Energy & Gas Consumpion on a Semi Detached house

macman

That dual channel programmer is indeed a relic from a previous install that should have been consigned to the skip when you had the combi fitted. My first house had an identical one when I bought it, so that one must be a least 40 years old.
Who spec'd the install for your new boiler, and why didn't they recommend that you rationalise the whole system and remove the hot tank and connect all the DHW outlets back to the combi?
There's absolutely no sense in heating or hot watering anything with electricity when you have mains gas. It's 350% more expensive to use electricity, which is why I'm puzzled as to why you refer to 'expensive gas'. Your gas usage is not at all unusual: it's the electricity that is insanely high, which can only be accounted for by using it for heating or DHW.
A back up immersion heater is a sensible precaution if you have a conventional boiler, but you now have a combi.
Pump' could be a shower pump (which you will hear kick in when you open the shower valve, if there is a pump), or it could be an old CH pump that is now redundant.
I think you will be wise to spend some money updating the boiler controls to a modern digital programmer, and removing the hot tank, assuming the combi is adequate for your needs.

Haydenlm1

macman said:

That dual channel programmer is indeed a relic from a previous install that should have been consigned to the skip when you had the combi fitted. My first house had an identical one when I bought it, so that one must be a least 40 years old.
Who spec'd the install for your new boiler, and why didn't they recommend that you rationalise the whole system and remove the hot tank and connect all the DHW outlets back to the combi?
There's absolutely no sense in heating or hot watering anything with electricity when you have mains gas. It's 350% more expensive to use electricity, which is why I'm puzzled as to why you refer to 'expensive gas'. Your gas usage is not at all unusual: it's the electricity that is insanely high, which can only be accounted for by using it for heating or DHW.
A back up immersion heater is a sensible precaution if you have a conventional boiler, but you now have a combi.
Pump' could be a shower pump (which you will hear kick in when you open the shower valve, if there is a pump), or it could be an old CH pump that is now redundant.
I think you will be wise to spend some money updating the boiler controls to a modern digital programmer, and removing the hot tank, assuming the combi is adequate for your needs.

It was fitted with a government scheme when my parents were renting the house we currently own.
The guy came, fitted the boilet and just left..we was just grateful to have a new boiler and trusted that he said its all fitted and working..

So when all switches were off, emptied the tank, the immersion heating was indeed off and didnt turn on.
When I turned on the boiler and turned on my central heating from the boiler, the immersion heating turned on and heated the whole tank and the water upstairs..The immersion heater also turns when we just open any hot water tap, which is insane and probably is the reason for the high energy costs..

Will the solution be to bring a plumber in to take a look at it all and get that tank removed and immersion heater removed and make sure it all connects to the combi boiler?

markin

Haydenlm1 said:

macman said:

That dual channel programmer is indeed a relic from a previous install that should have been consigned to the skip when you had the combi fitted. My first house had an identical one when I bought it, so that one must be a least 40 years old.
Who spec'd the install for your new boiler, and why didn't they recommend that you rationalise the whole system and remove the hot tank and connect all the DHW outlets back to the combi?
There's absolutely no sense in heating or hot watering anything with electricity when you have mains gas. It's 350% more expensive to use electricity, which is why I'm puzzled as to why you refer to 'expensive gas'. Your gas usage is not at all unusual: it's the electricity that is insanely high, which can only be accounted for by using it for heating or DHW.
A back up immersion heater is a sensible precaution if you have a conventional boiler, but you now have a combi.
Pump' could be a shower pump (which you will hear kick in when you open the shower valve, if there is a pump), or it could be an old CH pump that is now redundant.
I think you will be wise to spend some money updating the boiler controls to a modern digital programmer, and removing the hot tank, assuming the combi is adequate for your needs.

It was fitted with a government scheme when my parents were renting the house we currently own.
The guy came, fitted the boilet and just left..we was just grateful to have a new boiler and trusted that he said its all fitted and working..

So when all switches were off, emptied the tank, the immersion heating was indeed off and didnt turn on.
When I turned on the boiler and turned on my central heating from the boiler, the immersion heating turned on and heated the whole tank and the water upstairs..The immersion heater also turns when we just open any hot water tap, which is insane and probably is the reason for the high energy costs..

Will the solution be to bring a plumber in to take a look at it all and get that tank removed and immersion heater removed and make sure it all connects to the combi boiler?

Are you sure the boiler didn't heat the tank, the immersion Element seems to be manual and should not be able to work if the switch is off.


Could explain why the rads seems to take so long to warm up if its passing through the hot water tank first.

Was the switch on when you first looked at it?

If the central heating pipe is heating the tank and the immersion was on, and you are freezing the house the tank would have been heating all day.



What usage in KWH for Gas and elec was on the last bill?

merchcon55

Haydenlm1 said:

Got the pictures.
Here are the plugs on the wall upstairs, when i turn the far left switch off, the combi boiler downstairs turns off completely which means no heating or hot water of course..




Here is the tank, which actually was quite warm, and the metal circular heater on top was even hotter.




Above the plugs shown above, there is this Honeywell device. Again, when i turn the far left switch off, the combi boiler downstairs turns off but so does this honeywell device as well -


I flicked the far left switch off , and the boiler is now off - 



Any ideas anyone??

Top photo - middle switch: Is the white wire from here the wire that is connected to your hot water tank (photo 2)?

If yes - could the switch be "in reverse"? So what you assume to be OFF is in fact ON?

Assuming this is the immersion switch, why not just take the fuse out? This way, you are 100% sure that the immersion is not functioning - assuming the white wire from the middle switch is the wire connected to the Hot water tank.

Once you have done this, turn on your central heating - and then see if the tank is still getting heated. That would be a VERY ODD set up, but as another poster pointed out - if your rads are taking a long time to get warm, maybe the boiler is also heating the hot water tank (which you really no longer need). However, that would not explain your high electricity usage - but, you could be wasting gas as well - besides your CH system not heating your home efficiently. Good luck with all this

theoretica

When the tank is cold and someone goes to shower you say the combi boiler and immersion heater both fire up?  But does the person having the shower get a warm one?  Because the immersion heater will take time to heat that tank, so starting from cold you would get a cold shower unless the hot water is coming from the combi boiler and the immersion is just wasting heat. 

Haydenlm1

So we emptied the tank like mentioned yesterday. The water in the bath and shower were ice cold.
As soon as we turned the boiler on switch upstairs on, we turned the heating on and tank heated up straight away and was boiling hot and it was almost instant when we got the hot water.

I will try take the fuse out of the immersion heater switch..

Is it possible that for some reason the tank gets heated from the boiler when the heating is on unrelated to the immersion heater somehow?? Idk..!

FreeBear

Haydenlm1 said: Is it possible that for some reason the tank gets heated from the boiler when the heating is on unrelated to the immersion heater somehow?? Idk..!

This tank is a hold over from the days when a heat-only (system) boiler was in place - If so, there will be a heating coil in the bottom of the tank that would have been plumbed in to the central heating system. Have a feel round the back of the tank for a pair of pipes sticking out - If these get hot when the CH system is running, that will be the reason the tank is heating up.

markin

Post more photos, wide shots so we can see all the pipes.

Haydenlm1

Okay guys I will get the photos as soon as i can.

FreeBear said:

Haydenlm1 said: Is it possible that for some reason the tank gets heated from the boiler when the heating is on unrelated to the immersion heater somehow?? Idk..!

This tank is a hold over from the days when a heat-only (system) boiler was in place - If so, there will be a heating coil in the bottom of the tank that would have been plumbed in to the central heating system. Have a feel round the back of the tank for a pair of pipes sticking out - If these get hot when the CH system is running, that will be the reason the tank is heating up.

I will check to see if there is any heating coils at the bottom of the pipe, if there is one, does that mean its wired into the gas or electric?

If electric, that means there must be a switch for it somewhere?

markin

A heating coil, is coil of pipe inside the tank the hot water runs in that pipe to heat the water without mixing.


The Honeywell timer would usually operate a 3 way valve (rather than 2 in the picture) to switch the boiler flow from the rads to the heating coil in the water tank.