve the issue first. And EVGA are also aware in writing I opened the card up, no issue at all.
In your case the question seems to be what is a reasonable expectation of life on a graphics card. I appreciate that cards can potentially last for many years but it's also not unusual for a life of 3 years to be applied to tech things so it could potentially go either way.1 -
You modded the card with aftermarket coolers, I'm surprised they are even offering a partial refund.
Normally changing the spec of a product voids warranties and that goes all the way down the chain.1 -
Otter23 said:MattMattMattUK said:Otter23 said:Okell said:MattMattMattUK said:Your major issue is going to be that you modified the card, you took it apart and added a third party cooling solution. Any modifications at that kind of scale are going to become an issue when trying to return, even more so if you then claim that there was an intrinsic fault before you took the card apart, but you did not notice until you attempted reassembly, it just sounds like you messed up.
As others have said it is down to you to prove an inherent fault, which is going to be difficult to impossible.
I don't know if the retailer (and/or manufacturer) are yet aware that the OP carried out this modification (which I understand he subsequently reversed) but if they are aware of it - or if it's obvious that he had done it - aren't they going to wash their hands of this and say the OP caused the fault himself?
(I know absolutely nothing about computer tech but the diy modification seems a rather daft, or at the very best risky, thing to have done...)Alderbank said:Okell said:MattMattMattUK said:Your major issue is going to be that you modified the card, you took it apart and added a third party cooling solution. Any modifications at that kind of scale are going to become an issue when trying to return, even more so if you then claim that there was an intrinsic fault before you took the card apart, but you did not notice until you attempted reassembly, it just sounds like you messed up.
As others have said it is down to you to prove an inherent fault, which is going to be difficult to impossible.
I don't know if the retailer (and/or manufacturer) are yet aware that the OP carried out this modification (which I understand he subsequently reversed) but if they are aware of it - or if it's obvious that he had done it - aren't they going to wash their hands of this and say the OP caused the fault himself?
In the first post the OP said
I have now been told because I opened my Graphics card up to repaste and use a different cooling solution for 23 months. (The manufacturer allows this) And only now noted the stock fans were faulty after reinstalling the stock fans last week, they now need "manufacturer needs to look at it and make sure your cooler didn't break it"
To clarify, Scan were made aware of the fact I changed the cooler from the very start.
They offered the refurbished card first, which i declined as they provided no details on it, as I mentioned above. Scan don't do repairs apparently, despite them offering "system built for you".
Then when I asked for a alternative such as a fair partial refund or a exchange to another brand that would be as close to equivalent performance/value, they ignored the exchange and offered a ridiculous cut price refund. And only when I pointed out the refurbished card they offered me was listed on thier website for £800, did they suddenly see my swap of the cooler as a problem. Retaliation for simply highlighting the blatant undercut in the refund they offered. There is simply no way a gpu loses that much value while still in warranty.
I can look on numerous sites and that very same product new ranges from the cheapest cooler model of £999, to the same exact cooler as mine £1,397.Otter23 said:I can't post a link, but a google search of "Scan evga warranty" top most link shows that EVGA allows buyers to "Change your Thermal paste or install another cooler and keep your warranty" on Scans website. And again, Scan only switched the script after I mentioned the switcheroo they were trying to pull off.
You have a choice, accept the partial refund which is fair under the CRA, accept the warranty claim process and see if EVGA can resolve it, or been being stubborn and get nowhere.
That's clearly taking what i said out of context, I never said I wanted the refund to equate to a new card today price, because I'm fully aware of real market value of a 3080ti compared to a modern model today. My point was the refund offered, doesn't even get me a second hand 3 year 3080ti from a mining farm. So please explain how Scan can say "we looked at the market and all the 3080tis are either used £650+ with no warranty and older than your product, or they are over £1000 to replace with a unboxed one. so here's £509" Now I've already stated that they offered the refurb first which is 800 on the Scan store, which shows they value the card as more than £509. They should not be profiteering on my card in this manner.Otter23 said:"You can make a claim under the CRA against Scan, they should give you a response in accordance with the CRA"
They didn't they went straight to "here's our card, but we don't know the condition or history" with no attempt to offer a repair themselves or a replacement of a equivalent product. As I said before, it's a nice money maker to low ball offer a refund and then take a users product, get it repaired themselves, and then resell for a vastly marked up price.
Can you clarify what part in the CRA does it state a parital refund can be so low it would be deemed almost criminal? Because seems like the CRA would leave a giant void for retailers to offer 1% refunds if they can just say "We don't do repairs, and we don't have any replacements, here's £12 on your £1200 purchase :^)"Otter23 said:Evga have also stated I would be entitled to a repair or replacement from Scan. Even the Manufacturer is saying to get Scan to resolve the issue first. And EVGA are also aware in writing I opened the card up, no issue at all.
EVGA can say that they are fine with you opening up the card, but that does not mean that they can force Scan to be fine with that, the opening it up applies to the EVGA warranty, not Scan under the CRA.
1 -
@Otter23 - this bris said:You modded the card with aftermarket coolers, I'm surprised they are even offering a partial refund...
and thisMattMattMattUK said:
... EVGA can say that they are fine with you opening up the card, but that does not mean that they can force Scan to be fine with that, the opening it up applies to the EVGA warranty, not Scan under the CRA.
Because you've modified the card I honestly don't think you have much hope of a remedy against Scan under the Consumer Rights Act.
But if you are saying that EVGA have made it clear that you modifying the card doesn't invalidate their warranty, then your only real option is to make a claim against that warranty. (Although like @bris I find it surprising that modifying the product would not invalidate the warranty from the outset...)
It's not clear to me if you have already contacted EVGA about this, and whether they have told you that it is Scan's responsibility to deal with your claim against the EVGA warranty.
If that is the case, have you made it 100% clear to Scan that they are simply processing a claim against EVGA's warranty and that you aren't making a CRA claim against Scan?0
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