Help With End of Tenancy

Tommy8

Good Morning Everyone, 

We have put in our notice on our current rented house and the estate agent are coming on strong with their demands. Its making me nervous and i just would like to run by you to see what our rights and expectations are. 

Specifics:

• We have lived in the house for 3 years 8 months and we own two cats. 
• We have never missed a payment and have only reported serious issues with the house. 
• We have kept the house clean and tidy, with the exception of a bit of damage to a small section of carpet that the cats have done and general wear and tear. 
• At the start of the tenancy, the house was clean with the exception of rubbish and dust build up under the bed (I didn't take pictures of this at the time). 
• We did not receive an inventory report. I chased it at the start, of which I have the emails as proof, but they still didn't send it to us. 
• We also didn't get any proof of a professional clean been done prior to our tenancy. 
• I have looked through the tenancy agreement and all the emails sent to me and I cant find any contractual agreements which state specifically to get the carpets "professionally" cleaned due to the fact that we have two cats. It states the following under an Animals and Pets section; "At the end of the tenancy, the Tenant agrees to have the Premises cleaned to a standard commensurate with the condition of the property at the commencement of the tenancy". 
• We have emails from the estate agent stating that the landlord doesn't mind if we dispose of the mattress and buy our own as the three items of furniture were left there by a previous tenant. We are taking our mattress with us. 
• The inventory has now been sent to us and looks like i remember at the start, but doesn't have our signatures on it as it was never sent to us. 

The estate agents have said "they strongly recommend getting the house professionally cleaned and the carpets professionally shampooed as 90% of tenants who clean the house themselves do not meet their high standards for a clean house". This statement has been repeated a few times with authority and reading between the lines they are saying our deposit is at risk if they find a spec of dust. They are pushing a company they use, on us. 

We are going to make sure the house is as clean as we can get it when we leave, i will be obsessive about that. 

I want to pay what we owe for damages etc, but I don't want to pay for things we are being threatened to pay for that technically are not our responsibility. 

I'm doubting myself that I have missed the agreements in writing to do such cleaning etc. Is everything in the tenancy agreement or are there separate documents? 

I have read the amazing tenancy help in the sticky forum and I believe we don't have to feel this pressured but I'm still doubting our rights etc. For example I'm worried they may actually have proof of a professional clean and they haven't given it to me yet until I dispute. 

With our situation now put in context, any help or advice will be much appreciated. 

Best Regards

Tom

chanz4

ignore the profeshional clean as they cant prove it, as long as clean

propertyrental

Tommy8 said:

Good Morning Everyone, 

We have put in our notice on our current rented house and the estate agent are coming on strong with their demands. Its making me nervous and i just would like to run by you to see what our rights and expectations are. 

Specifics:

• We have lived in the house for 3 years and we own two cats. irrelevant
• We have never missed a payment and have only reported serious issues with the house. Irrelevant
• We have kept the house clean and tidy, with the exception of a bit of damage to a small section of carpet that the cats have done and general wear and tear.  you are responsible for the damage. Unless you can get the cats to pay.....
• At the start of the tenancy, the house was clean with the exception of rubbish and dust build up under the bed (I didn't take pictures of this at the time). then return the property in the same condition
• We did not receive an inventory report. I chased it at the start, of which I have the emails as proof, but they still didn't send it to us. So what evidence does the landlord/agent have of the condition at the start?
• We also didn't get any proof of a professional clean been done prior to our tenancy. Irrelevant
• I have looked through the tenancy agreement and all the emails sent to me and I cant find any contractual agreements which state specifically to get the carpets "professionally" cleaned due to the fact that we have two cats.even if in the contract, irrelevant. Your only duty is to return the property in the same condition as at the start
•  It states the following under an Animals and Pets section; "At the end of the tenancy, the Tenant agrees to have the Premises cleaned to a standard commensurate with the condition of the property at the commencement of the tenancy". as I said above
• We have emails from the estate agent stating that the landlord doesn't mind if we dispose of the mattress and buy our own as the three items of furniture were left there by a previous tenant. We are taking our mattress with us. fine. so....?
• The inventory has now been sent to us and looks like i remember at the start, but doesn't have our signatures on it as it was never sent to us. ignore. irrelevant

The estate agents have said "they strongly recommend getting the house professionally cleaned and the carpets professionally shampooed as 90% of tenants who clean the house themselves do not meet their high standards for a clean house".
the only standard yo need to meet is the standard it was in at the start.
but nice of them to make a 'recommendation' . Ignore.
This statement has been repeated a few times with authority and reading between the lines they are saying our deposit is at risk if they find a spec of dust. They are pushing a company they use, on us. ignore their company. If you want a cleaning company, shop around and choose your own.
Or DY the cleaning as above

We are going to make sure the house is as clean as we can get it when we leave, i will be obsessive about that. OK

I want to pay what we owe for damages etc, but I don't want to pay for things we are being threatened to pay for that technically are not our responsibility.  You mean the cat damage? That's down to you.
Or the cleaning charge? See earlier comments
Anything else?

I'm doubting myself that I have missed the agreements in writing to do such cleaning etc. Is everything in the tenancy agreement or are there separate documents? well they could produce an invoice from a eg a brand new carpet at the start as eveidence of condition of the carpet. A 3 year old inventory can be ignored

I have read the amazing tenancy help in the sticky forum and I believe we don't have to feel this pressured but I'm still doubting our rights etc. For example I'm worried they may actually have proof of a professional clean and they haven't given it to me yet until I dispute. yes it's possible.

With our situation now put in context, any help or advice will be much appreciated. 

Dispute any charges you disagree with. Meanwhile, stop fretting!

RAS

The day you move out, photograph everything, read the meters, request the whole of your deposit back from the scheme.

If the LL wants to claim, they need evidence of the damage, as in photos of the place before you moved in and after you move out. 

And they aren't entitled to betterment. So another poster who ruined an area of carpet by resting a hot iron on it, objected to buying a new carpet. The scheme awarded the LL £80 for the damage.

I would recommend a rug doctor or similar.

Tommy8

Hi @propertyrental and @RAS, 

Just to clarify some of my points:

• My mattress comment - the inventory shows a mattress present at the start. We are taking the new one with us and im hoping if they dispute the missing mattress, my historical emails about disposing the old one are viable as proof. 
• Professional Clean Receipt - If they have an invoice from before our tenancy start, does this mean the standard required to be returned to is; "professionally cleaned"?

Thankyou for your replies. 

Best Regards

Tom

RAS

You need to leave a mattress. Do you have any information about the condition of the one you disposed of?

theartfullodger

Tommy8 said:

Hi @propertyrental and @RAS, 

Just to clarify some of my points:

• 
  
• Professional Clean Receipt - If they have an invoice from before our tenancy start, does this mean the standard required to be returned to is; "professionally cleaned"?

Thankyou for your replies. 

Best Regards

Tom

Invoice from before start just means any old clown who can write an invoice did so.  "Professional" as in someone got paid for it, who knows what quality of job. But what about the period after date of clean till  when you moved in? What actually matters is inventory & photos of state of the place - so if there are no photos showing state of e.g. mattress, who knows what state it was in.

I agree, leave a mattress: If they start arguing about deposit deductions simply start the deposit scheme dispute process: Brought in, twice by parliament, after years & years of greedy landlords/agents ripping off tenants. See
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/tenancy_deposits/how_to_get_your_deposit_back

Artful: Landlord since 2000.

PRAISETHESUN

The agents are just coming on strong because it makes their life easier, for the most part you can ignore what they are saying.

Cleaning - the property only needs to be returned to the same (or better) condition it was at the start of the tenancy, less fair wear and tear. Even if it was professionally cleaned and the LL can evidence this, you are still free to do the cleaning yourself if you can bring the property back to the same standard if you want.

Mattress - you have written permission from the LL that you were allowed to dispose of it so you'll be fine. No need to leave a replacement behind. 

dimbo61

No degrees in Professional Cleaning !
So meaningless  term 
Using a rug doctor carpet  cleaner  you have hired from the local supermarket  will do a great job of cleaning 3 years of cat hair and cat smells.
Landlord should expect to perhaps clean and paint property ready for next tenant 

Mr.Generous

Professional cleaning just means cleaned to a professional standard. As everyone says the evidence for this is the inventory. You can easily do as good a job yourself, but try and have an empty house for a day or two to get everything done.

The checkouts I've seen that have made the least progress on putting the house back to handover condition is when they try and hand it over the day after they move out.

Do not get a relative (or mate from down the pub) to try and paint over a few marks, they make it worse!!

Remove all rubbish. Pet hate is crap dumped outside.

Where tenants have made a decent effort to hand back a clean house without damage I make zero deduction. Landlords expect some wear and tear, and if some one has been in 3 years I'd redecorate anyway, otherwise when do you get the chance?

Don't fret, the agent isn't in a position to demand or insist on anything. If you can't agree say so, and go to the deposit scheme for a decision. They take tenants side more often than not.

LegallyLandlord

Sounds like unpleasant agents that are borderline bullies. 

Leave it as you found it, less a little wear and tear. Expect to park for the damage to the carpet. For anything else, say you’ll raise a dispute with the deposit protection scheme. Might be worth digging out the certificate they should have provided and look at how to do it (the schemes are slightly different).