Why is WhatsApp blocked on my - new - mobile phone? A Kafka-esque situation

[Deleted User]

br1anst0rm said:

[Deleted User] said:

Likely that some / many of your dozen friends/family that received messages you reported blocked or reported the messages - probably thought they were a scammer as they weren't expecting to hear from you on a different number or account.

Did you actually transfer your Whatsapp account from old phone to new or just set up a new one?

See my reply to @Sarahspangles on the first point.  It is a remote possibility, but highly unlikely.  The only way to check would be for me to call all those to whom I sent WA messages.  A bit of a chore, but I'd do so if WhatsApp were able to confirm the time and/or number of the complaints they claim to have received....

How can you say it is unlikely when Whatsapp themselves have told you their reason for the ban is specifically due to the number of complaints. That is the reason.

Also I think you are mixing up the account and number. Your ban is for the account. In your first post, you said:

"This account is not allowed to use WhatsApp"

That is an account ban and therefore has nothing to do with this new phone number being previously used etc. there is a different type of ban specific to phone numbers.

On the second question - No.  My new phone is a new handset with a new SIM with a new number on a different network (O2) .  I did not "port" my previous mobile number across to my new SIM or network provider.  In both cases I was/am on PAYG not a fixed-term contract.  So I don't think I could have"transferred" my WhatsApp account even if I had wanted to, because the old WhatsApp account was registered to my old number on the - different - old network.

None of that matters about your network PAYG/Contract / Phone number etc.

You can transfer your Whatsapp account to your new phone and you will get a message to the old phone to confirm it is you and it all transfers over and links to your new number. 

https://faq.whatsapp.com/1197347060992858/?cms_platform=android&helpref=platform_switcher
or
https://faq.whatsapp.com/498754122134583/?helpref=hc_fnav&cms_platform=android

If you do it this way it is all fairly automatic and gives continuity for your contacts.

https://faq.whatsapp.com/1166321223998129/?helpref=hc_fnav

savergrant

br1anst0rm said:

Sarahspangles said:

There’s a scam at the moment where a message ‘Hi I lost my phone this is my new number’ is sent, escalating to a request for money.  Could someone you messaged have mistakenly thought you were a scammer and hit ‘report’?

That one hadn't occurred to me.  But those whom I messaged were all friends/family, so would I reckon have phoned me to check if they thought the message was a scam.  As for hitting the 'report' button - possible that someone might have done so by mistake, I suppose, but pretty unlikely

Do you still have the old sim/phone? Do you know that no-one tried to phone the number they normally contacted you through to check?
These days it is pretty rare for someone to get a new number.
And if you still have your old sim I think it is possible to connect your new phone and new number to your existing WhatsApp account, you would just need to be able to access verification codes sent to your old number. I am pretty sure some of my contacts have a different number for WhatsApp to that for normal calls and texts for this reason.

savergrant

I believe that WhatsApp have absolute discretion as to whether they provide a free service, so ultimately there is no appeal process. So going forward you could either ask everyone you know to change to a rival messaging service, or try again with a different number.

br1anst0rm

[Deleted User] said:

br1anst0rm said:

See my reply to @Sarahspangles on the first point.  It is a remote possibility, but highly unlikely.  The only way to check would be for me to call all those to whom I sent WA messages.  A bit of a chore, but I'd do so if WhatsApp were able to confirm the time and/or number of the complaints they claim to have received....

How can you say it is unlikely when Whatsapp themselves have told you their reason for the ban is specifically due to the number of complaints. That is the reason.

Also I think you are mixing up the account and number. Your ban is for the account. In your first post, you said:

"This account is not allowed to use WhatsApp"

That is an account ban and therefore has nothing to do with this new phone number being previously used etc. there is a different type of ban specific to phone numbers.
....

Thanks, @[Deleted User] those various comments are taking me up a steep learning curve.  I'll try to address each one.

i) number of complaints.  I was surprised when WhatsApp gave this as the reason, because it didn't seem credible.  Few if any of the (about a dozen) contacts I messaged raised queries or complaints as far as I know.  Almost all replied acknowledging my message.  If WhatsApp were able to give circumstantial details - nothing private, just the numbers/timing:  X complaints, raised on date Y, then it would be straightforward to establish whether this corresponded with the timing or number of messages I had sent out, and was indeed the trigger for the ban.  The mystery would be solved.

ii) mixing "account" and "number".  Yes indeed I am confused.  The WhatsApp site doesn't explain how they differ.  I had - perhaps mistakenly - understood that a WhatsApp account was linked to, and indeed depended on, a phone number, and that without a number a WhatsApp account could not be set up/registered/operated.  So how does a ban on an account differ from a ban on a number (previously used or not)?  It seems to me impossible, and illogical, to separate the two as an account can surely not exist without a phone number.

iii) new account versus transfer of existing account.  Ironically, I thought setting up a new WhatsApp account on a new phone with a new number would be simpler and easier than the process you outline for transferring using links, especially as I wasn't aiming to "port" my old number to my new phone.  I still have my old phone with its "old" number on its "old" network, and I have WhatsApp on that phone and it still works and contains my past messages.  I don't have hundreds of WhatsApp contacts.  I wasn't ever intending to transfer that existing "old" WhatsApp account, registered to the old number, into my new phone.

So my new phone is essentially me as a brand new user with a new number on a new network with a clean slate, and I was aiming to set up a new WhatsApp account.  Obviously over time I will add into that new phone the details of some or most of my contacts.  But I am still baffled and surprised (without the firm evidence of any "complaints" at all) that within 24 hours of installing the WhatsApp app on my new phone as a fresh new subscriber, my use of WhatsApp is blocked.

[Deleted User]

Makes perfect sense now to me, old account still active, new account created on a new number that appears to be impersonating you, somebody reports it. That is at the top of the list of reasons for an account being banned to protect your contacts from being scammed be somebody pretending to be you. 

Log out of the account on your new phone and port your old phone account across and you will be up and running again in 5 mins. 

br1anst0rm

savergrant said:

Do you still have the old sim/phone? Do you know that no-one tried to phone the number they normally contacted you through to check?

Yes, I still have old Sim and phone.  No, no-one tried to call that old number to check:  as mentioned, most replied directly to the new phone via WhatsApp message acknowledging the new contact details.

And as noted above, I actually chose to set up a completely new "clean slate" - new phone, new SIM, new number, new network. Just as if I was a first-time new user.  I didn't want or need to transfer my existing WhatsApp account over and get into the business of links and so on. 

So, believing it would be simple to do so, I sought to set up a new WhatsApp account on that new phone using the new number.  Hadn't expected it to become un-usable within 24 hours for reasons that are still (to me) unexplained and unsubstantiated. 

Any brand new user of a new WhatsApp account is likely to send a number of very similar messages to contacts after it has been set up:  indeed the app has a pre-loaded message format for doing so!  So what - if anything - did I do wrong to cause a ban?

[Deleted User]

br1anst0rm said:

savergrant said:

Do you still have the old sim/phone? Do you know that no-one tried to phone the number they normally contacted you through to check?

Any brand new user of a new WhatsApp account is likely to send a number of very similar messages to contacts after it has been set up:  indeed the app has a pre-loaded message format for doing so!  So what - if anything - did I do wrong to cause a ban?

As I said in previous comment, to WhatsApp it looked liked somebody set up a totally new account and pretended to impersonate an existing user. They wouldn’t have known / bothered except for one or more of your friends / family reporting / blocking your account. 

Seriously just spend 5 mins transferring your old account over instead, much quicker than arguing with WhatsApp or trying to figure out who reported you. 

br1anst0rm

Deleted_User said:

Makes perfect sense now to me, old account still active, new account created on a new number that appears to be impersonating you, somebody reports it. That is at the top of the list of reasons for an account being banned to protect your contacts from being scammed be somebody pretending to be you. 

Log out of the account on your new phone and port your old phone account across and you will be up and running again in 5 mins. 

Well well, on the face of it that does indeed seem plausible.  I still don't think anyone actually reported the situation, far less complained that it was a possible scam.  But maybe the WhatsApp algorithms were triggered somehow, and that resulted in the ban?  I'm still having to guess, because WhatsApp hasn't explained.

What it does appear to suggest is that no-one, but no-one, can have more than one WhatsApp account.  Is that really the case?  There is nothing anywhere in the WhatsApp website or Ts & Cs that says so.  I still find that rather peculiar.  A lot of people have more than one mobile phone (eg one for work and one for home/personal) each with its own number and with a WhatsApp account on each.  Indeed I know someone who has WhatsApp on their mobile phone, and also a (separate) WhatsApp account on their tablet/iPad.  Under your explanation that wouldn't be possible....

Your last sentence suggests the solution is quick and easy.  Forgive the question but I really do need clarity, as this is all unfamiliar territory.  By "port your old phone account" do you mean port my WhatsApp account over?  (not port the existing - old - network phone number by getting a PAC and passing that to my new (O2) provider?)  

Also I can't log out of the WhatsApp account on my new phone - because I can't even log in or access it in any way.  I don't even know if it is registered... the supposed new, or banned account is totally inaccessible. 

And also:  I'm still puzzled about the question posed above about not having more than one account.  And now I'm also concerned that if I try to port my existing WhatsApp account over to my new phone I might end up having that "old" WhatsApp account blocked or banned as well on the grounds that I have transgressed some unspecified rule!  

I would feel a lot more comfortable if the WhatsApp Help and Support powers-that-be actually delivered advice and support to work through this.  Failing that, I really do need rock-solid diagnosis of the problem and a bullet-proof way of solving it.

[Deleted User]

Just Google how to logout on the new phone, depends on your phone model which you haven’t mentioned so I can only direct you to Google it for now. 

I’m not suggesting two account are not allowed, but in your case somebody reported/blocked you as it appeared that a new number / new account not in your friends contact list messaged pretending to be your despite your old account still being active. 

That is a different scenario to having accounts for a business and personal phone.

It’s up to you now in terms of what to do, but the easiest and quickest way is to logout of WhatsApp on the new phone and commence a transfer of your account from your old phone to new phone. 

WhatsApp aren’t going to give you any more information that they have done about the circumstances. 

born_again

br1anst0rm said:

Well well, on the face of it that does indeed seem plausible.  I still don't think anyone actually reported the situation, far less complained that it was a possible scam.  But maybe the WhatsApp algorithms were triggered somehow, and that resulted in the ban?  I'm still having to guess, because WhatsApp hasn't explained

I would feel a lot more comfortable if the WhatsApp Help and Support powers-that-be actually delivered advice and support to work through this.  Failing that, I really do need rock-solid diagnosis of the problem and a bullet-proof way of solving it.

Have you contacted any of them to check?