Ripped off of 7k by fraudulent misrepresentation

[Deleted User]

Dataless said:

Deleted_User said:

nyermen said:

One extra thing - possibly just clutching at straws - but if the electronics contains private data, doesn't that breach GDPR (known disclosure is criminal isn't it?).  That could make the police more interested?

Thanks, I've threatened him with this as a lot of the tablets are accessible with pictures of people, children, general information, emails etc but are of low value and cracked screens. I have not had a reply sense emailing him with this nightmare.

If it were me, I would attempt to identify the people who have accounts, I would use 3rd party tools to crack open their accounts (if you have physical control of a device you are half way there to logging in).

The lawful purpose of doing this would be to contact the person who owned it before and put their data on it in order to tell them you bought this online and are trying to trace how they disposed of it, was it a return, did they bin it or what.

If the former owner says "I took it into XYZ electrical who told me they would properly dispose of it and nuke my data" then you call XYZ and try to determine who they gave or sold it to.  You might find even find it is an employee or be given another company name. 

This achieves two things, first for Court it shows the description was inaccurate, it was not a 14 day return etc.  Second you may get this person blacklisted by XYZ who might be a big PLC with stores on the high street.

You then rinse and repeat for every device.

I would have thought you would have been given a list of kit and been able to verify their value, I would never part with £7k never mind transfer it electronically.

There are videos on YouTube about people who buy Amazon returns by the pallet and about every 3rd one is full of junk.

Even if you do not resolve it you have probably helped a lot of this community from making a similar mistake.

Yes I was given a full breakdown. I calculated everything and thought I would do ok. I have emails stating they are no fault 14 day returns.

On the subject of data, some do not have pin numbers so I can see there data including pictures, email, etc without 'hacking'.I obviously am not interested in looking but that's hardly the point...

born_again

Would be interesting to think what people think 
 NO FAULT 14 DAYS RETURNS
means?

So I can read that as

No Fault item, returned in 14 day consumer rights timescale, change of mind.

Or

 "No user fault for damage" "Returned in 14 Days of notification"


How many did @Deleted_User get for the £7K?

Dataless

Deleted_User said:

Maybe I'm clutching at straws here but I can tell what department store they have come from.....

Whilst that might not help you get your money back it may help you in getting him and any company he is a Director of banned as a buyer of this kit.

You could try to identify as many as possible former owners and use them to agitate the company that sold this kit with their data on it without nuking it first.

Many companies promise to wipe the data, so his company may be in breach of the contract with them.

If you have time on your hands you can mess things up for this individual and help others but cutting off his supply.

You can let him know that you are "just gettin started" so if he does not return your money and take the goods back you will continue.

eskbanker

born_again said:

Would be interesting to think what people think 
 NO FAULT 14 DAYS RETURNS
means?

So I can read that as

No Fault item, returned in 14 day consumer rights timescale, change of mind.

Or

 "No user fault for damage" "Returned in 14 Days of notification"

Personally I'd read it the first way and feel sure that's the impression the seller was trying to convey!

[Deleted User]

eskbanker said:

born_again said:

Would be interesting to think what people think 
 NO FAULT 14 DAYS RETURNS
means?

So I can read that as

No Fault item, returned in 14 day consumer rights timescale, change of mind.

Or

 "No user fault for damage" "Returned in 14 Days of notification"

Personally I'd read it the first way and feel sure that's the impression the seller was trying to convey!

Look they all have labels on stating at least 3 months old not 14 day returns. They look like they have been returned on there insurance. They state 'NOT FOR RESALE'. It includes the company name, date bought, date returned, reason for return, branch, barcode, item number and customer name.

Dataless

Deleted_User said:

Dataless said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Deleted_User said:

I have unfortunately paid by bank transfer for £7k for a pallet of electrical goods. I have obviously been deliberately defrauded.

I was told they were 14 day non fault returns 90% boxed. They were 90% smashed to pieces or locked with user accounts on. They were pc tablets. Some have peoples information on but 99% are for the trash. This happened yesterday and I immediately did some research and he guy is named in a newspaper as a well known fraudster. He is also all over the internet with 100's of people naming him with awful tales of deception.

I phoned my bank yesterday but they said contact Action Fraud.

I am seriously unwell atm and should have known better. I'm just looking for some calm advice as i'm feeling very distressed.

It is a company which is on companies house but on further investigation it looks like it's being wound up. He has a history of opening company's and going bankrupt owing hundreds of thousands.

He is a local man, I've been to his office and I'm aware of where he lives(If that's not a con too).

I don't know where to go next:(

Thank you in advance

Your only option is to start a legal claim for the money, so letter before action, followed by court action. There are unlikely to be any consumer rights in this situation as it seems like it was a business transaction. Before commencing the legal action you would also need to look at the terms and conditions of the sale and how they relate to the goods received, does the detailed description of the goods match with what you received once they were delivered, what does it say on the invoice? 

As for the prospect of recovering the funds, if it is a Ltd company and it has no funds the chances are very low, although in theory the Director could be personally liable if he was trading whilst insolvent, it does not make recovering the funds likely. 

On what basis were you buying the goods, sole trader or your own limited company?

People say business transactions are not covered by the Consumer Rights Act (2015) but they ARE covered by the Sale of Goods Act (1978) which remains in force and has more or less the same "fit for purpose" "as described" etc but a companies terms and conditions play more of a part.

You are right about the LTD company being easy to wind up, it would turn on the name on the bank account it was paid into.

If I gave you this guys name you would be shocked. I obviously can't.

It was paid into his named account. i.e. 'his name'- trading as 'name'. There is no trace of this name on companies hoise.

I presume he is down as a sole trader as the the last company was wound and anything left was 'The Crowns' property. This is on company's house.

Anyway I think court is the only option....

That is great, you have a personal action against him, that changes everything.  It means you can gather all your evidence and go to the small claims court, If the account says "Trading As" that makes him trading as a business, but you could easily be a hobbyist, looking to get things working for you, maybe you sell a few things on ebay but that does not make you a trader.

So you would make your Particulars of Claim use both the Consumer Rights Act (2015) and/or the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and let the Judge decide

You could call LBC Radio Consumer Lawyer on tonight at 9pm, Dean or Daniel I think.

Feel free to PM me his name and the names of any companies, probably won't help your case but might spot something or just be curious what footprints he leaves online. 

Dataless

Deleted_User said:

Dataless said:

Deleted_User said:

nyermen said:

One extra thing - possibly just clutching at straws - but if the electronics contains private data, doesn't that breach GDPR (known disclosure is criminal isn't it?).  That could make the police more interested?

Thanks, I've threatened him with this as a lot of the tablets are accessible with pictures of people, children, general information, emails etc but are of low value and cracked screens. I have not had a reply sense emailing him with this nightmare.

If it were me, I would attempt to identify the people who have accounts, I would use 3rd party tools to crack open their accounts (if you have physical control of a device you are half way there to logging in).

The lawful purpose of doing this would be to contact the person who owned it before and put their data on it in order to tell them you bought this online and are trying to trace how they disposed of it, was it a return, did they bin it or what.

If the former owner says "I took it into XYZ electrical who told me they would properly dispose of it and nuke my data" then you call XYZ and try to determine who they gave or sold it to.  You might find even find it is an employee or be given another company name. 

This achieves two things, first for Court it shows the description was inaccurate, it was not a 14 day return etc.  Second you may get this person blacklisted by XYZ who might be a big PLC with stores on the high street.

You then rinse and repeat for every device.

I would have thought you would have been given a list of kit and been able to verify their value, I would never part with £7k never mind transfer it electronically.

There are videos on YouTube about people who buy Amazon returns by the pallet and about every 3rd one is full of junk.

Even if you do not resolve it you have probably helped a lot of this community from making a similar mistake.

Yes I was given a full breakdown. I calculated everything and thought I would do ok. I have emails stating they are no fault 14 day returns.

On the subject of data, some do not have pin numbers so I can see there data including pictures, email, etc without 'hacking'.I obviously am not interested in looking but that's hardly the point...

You don't say what type of devices they were, modern Ipads or PC's, it it is the latter you can remove hard drive and there are tools online that will recover the data.

[Deleted User]

Dataless said:

Deleted_User said:

Dataless said:

Deleted_User said:

nyermen said:

One extra thing - possibly just clutching at straws - but if the electronics contains private data, doesn't that breach GDPR (known disclosure is criminal isn't it?).  That could make the police more interested?

Thanks, I've threatened him with this as a lot of the tablets are accessible with pictures of people, children, general information, emails etc but are of low value and cracked screens. I have not had a reply sense emailing him with this nightmare.

If it were me, I would attempt to identify the people who have accounts, I would use 3rd party tools to crack open their accounts (if you have physical control of a device you are half way there to logging in).

The lawful purpose of doing this would be to contact the person who owned it before and put their data on it in order to tell them you bought this online and are trying to trace how they disposed of it, was it a return, did they bin it or what.

If the former owner says "I took it into XYZ electrical who told me they would properly dispose of it and nuke my data" then you call XYZ and try to determine who they gave or sold it to.  You might find even find it is an employee or be given another company name. 

This achieves two things, first for Court it shows the description was inaccurate, it was not a 14 day return etc.  Second you may get this person blacklisted by XYZ who might be a big PLC with stores on the high street.

You then rinse and repeat for every device.

I would have thought you would have been given a list of kit and been able to verify their value, I would never part with £7k never mind transfer it electronically.

There are videos on YouTube about people who buy Amazon returns by the pallet and about every 3rd one is full of junk.

Even if you do not resolve it you have probably helped a lot of this community from making a similar mistake.

Yes I was given a full breakdown. I calculated everything and thought I would do ok. I have emails stating they are no fault 14 day returns.

On the subject of data, some do not have pin numbers so I can see there data including pictures, email, etc without 'hacking'.I obviously am not interested in looking but that's hardly the point...

You don't say what type of devices they were, modern Ipads or PC's, it it is the latter you can remove hard drive and there are tools online that will recover the data.

modern tablets currently on sale in store.

powerful_Rogue

Dataless said:

Deleted_User said:

Dataless said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Deleted_User said:

I have unfortunately paid by bank transfer for £7k for a pallet of electrical goods. I have obviously been deliberately defrauded.

I was told they were 14 day non fault returns 90% boxed. They were 90% smashed to pieces or locked with user accounts on. They were pc tablets. Some have peoples information on but 99% are for the trash. This happened yesterday and I immediately did some research and he guy is named in a newspaper as a well known fraudster. He is also all over the internet with 100's of people naming him with awful tales of deception.

I phoned my bank yesterday but they said contact Action Fraud.

I am seriously unwell atm and should have known better. I'm just looking for some calm advice as i'm feeling very distressed.

It is a company which is on companies house but on further investigation it looks like it's being wound up. He has a history of opening company's and going bankrupt owing hundreds of thousands.

He is a local man, I've been to his office and I'm aware of where he lives(If that's not a con too).

I don't know where to go next:(

Thank you in advance

Your only option is to start a legal claim for the money, so letter before action, followed by court action. There are unlikely to be any consumer rights in this situation as it seems like it was a business transaction. Before commencing the legal action you would also need to look at the terms and conditions of the sale and how they relate to the goods received, does the detailed description of the goods match with what you received once they were delivered, what does it say on the invoice? 

As for the prospect of recovering the funds, if it is a Ltd company and it has no funds the chances are very low, although in theory the Director could be personally liable if he was trading whilst insolvent, it does not make recovering the funds likely. 

On what basis were you buying the goods, sole trader or your own limited company?

People say business transactions are not covered by the Consumer Rights Act (2015) but they ARE covered by the Sale of Goods Act (1978) which remains in force and has more or less the same "fit for purpose" "as described" etc but a companies terms and conditions play more of a part.

You are right about the LTD company being easy to wind up, it would turn on the name on the bank account it was paid into.

If I gave you this guys name you would be shocked. I obviously can't.

It was paid into his named account. i.e. 'his name'- trading as 'name'. There is no trace of this name on companies hoise.

I presume he is down as a sole trader as the the last company was wound and anything left was 'The Crowns' property. This is on company's house.

Anyway I think court is the only option....

That is great, you have a personal action against him, that changes everything.  It means you can gather all your evidence and go to the small claims court, If the account says "Trading As" that makes him trading as a business, but you could easily be a hobbyist, looking to get things working for you, maybe you sell a few things on ebay but that does not make you a trader.

So you would make your Particulars of Claim use both the Consumer Rights Act (2015) and/or the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and let the Judge decide

You could call LBC Radio Consumer Lawyer on tonight at 9pm, Dean or Daniel I think.

Feel free to PM me his name and the names of any companies, probably won't help your case but might spot something or just be curious what footprints he leaves online. 

That wouldn't be true though, OP has already stated he has purchased these to sell them as a business on ebay.

[Deleted User]

powerful_Rogue said:

Dataless said:

Deleted_User said:

Dataless said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Deleted_User said:

I have unfortunately paid by bank transfer for £7k for a pallet of electrical goods. I have obviously been deliberately defrauded.

I was told they were 14 day non fault returns 90% boxed. They were 90% smashed to pieces or locked with user accounts on. They were pc tablets. Some have peoples information on but 99% are for the trash. This happened yesterday and I immediately did some research and he guy is named in a newspaper as a well known fraudster. He is also all over the internet with 100's of people naming him with awful tales of deception.

I phoned my bank yesterday but they said contact Action Fraud.

I am seriously unwell atm and should have known better. I'm just looking for some calm advice as i'm feeling very distressed.

It is a company which is on companies house but on further investigation it looks like it's being wound up. He has a history of opening company's and going bankrupt owing hundreds of thousands.

He is a local man, I've been to his office and I'm aware of where he lives(If that's not a con too).

I don't know where to go next:(

Thank you in advance

Your only option is to start a legal claim for the money, so letter before action, followed by court action. There are unlikely to be any consumer rights in this situation as it seems like it was a business transaction. Before commencing the legal action you would also need to look at the terms and conditions of the sale and how they relate to the goods received, does the detailed description of the goods match with what you received once they were delivered, what does it say on the invoice? 

As for the prospect of recovering the funds, if it is a Ltd company and it has no funds the chances are very low, although in theory the Director could be personally liable if he was trading whilst insolvent, it does not make recovering the funds likely. 

On what basis were you buying the goods, sole trader or your own limited company?

People say business transactions are not covered by the Consumer Rights Act (2015) but they ARE covered by the Sale of Goods Act (1978) which remains in force and has more or less the same "fit for purpose" "as described" etc but a companies terms and conditions play more of a part.

You are right about the LTD company being easy to wind up, it would turn on the name on the bank account it was paid into.

If I gave you this guys name you would be shocked. I obviously can't.

It was paid into his named account. i.e. 'his name'- trading as 'name'. There is no trace of this name on companies hoise.

I presume he is down as a sole trader as the the last company was wound and anything left was 'The Crowns' property. This is on company's house.

Anyway I think court is the only option....

That is great, you have a personal action against him, that changes everything.  It means you can gather all your evidence and go to the small claims court, If the account says "Trading As" that makes him trading as a business, but you could easily be a hobbyist, looking to get things working for you, maybe you sell a few things on ebay but that does not make you a trader.

So you would make your Particulars of Claim use both the Consumer Rights Act (2015) and/or the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and let the Judge decide

You could call LBC Radio Consumer Lawyer on tonight at 9pm, Dean or Daniel I think.

Feel free to PM me his name and the names of any companies, probably won't help your case but might spot something or just be curious what footprints he leaves online. 

That wouldn't be true though, OP has already stated he has purchased these to sell them as a business on ebay.

I said I was going to give it a go. I have a normal job too....