Sutcliffe Park - Gemini Parking Solutions PCN

cesurman

Recently received the attached PCN as the driver assumed PCNs issued on the windscreen and stayed in the car. However, Gemini issued the PCN using ANPR. What could be done about this, is this PCN a valid one? Did the PPC comply with the law?
The contravention occurred on 10 May, PCN was issued on 25 May, and I received the letter on 1 June.

Location: Sutcliffe Park leisure centre car park (will complain to them in the first instance)

PCN photos: https://photos.app.goo.gl/M9zD31qV98VZuN4EA

KeithP

That PCN was issued too late to be able to hold the keeper liable for anything the driver may have done.
Do not give away the driver's details and the keeper will be safe.

Coupon-mad

Just copy the easy appeal you see in any APCOA, Highview or Smart Parking thread.

Then ignore them when the keeper loses at IAS or if Gemini pretend that only the driver can appeal.  Ignore them.

But first try PLAN A (read the NEWBIES thread).

Umkomaas

Their statement commencing 'Please be warned ......... on the assumption that you were the driver' has no basis in law. I would put in a strong complaint to the DVLA (sending them a copy of the NtK, that the warning is misleading and there is no evidence to back their assumption. Just rattle their cage via the DVLA. Send complaint to:

ccrt@dvla.gov.uk (and) KADOEservice.support@dvla.gov.uk - send to both.

The above is in addition to sending in an initial appeal to Gemini as per the blue text template in the NEWBIES FAQ Announcement, first post.

B789

Umkomaas said:

Their statement commencing 'Please be warned ......... on the assumption that you were the driver' has no basis in law. I would put in a strong complaint to the DVLA (sending them a copy of the NtK, that the warning is misleading and there is no evidence to back their assumption. Just rattle their cage via the DVLA. Send complaint to:

ccrt@dvla.gov.uk (and) KADOEservice.support@dvla.gov.uk - send to both.

The above is in addition to sending in an initial appeal to Gemini as per the blue text template in the NEWBIES FAQ Announcement, first post.

Totally non-PoFA. Not only does it not mention PoFA but as already pointed out above, even if it attempted to be, it fails the timing of issue and the wording. Yes, appeal using the blue template and tell them to go chase the driver as you are the RK.

Coupon-mad

On the other Gemini thread, I think last month they were outright refusing to let people appeal unless they said who was driving.

That needs a major complaint to the DVLA.

cesurman

Below is what I will be sending as an initial appeal.

Re PCN number:

I dispute your 'parking charge', as the keeper of the vehicle. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner as well as DVLA.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. Since your PCN is a vague template, I require an explanation of the allegation and your evidence. You must include a close-up actual photograph of the sign you contend was at the location on the material date as well as your images of the vehicle.

If the allegation concerns a PDT machine, the data supplied in response to this appeal must include the record of payments made - showing partial VRNs - and an explanation of the reason for the PCN because your Notice does not explain it.

If the allegation involves an alleged overstay of minutes, your evidence must include the actual grace period agreed upon by the landowner.

As your Parking Charge Notice does not comply with the requirements of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (Schedule 4), you are, in law, unable to hold the registered keeper of the vehicle liable for the parking charge; I suggest therefore that you contact the driver. As there is no legal requirement placed on the registered keeper to identify the driver, I will not be doing so.

Coupon-mad

That's fine but expect them to say what they said on the Gemini thread in May, which is why I said prepare to report them to the DVLA.

cesurman

By the way, due to their lazy process, I've received another Parking charge from them. 

Contravention Date: 17/05/2023
Issue Date: 31/05/2023
NTK received: 07/06/2023

The rest is the same as above. Sending the same template as above? Is the timing of the issue, in their favour this time? 

Coupon-mad

No it's not.

And it's not just about the dates.

cesurman

Umkomaas said:

Their statement commencing 'Please be warned ......... on the assumption that you were the driver' has no basis in law. I would put in a strong complaint to the DVLA (sending them a copy of the NtK, that the warning is misleading and there is no evidence to back their assumption. Just rattle their cage via the DVLA. Send complaint to:

ccrt@dvla.gov.uk (and) KADOEservice.support@dvla.gov.uk - send to both.

The above is in addition to sending in an initial appeal to Gemini as per the blue text template in the NEWBIES FAQ Announcement, first post.

Complaint sent.