Smart meter

Dex1208

Hi. My energy provider is edf. I keep getting messages and phone calls from them saying they need to upgrade my meters and they want to install a smart meter. 
Do i have to have a smart meter, or even a new meter? Do smart meters function properly? I would like to know the pros and cons before i make a decision.

energyskeptic

Hi  We had solar panels installed and what happened was that our traditional meter ran backwards when the panels were producing more than we were using.  But we had to have a smart meter as we are also installing a battery.  The riddle I am trying to resolve right now is whether or not smart meters lose us money.  As the old meter reduced our total usage as the panels kicked in we were, in effect, saving the full price, say 35p, for each Kwh knocked off our meter reading. Now we have a smart meter I don't believe it goes backwards.  It just logs usage... and, here's the sting in the tail, it will under an Octopus tariff only give us 15p per Kwh we put into the grid.  Have we been conned?

QrizB

Welcome to the forum @energyskeptic

energyskeptic said:

Hi  We had solar panels installed and what happened was that our traditional meter ran backwards when the panels were producing more than we were using.

The UK does not have "net metering". There are separate tariffs for the supply of electricity and for export. When your meter was running backwards, you were defrauding your energy supplier.

energyskeptic said:

Now we have a smart meter I don't believe it goes backwards.  It just logs usage... and, here's the sting in the tail, it will under an Octopus tariff only give us 15p per Kwh we put into the grid.

Now your meter works as intended, and you have stopped defrauding your energy supplier. This is correct.

energyskeptic said:

Have we been conned?

No, you have not been conned. You have potentially been saved from a very nasty back-bill.

QrizB

Dex1208 said:

Hi. My energy provider is edf. I keep getting messages and phone calls from them saying they need to upgrade my meters and they want to install a smart meter. 
Do i have to have a smart meter, or even a new meter? Do smart meters function properly? I would like to know the pros and cons before i make a decision.

@Dex1208 this is regularly discussed in the Energy forum.

Yes, meters have a life.

Yes, EDF can replace it and they do not need your permission.

Yes, smart meters function properly. Over half of UK properties are already fitted with them.

[Deleted User]

Have we been conned?

Harsh as this might sound, the only one ‘conned’ is your energy supplier. The responsibility was on you to report that your analogue meter was not fitted with a reverse backstop.

A smart meter records both import and export separately. For SEG payments, the meter needs two MPANs.

Mobtr

Dex1208 said:

Hi. My energy provider is edf. I keep getting messages and phone calls from them saying they need to upgrade my meters and they want to install a smart meter. 
Do i have to have a smart meter, or even a new meter? Do smart meters function properly? I would like to know the pros and cons before i make a decision.

Smart meters are just like old meters in that they record the energy you have used & show a reading that you get billed to. 

The difference, providing the meter can be commissioned, is that it sends the reading to your supplier so you don’t have to.  

If it can’t be commissioned then it just works like your old one. 

Not sure why people get so het up about having a smart meter, it’s just a meter. Mine has saved me a fortune 

gutovicky

Yeah, but if a Smart meter is 'just a meter' - why does it need to be Smart?
[....for me, saving me the 'bother' of reading my own meters isn't enough of a reason to swap...].

I am in exactly the same situation as Dex1208: I'm a EDF customer and they are wanting to replace my 'old' meters with new ones - and encouraging me to 'upgrade' to Smart meters. 
Like Dex1208, I'm seeking reassurance...    (because there have been problems with Smart meters in the past).
Do we have evidence that the current, 'new generation' of Smart meters are ultra accurate & reliable?


Mobtr, please be more specific - HOW has your Smart meter saved you a fortune?

My understanding is that Smart meters will allow the household to monitor the energy they're consuming, hour-by-hour, appliance-by-appliance - so that they can adjust their habits, or even replace appliances (?!), and thereby make savings... 

However, if (like me) you're in a SMALL household, with just the regular, BASIC range of appliances, there will be much less "wriggle-room" for cutting consumption & making savings...
So what other 'advantages' are there in having a Smart meter over a conventional meter? 

Also, [it just occurs to me] do Smart meters transmit on WiFi?....   
What if you live in a slightly remote area, where good WiFi signal can be intermittent?

[Sorry if this has all been discussed recently in other threads...]
Thanks for your time, Vicky

CSI_Yorkshire

gutovicky said:

(because there have been problems with Smart meters in the past).

Rarely, and overblown when they did happen.

gutovicky said:

Do we have evidence that the current, 'new generation' of Smart meters are ultra accurate & reliable?

How accurate is your existing meter?  Do you know?  If not, why does "ultra accurate" matter for a smart meter?  What would you be comparing it to?

Yes, they are accurate, by the definition of accurate appropriate for the circumstances.

gutovicky said:

So what other 'advantages' are there in having a Smart meter over a conventional meter? 

Access to almost all likely time-of-use tariffs and to schemes like the ones where people got paid hundreds of pounds when the grid was short in the winter.

gutovicky said:

Also, [it just occurs to me] do Smart meters transmit on WiFi?....   
What if you live in a slightly remote area, where good WiFi signal can be intermittent?

I don't know where you get your WiFi from, but mine is in my house and whether the house is remote or not doesn't matter.

If the smart meter can't communicate, you just give a meter reading like you always have done.

Spoonie_Turtle

gutovicky said:

Yeah, but if a Smart meter is 'just a meter' - why does it need to be Smart?

Because they aren't fitting non-smart ones any more.  Unless there's a "good reason" not to (such as installation being impossible for some reason, not that the customer just doesn't want one).

If it doesn't communicate as a smart meter then people would be in the same position as having a traditional, non-smart one except it won't be at the end of its certified life.

The main two advantages of communicating smart meters, for the customer, are that the usage data can help pinpoint where energy can be saved, and they give access to smart tariffs which are designed for people to save money by shifting energy usage to cheaper periods.  A bit like Economy 7 but more nuanced and more useful for different profiles of usage.

[Deleted User]

HOW has your Smart meter saved you a fortune?

It gives you access to smart meter only time-of-use tariffs such as Octopus Agile. What are you paying per kWh for your electricity. These are tomorrow’s Agile prices. When the wind blows and demand is low, suppliers will pay the consumer to use electricity.

Mobtr

gutovicky said:

Yeah, but if a Smart meter is 'just a meter' - why does it need to be Smart?
[....for me, saving me the 'bother' of reading my own meters isn't enough of a reason to swap...].

I am in exactly the same situation as Dex1208: I'm a EDF customer and they are wanting to replace my 'old' meters with new ones - and encouraging me to 'upgrade' to Smart meters. 
Like Dex1208, I'm seeking reassurance...    (because there have been problems with Smart meters in the past).
Do we have evidence that the current, 'new generation' of Smart meters are ultra accurate & reliable?


Mobtr, please be more specific - HOW has your Smart meter saved you a fortune?

My understanding is that Smart meters will allow the household to monitor the energy they're consuming, hour-by-hour, appliance-by-appliance - so that they can adjust their habits, or even replace appliances (?!), and thereby make savings... 

However, if (like me) you're in a SMALL household, with just the regular, BASIC range of appliances, there will be much less "wriggle-room" for cutting consumption & making savings...
So what other 'advantages' are there in having a Smart meter over a conventional meter? 

Also, [it just occurs to me] do Smart meters transmit on WiFi?....   
What if you live in a slightly remote area, where good WiFi signal can be intermittent?

[Sorry if this has all been discussed recently in other threads...]
Thanks for your time, Vicky

It’s saving me money because when it was fitted the IHD allowed me to see how much it was costing me on a daily basis. Because if this I made quite a few changes, hot water now only on for 1 hr a day when previously on for 4, switched things off etc when previously I didn’t give it a thought