Dishwashers - Are they cheaper?

waqasahmed

So  dishwashers may be more efficient and that's the case even if you get an F rated dishwasher 

Though, for the average house, dishwashers use electricity and the hot tap uses gas. Whilst dishwashers are more efficient, they do use a  "fuel" that costs about 4 times more than gas.

Given this, is it cheaper then to still use your dishwasher? Or cheaper to hand-wash? 

Postik

I've always been sceptical that they are "cheaper"

I think they also use less water which might make the water usage cheaper if you're on a meter, but will make no difference if you're not.  The cost of water is also negligible compared to the cost of electricity and gas.

I got a dishwasher for the first time last year and haven't washed up since. I wouldn't go back to washing up now regardless of which is cheapest.

DullGreyGuy

waqasahmed said:

So  dishwashers may be more efficient and that's the case even if you get an F rated dishwasher 

Though, for the average house, dishwashers use electricity and the hot tap uses gas. Whilst dishwashers are more efficient, they do use a  "fuel" that costs about 4 times more than gas.

Given this, is it cheaper then to still use your dishwasher? Or cheaper to hand-wash? 

There are dishwashers that will take a hot water supply, our dishwasher on eco mode uses 0.54kW with a cold water feed and 0.29kW with a hot water feed. In both cases it uses 6L of water.

Comparing to washing up is always going to be difficult as there are so many different ways of doing it... some fill the sink full of water, some have just a two or three inches, some take more of a shower approach with wetting dishes, soaping them in a dry sink then rinsing them all off. Some will use hot water, waiting for the hot water to come through if on a combi-boiler, others just use the temp of water coming out the tap. 

From others that have done the calcs the answer is that it can go either way depending on your style of washing up. Naturally this only considers the electricity/gas aspect of the equation but you then have the detergent (dishwasher tab/powders vary widely) and then the initial investment/maintenance.

Personally... a dishwasher is for convenience not moneysaving.

waqasahmed

DullGreyGuy said:

waqasahmed said:

So  dishwashers may be more efficient and that's the case even if you get an F rated dishwasher 

Though, for the average house, dishwashers use electricity and the hot tap uses gas. Whilst dishwashers are more efficient, they do use a  "fuel" that costs about 4 times more than gas.

Given this, is it cheaper then to still use your dishwasher? Or cheaper to hand-wash? 

There are dishwashers that will take a hot water supply, our dishwasher on eco mode uses 0.54kW with a cold water feed and 0.29kW with a hot water feed. In both cases it uses 6L of water.

Comparing to washing up is always going to be difficult as there are so many different ways of doing it... some fill the sink full of water, some have just a two or three inches, some take more of a shower approach with wetting dishes, soaping them in a dry sink then rinsing them all off. Some will use hot water, waiting for the hot water to come through if on a combi-boiler, others just use the temp of water coming out the tap. 

From others that have done the calcs the answer is that it can go either way depending on your style of washing up. Naturally this only considers the electricity/gas aspect of the equation but you then have the detergent (dishwasher tab/powders vary widely) and then the initial investment/maintenance.

Personally... a dishwasher is for convenience not moneysaving.

Agreed with the last bit tbf. I have way more dishes than I need, purely because I've got a dishwasher

I take it you've got a fancy Miele hot water dishwasher? 

DullGreyGuy

waqasahmed said:

DullGreyGuy said:

waqasahmed said:

So  dishwashers may be more efficient and that's the case even if you get an F rated dishwasher 

Though, for the average house, dishwashers use electricity and the hot tap uses gas. Whilst dishwashers are more efficient, they do use a  "fuel" that costs about 4 times more than gas.

Given this, is it cheaper then to still use your dishwasher? Or cheaper to hand-wash? 

There are dishwashers that will take a hot water supply, our dishwasher on eco mode uses 0.54kW with a cold water feed and 0.29kW with a hot water feed. In both cases it uses 6L of water.

Comparing to washing up is always going to be difficult as there are so many different ways of doing it... some fill the sink full of water, some have just a two or three inches, some take more of a shower approach with wetting dishes, soaping them in a dry sink then rinsing them all off. Some will use hot water, waiting for the hot water to come through if on a combi-boiler, others just use the temp of water coming out the tap. 

From others that have done the calcs the answer is that it can go either way depending on your style of washing up. Naturally this only considers the electricity/gas aspect of the equation but you then have the detergent (dishwasher tab/powders vary widely) and then the initial investment/maintenance.

Personally... a dishwasher is for convenience not moneysaving.

Agreed with the last bit tbf. I have way more dishes than I need, purely because I've got a dishwasher

I take it you've got a fancy Miele hot water dishwasher? 

Its not just Miele, for example Electrolux state most their dishwasher can be connected to a hot water supply as per the below

 https://www.electrolux.co.uk/support/support-articles/dishwashing/dishwashers/is-it-possible-to-connect-the-dishwasher-to-hot-water-supply/ 

waqasahmed

DullGreyGuy said:

waqasahmed said:

DullGreyGuy said:

waqasahmed said:

So  dishwashers may be more efficient and that's the case even if you get an F rated dishwasher 

Though, for the average house, dishwashers use electricity and the hot tap uses gas. Whilst dishwashers are more efficient, they do use a  "fuel" that costs about 4 times more than gas.

Given this, is it cheaper then to still use your dishwasher? Or cheaper to hand-wash? 

There are dishwashers that will take a hot water supply, our dishwasher on eco mode uses 0.54kW with a cold water feed and 0.29kW with a hot water feed. In both cases it uses 6L of water.

Comparing to washing up is always going to be difficult as there are so many different ways of doing it... some fill the sink full of water, some have just a two or three inches, some take more of a shower approach with wetting dishes, soaping them in a dry sink then rinsing them all off. Some will use hot water, waiting for the hot water to come through if on a combi-boiler, others just use the temp of water coming out the tap. 

From others that have done the calcs the answer is that it can go either way depending on your style of washing up. Naturally this only considers the electricity/gas aspect of the equation but you then have the detergent (dishwasher tab/powders vary widely) and then the initial investment/maintenance.

Personally... a dishwasher is for convenience not moneysaving.

Agreed with the last bit tbf. I have way more dishes than I need, purely because I've got a dishwasher

I take it you've got a fancy Miele hot water dishwasher? 

Its not just Miele, for example Electrolux state most their dishwasher can be connected to a hot water supply as per the below

 https://www.electrolux.co.uk/support/support-articles/dishwashing/dishwashers/is-it-possible-to-connect-the-dishwasher-to-hot-water-supply/ 

Very fair. Though realistically I've only bought a cheap dishwasher because it takes a week or so for me to fill it up with dishes that need to be washed. 

So it's only on once a week. Given that, I've just got myself a D rated Beko thing. I've got a Miele dryer and Wasing machine albeit not their washing machine that takes hot water 

But then I got the washing machine for £600 when it should be £2000 so it'd be a big jump in price to get the hot water one 

DullGreyGuy

waqasahmed said:

DullGreyGuy said:

waqasahmed said:

DullGreyGuy said:

waqasahmed said:

So  dishwashers may be more efficient and that's the case even if you get an F rated dishwasher 

Though, for the average house, dishwashers use electricity and the hot tap uses gas. Whilst dishwashers are more efficient, they do use a  "fuel" that costs about 4 times more than gas.

Given this, is it cheaper then to still use your dishwasher? Or cheaper to hand-wash? 

There are dishwashers that will take a hot water supply, our dishwasher on eco mode uses 0.54kW with a cold water feed and 0.29kW with a hot water feed. In both cases it uses 6L of water.

Comparing to washing up is always going to be difficult as there are so many different ways of doing it... some fill the sink full of water, some have just a two or three inches, some take more of a shower approach with wetting dishes, soaping them in a dry sink then rinsing them all off. Some will use hot water, waiting for the hot water to come through if on a combi-boiler, others just use the temp of water coming out the tap. 

From others that have done the calcs the answer is that it can go either way depending on your style of washing up. Naturally this only considers the electricity/gas aspect of the equation but you then have the detergent (dishwasher tab/powders vary widely) and then the initial investment/maintenance.

Personally... a dishwasher is for convenience not moneysaving.

Agreed with the last bit tbf. I have way more dishes than I need, purely because I've got a dishwasher

I take it you've got a fancy Miele hot water dishwasher? 

Its not just Miele, for example Electrolux state most their dishwasher can be connected to a hot water supply as per the below

 https://www.electrolux.co.uk/support/support-articles/dishwashing/dishwashers/is-it-possible-to-connect-the-dishwasher-to-hot-water-supply/ 

Very fair. Though realistically I've only bought a cheap dishwasher because it takes a week or so for me to fill it up with dishes that need to be washed. 

So it's only on once a week. Given that, I've just got myself a D rated Beko thing. I've got a Miele dryer and Wasing machine albeit not their washing machine that takes hot water 

But then I got the washing machine for £600 when it should be £2000 so it'd be a big jump in price to get the hot water one 

Yes, having looked at their products it on the surface looks very much like diminishing returns as you go up the product line... looking at two of their dishwashers there is a £540 difference in list price but only 3 difference according to their compare tool of the more expensive one having an internal light, a pasta programme and a "maxi-comfort" basket whereas the cheaper one has a "Extra-Comfort" basket. 

Either that's one very expensive lightbulb, there are more differences than they are letting on or they are really ramping up the markup on the higher level models.

Section62

Postik said:

I think they also use less water which might make the water usage cheaper if you're on a meter, but will make no difference if you're not.  The cost of water is also negligible compared to the cost of electricity and gas.

The volume of water used is important in terms of energy used to heat it.  The more water you use, the more energy needed to make it warm/hot, except for that you use as cold rinse water.

Also, it isn't just about the amount of hot water that goes in a bowl/sink, there's also the cost of heating the hot water that stays in the pipe when the hot tap is turned off (which is also a downside of using hot-fill appliances).

Modern dishwashers tend to be more efficient because they use the water more efficiently and only heat as much as is needed to do the washing.

Adamhoward20

I think it depends how you use it. My brother is awful for running the dish washer when it is only half full. We always try to use its full capacity.

We also use Ocotpus Go so have a cheaper tariff at night.

daivid

My kitchen tap is slow to get hot, making the dishwasher seem particularly efficient, 4.5L on the eco cycle, though it feels like I use almost as much water again when I clean the filters every few washes. I do still hand-wash sharp knives and wooden boards & spoons so that may weaken the economy argument as I don't maximise the use of the washing up water. The time saving is massive though.

waqasahmed

Adamhoward20 said:

I think it depends how you use it. My brother is awful for running the dish washer when it is only half full. We always try to use its full capacity.

We also use Ocotpus Go so have a cheaper tariff at night.

Equally, on the other side my mum's quite bad at leaving the hot tap running and with a decent amount of water coming out 

Whilst I'm more like I just need a tiny amount of water and that's fine.