LBC - Gladstones - Parking Control Management - Kindly requesting advice and review

ifish12

I hope you all have been keeping well. I am someone who has been reading the posts on this forum group for a couple of years now regarding information and advice on how to beat PCNs. I have at many times benefitted from the advice posted here and genuinely appreciate all the input and time you all give in helping out your fellow strangers. I have never had to request assistance up until now and would greatly appreciate your advice.   

I am reaching out to yourselves regarding a letter before claim I received in the post recently.  On the Saturday the 22nd I received a letter in the post from Gladstone’s dated on the 14th (April 2023). To my surprise it was a Letter before Claim for a Debt of £850. These were from dates ranging from 2019 to 2021.

Now just to give some context it was for a number PCN`s managed by PCM (Parking Control Management) in a Area or square of where I live. My father had the singular permit allowed by the enforcement company (PCM) for his car.

 Up until last year I did not hear anything of those tickets, it seems they have accumulated them all after ignoring the various PCN`s being sent towards me.  

 

Now as you can understand that is quite a bit of money they are asking for. I am hoping it is beatable with the advice and information presented here on the forum.

I have been reading the forum articles as I usually do including the Newbie’s Page and have tried to understand the Plan of action for myself.

There are a few things however I am still a little bit confused about and would appreciate some advice or input from yourselves if I am on the right track.

I hope this is ok,

Here is my action plan from what I have understood from the newbie’s page and the other similar posts.

1.       Request a SAR from Parking Control Management (not sure of timeframe)

2.       Contact Gladstone’s stating I am seeking debt advice. (Not sure on timeframe), I should use the following email template

a.       Your email tells the solicitor:
(a) I am seeking debt advice but I deny any debt and the case must be put 'on hold' for not less than 30 days under the PAP for debt claims 2017.
(b) I have sent your client a SAR
(c) also confirm your correct 'address for service' if you've moved and the PPC has two addresses.

3.       Now as I understand PCM is accredited by the IAS there is no point trying to submit a Appeal with them as it will be rejected as is expected due to the unethical relationships between Gladstone’s, IAS and the IPC.

a.       Do I then wait for a secondary letter from Gladstone’s with a Claim form date to submit a AOS (Acknowledgment of service)?

                                                               i.      If this is so how long do I wait to submit this?

b.      Do I then have to submit a MCOL?

4.       From what I understand I then have 4 weeks to submit a defence which will go to court to defend myself

5.       Now I am quite concerned with regards to my DEFENCE. I am unsure as to whether I can win this in court as I did not have a valid reason to be parking there.

 I do wish to point out the following:

a.       The name on the LBC form is incorrect. It has my name spelt incorrectly.

b.      I no longer own the car and am not the registered keeper as of November.

6.       Will the following points mentioned above help me in my defence?

7.       Will i have to physically/remotely present myself in court or will my defence submission be sufficient?

Are you able to advise on if I can actually win this in Court and how I would plan out a Defence?

Have I missed anything out or is my action plan incorrect in any way?

Any further help would be appreciated.

Please review the documents below I recieved from Gladstones, 

KeithP

Hello and welcome.

ifish12 said:

1.       Request a SAR from Parking Control Management (not sure of timeframe)

Yes, do that anytime. The information returned will be far more use at Witness Statement time.

ifish12 said:

2.       Contact Gladstone’s stating I am seeking debt advice. (Not sure on timeframe), I should use the following email template

a.       Your email tells the solicitor:
(a) I am seeking debt advice but I deny any debt and the case must be put 'on hold' for not less than 30 days under the PAP for debt claims 2017.
(b) I have sent your client a SAR
(c) also confirm your correct 'address for service' if you've moved and the PPC has two addresses.

Yes, do that somewhere around 10th May.

ifish12 said:

3.       Now as I understand PCM is accredited by the IAS there is no point trying to submit a Appeal with them as it will be rejected as is expected due to the unethical relationships between Gladstone’s, IAS and the IPC.

Absolutely right. You are far beyond any appeal opportunity.

ifish12 said:

a.       Do I then wait for a secondary letter from Gladstone’s with a Claim form date to submit a AOS (Acknowledgment of service)?                                                               i.      If this is so how long do I wait to submit this?

b.      Do I then have to submit a MCOL?

You are getting a bit ahead of yourself. That comes after you have received a County Court Claim Form which will not come from Gladstones but from the County Court Business Centre in Northampton.

That's probably enough to think about at the moment.

It is good that you are trying to 'plan ahead', and if you post again on this thread when you receive a County Court Claim Form - sometime in high summer - and we'll help you further.
When you do post again, please tell us the Issue Date on your Claim Form.

Not_A_Hope

You should read the Newbies thread which will answer most of your questions.

1. Send the SAR ASAP.
2. To delay Gladstones submitting a county court claim as much as possible send them the ‘debt advice’ letter just before their 30 days runs out.
3. It is highly likely any appeal you made to PCM or the IAS would have been rejected as that doesn’t earn them any money.
3/4. Once Gladstones submit a claim to the court the CCBC will send you a claim form which you will need to acknowledge using MCOL. If you provide the date of issue @keithp usually provides dates by which you should respond and the date by which you must email your defence.
5. The template defence has several defence points which may be useful. I would start by looking at what your fathers tenancy / leaseholder agreement states or doesn’t state regarding parking. 

5a. An incorrect name on the LBC makes no difference.
5b. Not owning the car any longer also makes no difference.
6. ?
7. You will need to attend court or make yourself available for a remote hearing depending on the current arrangements at your local court.

Many PCNs can be beaten with the help of this forum. 

Most of the defence is written for you if you look at the Template Defence thread. All you need to write a couple of paragraphs. Later you will also need to write a witness statement and send it to your local court. Have a look at the residential thread by @mouse007.

By defending even if you lost you would probably pay less than what Gladstones are claiming as they have added an extra £70 to each PCN which the courts often will not allow.

B789

Re #7, there is also the option to have the claim "heard on papers" but you really, really do not want to select that option when the claim arrives. It is almost a 100% guarantee that you would lose unless you can write a defence that is so gripping and persuasive that a judge would just swoon and throw the claim out. Not likely!

ifish12

You guys are all an amazing bunch honestly. I literally posted this last night and already multiple responses. 

Thank you so much 

Coupon-mad

ifish12 said:

You guys are all an amazing bunch honestly. I literally posted this last night and already multiple responses. 

Thank you so much 

Because they've added 5 x £70 you may as well defend it all the way because even if you lost in court you'd pay less.

I notice the LBC has an error - no court or legal fees are shown (= two lots of £70) which matters not at this stage but might be worth a mention as part of a course of unreasonable conduct (misleading you about the costs implications).

When you get the SAR back, please go through PCM's photos of each of the 5 incidents with a fine tooth comb.  Look at

(a). whether they have evidenced "no permit" with VERY clear photos of the whole dashboard, and

(b). what the time of first and last photos is (you should be able to argue in defence that no grace period was allowed for you to have time to fetch the permit).

When you defend, state that the family does have a permit which would have to be swapped between cars each time or fetched from inside (upstairs?) premises and PCM allowed no fair grace period, meaning a driver is assumed in breach the second they switch off the ignition.  Where a permit is required from inside a flat, that cannot be a fair contract.

WHAT YOU DO NOT SAY IN DEFENCE, IS WHAT YOU TOLD US ABOUT THAT PERMIT. I SUGGEST YOU EDIT THAT OUT OF YOUR POST!

ifish12

Coupon-mad said:

ifish12 said:

You guys are all an amazing bunch honestly. I literally posted this last night and already multiple responses. 

Thank you so much 

Because they've added 5 x £70 you may as well defend it all the way because even if you lost in court you'd pay less.

I notice the LBC has an error - no court or legal fees are shown (= two lots of £70) which matters not at this stage but might be worth a mention as part of a course of unreasonable conduct (misleading you about the costs implications).

When you get the SAR back, please go through PCM's photos of each of the 5 incidents with a fine tooth comb.  Look at

(a). whether they have evidenced "no permit" with VERY clear photos of the whole dashboard, and

(b). what the time of first and last photos is (you should be able to argue in defence that no grace period was allowed for you to have time to fetch the permit).

When you defend, state that the family does have a permit which would have to be swapped between cars each time or fetched from inside (upstairs?) premises and PCM allowed no fair grace period, meaning a driver is assumed in breach the second they switch off the ignition.  Where a permit is required from inside a flat, that cannot be a fair contract.

WHAT YOU DO NOT SAY IN DEFENCE, IS WHAT YOU TOLD US ABOUT THAT PERMIT. I SUGGEST YOU EDIT THAT OUT OF YOUR POST!

Understood ok.  Thank you for updating me on this 

ifish12

Looks like I won’t be able to edit as im still a newbie unfortunately. 

Oh well 🤷🏻‍♂️

Coupon-mad

But a Board Guide can. Just ask them.

ifish12

Dear All, 

I hope you all have been keeping well, 

I am reaching out to yourselves with a update, 

So I have already notified Gladstones to put  my case on hold as per the PAP. Still have not heard from them as of yet which is expected. 

I have also recieved the SAR from PCM. 

·         All of the PCN`s have pictures with a time and date stamp –

o    Pictures  in the timestamp indicate images all within 1-2 minutes. So not prolonging 15 minutes at all.

·         All of the PCN`s also have a clear image showing my dash without a parking permit 

All of the PCN`s also have the following points 

·          This notice is given to you in line with Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (‘the Act’), in relation to a parking contravention that occurred

·         This Parking Charge Notice relates to the period of parking that immediately followed the time specified above and was incurred for the following reason

o     “Parked without clearly displaying a valid PCM UK Ltd permit (at time of enforcement

·         The vehicle in question was photographed to be parked in an area managed by Parking Control Management (UK)

·         The terms and conditions for the use of the land at Vulcan Square - E14 are clearly stipulated by signage posted throughout the area

ifish12

-          I understand at this stage I am just to await a Court Hearing from Gladstones so I can submit a MCOL.

-          I am then to write up a defence. And prepare for court ?

-          Are the members of this board able to help me prepare for my defence ?

-          When this happens would I have to physically turn up to court? I don’t live near Northampton county court.

-          I also wanted to ask if someone court direct me on how I can contact a board guide to get my initial post edited.