Economy 7 and April Increases are crazy

littleteapot

pochase said:

Yes there is a big price increase for E7 night rate for Eastern region, but what you forgot to mention is that it is only going back to where it was before October, when they reduced the rate to the 7p.

Last time I checked the rate cards for Eastern region, Jan-mar was 7p night and apr-jun was 8.7p. so not exactly a huge increase.

https://www.edfenergy.com/sites/default/files/dm1903_pl1_rate_card_builed_aw4_v1.pdf

ispookie666

Any idea why eastern region has low night time tariff? 

dealyboy

@littleteapot, @pochase ...

littleteapot said:

pochase said:

Yes there is a big price increase for E7 night rate for Eastern region, but what you forgot to mention is that it is only going back to where it was before October, when they reduced the rate to the 7p.

Last time I checked the rate cards for Eastern region, Jan-mar was 7p night and apr-jun was 8.7p. so not exactly a huge increase.

https://www.edfenergy.com/sites/default/files/dm1903_pl1_rate_card_builed_aw4_v1.pdf

... but it is a high percentage increase for people who have a heavy bias towards night rate usage.

The cost profile will be better for those who have 'the standard' day/night split. The April 1st E7 Eastern EPG single rate equivalent for EDF is 32.95p per kWh, based on a 58% day 42% night split.

MattMattMattUK

ispookie666 said:

Any idea why eastern region has low night time tariff? 

If I had to hazard a guess I would guess that it is because that is where a lot of wind generated electricity comes onshore from the wind farms out in the North Sea. Using it there would result in much reduced transmission losses and there will be a surplus due to lower night usage overall.

pensionpawn

I was an E7 customer for over 25 years until the tariff increases of 1st January and the hike in the E7 utilisation to >40%, effectively making E7 no longer beneficial for me. I swapped to single rate and as a consequence I now run my dishwasher,  wash-dryer machine, under floor heating etc during the day, when more convenient to me. During an energy crisis that change made sense to someone somewhere...

MattMattMattUK

pensionpawn said:

I was an E7 customer for over 25 years until the tariff increases of 1st January and the hike in the E7 utilisation to >40%, effectively making E7 no longer beneficial for me. I swapped to single rate and as a consequence I now run my dishwasher,  wash-dryer machine, under floor heating etc during the day, when more convenient to me. During an energy crisis that change made sense to someone somewhere...

There is not really a "crisis", but as with everything in the media these days it has to be labelled a crisis or emergency. There has been a price rise and at points we have had low margins on the network, almost entirely because we as a nation have failed to invest in generation capacity and energy security.

People who were previously marginal cases for E7 coming off it will have made almost no difference to the demand curve, people cutting back in general has reduced demand (overall and at peak times) far more than a bit of load shifting ever would. You no longer being on E7 does not make the "energy crisis" and better or worse.

SnakePlissken

MattMattMattUK said:

ispookie666 said:

Any idea why eastern region has low night time tariff? 

If I had to hazard a guess I would guess that it is because that is where a lot of wind generated electricity comes onshore from the wind farms out in the North Sea. Using it there would result in much reduced transmission losses and there will be a surplus due to lower night usage overall.

If that was the case North of Scotland would be lower. And there is plenty surplus in Scotland, especially the lower populated North.

Majority of time, North of Scotland is 90 to 100 % renewable generation.

https://electricityproduction.uk/in/north-scotland/

There is lots of onshore and hydro generation there, but it doesnt make it lower. Also includes 2 lines that transfer energy the beauly/denny line and east coast line that goes through Angus.

https://www.ssen-transmission.co.uk/projects/project-map/beauly---denny/

https://www.ssen-transmission.co.uk/projects/project-map/east-coast-275kv-ohl-upgrade/

dunstonh

pensionpawn said:

I was an E7 customer for over 25 years until the tariff increases of 1st January and the hike in the E7 utilisation to >40%, effectively making E7 no longer beneficial for me. I swapped to single rate and as a consequence I now run my dishwasher,  wash-dryer machine, under floor heating etc during the day, when more convenient to me. During an energy crisis that change made sense to someone somewhere...

On the other hand, the 1st January reductions in the E7 off peak unit price were fantastic for us.    We shoved more use to off peak because of it.  The small increase in April is not great it's only a pennies increase daily for us on 50kWh per day use.

During an "energy crisis", that change made perfect sense. 

Winners and losers.  Those with a high off peak ratio are winners.  Those with a low off peak ratio are losers.  However, those losers can still move to other suppliers who have a less noticeable ratio.

Any idea why eastern region has low night time tariff? 

Two major influences are how much energy the supplier sells in the area and how much it buys from generators in the area and how much it buys externally.   Generally, the more that can be generated locally the lower the cost.     

East Anglia's electricity transmission network was built in the 60s to supply regional demand. Not countrywide.   The region generates 4100MW.  Of which 3160 is used in the region and 940MW is distributed.   So, "Eastern" is a net generator.

Sizewell (which is run by EDF) generates a third of the region's needs.  It's 24 hour generation to an area that doesn't have much heavy industry that can run off peak

There are very many small onshore wind turbine sites and significant offshore sites around the East but the current infrastructure is not where it needs to be to export more of it to the wider grid.  There are some significant projects underway or under consultation to improve that.    Eastern has been referred to as becoming the UKs energy powerhouse.   

SnakePlissken

dunstonh said:

pensionpawn said:

I was an E7 customer for over 25 years until the tariff increases of 1st January and the hike in the E7 utilisation to >40%, effectively making E7 no longer beneficial for me. I swapped to single rate and as a consequence I now run my dishwasher,  wash-dryer machine, under floor heating etc during the day, when more convenient to me. During an energy crisis that change made sense to someone somewhere...

On the other hand, the 1st January reductions in the E7 off peak unit price were fantastic for us.    We shoved more use to off peak because of it.  The small increase in April is not great it's only a pennies increase daily for us on 50kWh per day use.

During an "energy crisis", that change made perfect sense. 

Winners and losers.  Those with a high off peak ratio are winners.  Those with a low off peak ratio are losers.  However, those losers can still move to other suppliers who have a less noticeable ratio.

Any idea why eastern region has low night time tariff? 

.   Generally, the more that can be generated locally the lower the cost.     

So why does both North and South of Scotland have amongst the highest E7 tarrif?

They produce in excess of what is used and are net exporters of energy to the rest of the UK.

Official UK gov spreadsheet on energy transfers below....

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1043309/ET_5.6_DEC_21.xlsx&ved=2ahUKEwi6mOzo2pz6AhUISEEAHRsKBHwQFnoECEQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw2eDHmuMCFh19CWLQBh9QqJ


And this is set to grow further with massive expansion of offshore wind and pumped storage and additional onshore wind.

Scot_39

Although large in terms of current capacity the 2 major pump storage I am aware of Coire Glas - storage and generation capacity, and Cruachan generation / refill, not actual storage capacity  - are trivial in terms of peak UK demand, if not Scotlands.

And being funded largely by private investment.

Recently said UK needs 10-50 Coire Glas to seriously look at  decommissioning significant numbers of  gas plants etc. Over and above the planned expansion of nuclear (which isn't happening anytime soon in Scotland under SNP Grens). 

Due to winds at time 5% actual ouput for days and 20% output for months every summer.