Van broken 1 month over 3 month warranty.

tightauldgit

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80027958#Comment_80027958

The trouble also though is people saying "you bought a used car so its your problem. It's just bad luck" when its not actually clear that is the case and may be getting people to give up prematurely.

born_again

One thing here. Is OP is talking about DPF filter, now this may have been on the verge of being to the point of wanting either a cemical clean, or replacing when bought. Very hard to tell.

Then factor in the type of drivng OP may be doing. Lots of short trips. It has tipped it over the edge.

Is this a faulty car? When you are talking a consumable part (allbeit a expensive one) Should something like this has to be excluded from the 6 month rule, or pretty much every diesel car that is sold 2nd hand is potentially going to have this issue.

Kind of drops into the same as, well my tyre or brakes have worn out within 6 months of purchase.

You are not buying new, so have to temper expertations. As should the consumer regulations. On what to expect.

Just like the 3 month warranty would no doubt have a exclusion for the DPF due to being a consumable. Had it of happened in the 1st 3 months.

Carlisle1967

Update

I have emailed them about the problem and received a call stating they are not prepared to do anything.

Citizens Advise are adamant they have to do something as its within 6 months and if I notify them of my consumer rights the onus is on them to prove it was not faulty at point of sale.

Trading standards seem to back this up www.businesscompanion.info/focus/car-traders-and-consumer-law.

Whats the point in buying second hand from a car dealer when their markup is much more than private sales?

The engine and gearbox are a consumable part to some extent so you could exclude them depending on how bad your driving is?

sevenhills

The price of the manufacturers PDF may be around £3,000 but it's likely that an aftermarket one will be half of that price.

Carlisle1967

Yes I agree but the dealer has also quoted me around the same sort of price for them to repair it as Renault did.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

For satisfactory quality 

(2)The quality of goods is satisfactory if they meet the standard that a reasonable person would consider satisfactory, taking account of—

(a)any description of the goods,

(b)the price or other consideration for the goods (if relevant), and

(c)all the other relevant circumstances (see subsection (5)).

Age and milage often lends itself to price but a 10 year old car with 100k on the clock described as "1 owner, top condition, filofax of service and repair history" is going to have a higher bar for satisfactory quality than a 5 year old car with 50k on the clock described as "3 owners, no history, shabby condition". 

I don't know anything about the problem OP has so can't really offer any thoughts on whether the van is of satisfactory quality or not. 

Wonka_2

born_again said:

One thing here. Is OP is talking about DPF filter, now this may have been on the verge of being to the point of wanting either a cemical clean, or replacing when bought. Very hard to tell.

Then factor in the type of drivng OP may be doing. Lots of short trips. It has tipped it over the edge.

Is this a faulty car? When you are talking a consumable part (allbeit a expensive one) Should something like this has to be excluded from the 6 month rule, or pretty much every diesel car that is sold 2nd hand is potentially going to have this issue.

Kind of drops into the same as, well my tyre or brakes have worn out within 6 months of purchase.

You are not buying new, so have to temper expertations. As should the consumer regulations. On what to expect.

Just like the 3 month warranty would no doubt have a exclusion for the DPF due to being a consumable. Had it of happened in the 1st 3 months.

And this is exactly it - in the majority of cases the DPF isn't something where the condition can be checked. I've not had a diesel for 3 years but my last one suffered with the DPF clogging due to my driving at the time - Jaguar's software could see whether the regen's were happening as planned or whether there was a fault which allowed things to change before it became unserviceable.

In the OP's case irrespective of the cost of the van/that it was purchased from main dealer the DPF is a serviceable item with a lifespan - not like tyres/brakes where this can be measured - but a lifespan nonetheless and therefore impractical to suggest it automatically qualifies for 6mths 'warranty' (or is actually covered under any warranty anyway)

So the question back again to @Carlisle1967 - would the DPF failure have been covered under the warranty if it had failed within the 3 month period ?

And as a potential glimmer of hope - it's not unknown for people to blank out the warning lights meaning buyers don't see if there's a DPF/EML warning - what warning lights have you seen over the period of use and if any, have you followed the instructions in the manual to clear them ?

tightauldgit

Wonka_2 said:

born_again said:

One thing here. Is OP is talking about DPF filter, now this may have been on the verge of being to the point of wanting either a cemical clean, or replacing when bought. Very hard to tell.

Then factor in the type of drivng OP may be doing. Lots of short trips. It has tipped it over the edge.

Is this a faulty car? When you are talking a consumable part (allbeit a expensive one) Should something like this has to be excluded from the 6 month rule, or pretty much every diesel car that is sold 2nd hand is potentially going to have this issue.

Kind of drops into the same as, well my tyre or brakes have worn out within 6 months of purchase.

You are not buying new, so have to temper expertations. As should the consumer regulations. On what to expect.

Just like the 3 month warranty would no doubt have a exclusion for the DPF due to being a consumable. Had it of happened in the 1st 3 months.

And this is exactly it - in the majority of cases the DPF isn't something where the condition can be checked. I've not had a diesel for 3 years but my last one suffered with the DPF clogging due to my driving at the time - Jaguar's software could see whether the regen's were happening as planned or whether there was a fault which allowed things to change before it became unserviceable.

In the OP's case irrespective of the cost of the van/that it was purchased from main dealer the DPF is a serviceable item with a lifespan - not like tyres/brakes where this can be measured - but a lifespan nonetheless and therefore impractical to suggest it automatically qualifies for 6mths 'warranty' (or is actually covered under any warranty anyway)

So the question back again to @Carlisle1967 - would the DPF failure have been covered under the warranty if it had failed within the 3 month period ?

And as a potential glimmer of hope - it's not unknown for people to blank out the warning lights meaning buyers don't see if there's a DPF/EML warning - what warning lights have you seen over the period of use and if any, have you followed the instructions in the manual to clear them ?

The thing about the consumer law thoughWonka_2 said:

born_again said:

One thing here. Is OP is talking about DPF filter, now this may have been on the verge of being to the point of wanting either a cemical clean, or replacing when bought. Very hard to tell.

Then factor in the type of drivng OP may be doing. Lots of short trips. It has tipped it over the edge.

Is this a faulty car? When you are talking a consumable part (allbeit a expensive one) Should something like this has to be excluded from the 6 month rule, or pretty much every diesel car that is sold 2nd hand is potentially going to have this issue.

Kind of drops into the same as, well my tyre or brakes have worn out within 6 months of purchase.

You are not buying new, so have to temper expertations. As should the consumer regulations. On what to expect.

Just like the 3 month warranty would no doubt have a exclusion for the DPF due to being a consumable. Had it of happened in the 1st 3 months.

And this is exactly it - in the majority of cases the DPF isn't something where the condition can be checked. I've not had a diesel for 3 years but my last one suffered with the DPF clogging due to my driving at the time - Jaguar's software could see whether the regen's were happening as planned or whether there was a fault which allowed things to change before it became unserviceable.

In the OP's case irrespective of the cost of the van/that it was purchased from main dealer the DPF is a serviceable item with a lifespan - not like tyres/brakes where this can be measured - but a lifespan nonetheless and therefore impractical to suggest it automatically qualifies for 6mths 'warranty' (or is actually covered under any warranty anyway)

So the question back again to @Carlisle1967 - would the DPF failure have been covered under the warranty if it had failed within the 3 month period ?

And as a potential glimmer of hope - it's not unknown for people to blank out the warning lights meaning buyers don't see if there's a DPF/EML warning - what warning lights have you seen over the period of use and if any, have you followed the instructions in the manual to clear them ?

 The thing about the consumer law though is the way it's worded it's not so much that you get a 6 month warranty on things but more that if something goes wrong within 6 months it's assumed the problem was there when you bought it unless the seller can show otherwise. 

So if it had a faulty DPF on the day it was sold would the buyer be entitled to a repair or a refund? I believe so. So if the DPF fails within 6 months it's up to the seller to show that it's most likely something that has occurred since and wasn't present on Day 1. 

I think you can make an argument both ways on that one to be honest so I really don't know what way a court would swing.

Carlisle1967

Only warning lights that have come up has been that there is a fault that needs looking into that I have done via a garage and Renault. DPF is not one of the excluded items in the warranty period.

What is the advantage of paying a premium price to a dealer if they can simply write things off after 30 days as these things happen?

What on a used car is not a consumable part?

Wonka_2

Carlisle1967 said:

Only warning lights that have come up has been that there is a fault that needs looking into that I have done via a garage and Renault. DPF is not one of the excluded items in the warranty period.

What is the advantage of paying a premium price to a dealer if they can simply write things off after 30 days as these things happen?

What on a used car is not a consumable part?

You pay the extra on the basis of understanding the level of peace of mind they're offering. For me any main dealer only offering a 3mth warranty on a purchase of one of their branded vehicles would have sent red flags - or was it a Renault van from a non-Renault dealer ?

The 'consumable' question is best answered from the wording of the warranty they gave you - obviously everything is 'consumable' to an extent but the question then becomes within what lifespan.

Buying with finance rather than bank loan 'may' have given an extra level of protection but unless it can be proved that the DPF was faulty when you purchased then 3000miles is more than enough to damage a previously undamaged one beyond redemption