Parking Charge Notice when paid for parking with app (slightly different times on app)

donfruitella

Hi, used this forum before, but not for many years now, hopefully someone can help.

I've received a PCN from a private car park that I use on a weekly basis. The charge is for a period of 114 minutes (13:34:02 - 15:28:40) on the day of the incident, with photographic evidence of my vehicle entering and exiting the car park.

I do have a receipt showing that I've paid for parking that day at that site, but for whatever reason it's down for 14:00 - 16:00 that day. So it isn't the exact same time, but it is 2 hours parking, and I've used the car park for under 2 hours. I must have had to download the app, or something, which made me late to start the parking.

Either way I've paid for 2 hours and that's what I've used, so I'm not going to pay the £100 they now want as well. 

Would I be best served with an appeal with this? Or should I follow the template.

Cheers!

B789

Welcome back. You remember the Newbies thread with all the guidance and steps involved. That is your friend.

If this is your initial appeal, use the blue template.

Which PPC? Is the PCn POFA compliant? Don't ID the driver,

donfruitella

Thank you! I'll send the blue template. Worth mentioning that I have evidence of there being parking paid for by this vehicle at (near enough) that time?

Looked at how to find if it's POFA compliant on the thread but can't see how to figure that out. 

The company is called Excel Parking

Johnersh

You need the exact wording of the sign.

However, the obvious flaw is that the parking period commences before the vehicle is parked at the perimeter/entry point. It could easily take 5 mins to park (13:40). 5 mins to exit car and read signage (13:45). Its fine if you have the relevant app, but what if you dont ?  Its not unreasonable to think that it might take up to 10 mins to download an app, read the terms of the app (different to the sign) register a password, type in your full home address & type in full credit card details, check the car details are correct, double check again and then pay (13:55). 

They designed that ludicrous system. If the payment spans the total period of parking there is no loss. They've had payment. To charge is a penalty. 

They'll harp on about Beavis, but that was no panacea. He overstayed his welcome. You've paid 2 hrs, left within 2hrs and their data proves that. So, in effect, they seek c. £100 for failing to register your car quite quickly enough. That seems more than likely to fall within the scope of unlawful penalty.

It will be noted that even in Beavis the penalty rule was engaged (the sum was high vs the financial loss). Ultimately there was commercial interest, so the Sup Ct let it through. That's probably not the case here, where there was full payment and the o/p was outta dodge in the requisite time frame. 

donfruitella

Cheers for that, I'll probably be going back today, so I'll get pictures of the signs etc. 

They can see I've parked there before (I park in this car park every week), but yeah if I needed to download the app again it will take a while, the internet in that location is terrible. 

Is it looking best that I just follow a standard appeal with the blue text? Is any of the above worth mentioning at this point? Surely they can't get away with charging people these sums when they're genuinely paying customers (I ask knowing the answer lol)

Le_Kirk

Just use the blue text appeal, they will reject it, then, if it foes to a court claim, you can use the fine words from @Johnersh (who is a lawyerly type) in your defence.  There is no benefit to the PPC to accept your appeal and they will just ignore what you say anyway.  If you use the blue text appeal it does not state who was driving, so POFA compliance does not matter at this stage.

donfruitella

Cheers for that. On the appeal I have to choose from a list of reasons, which I've attached an image of. None of these seem like a good choice but you have to pick one in order to submit the appeal. Any idea which one I should go for?

None of them fit the appeal I'm going for (not able to ID the driver of the vehicle). Could put 'I was authorised to park' ? I did have a ticket.

Any advice from anyone is welcome as always, thanks

Coupon-mad

Clearly you go for "there was no signage".  It's the only one a keeper can tick.

The template appeal is NOT based on 'unable to ID the driver'!

You can of course add the proof of payment but your replies read to me that the minute you type something, you write "I" did this/that.  You keep telling us who was driving!  The exact opposite of what the template appeal says.

donfruitella

OK, thank you.

As a keeper, how would one attach proof of payment without identifying the driver?

'Attached is proof of payment' - those words alone then attach screenshot of the payment on the app? 

Thanks

DW190

donfruitella said:

OK, thank you.

As a keeper, how would one attach proof of payment without identifying the driver?

'Attached is proof of payment' - those words alone then attach screenshot of the payment on the app? 

Thanks

Easy when the registered keeper who paid is the passenger.

donfruitella

DW190 said:

donfruitella said:

OK, thank you.

As a keeper, how would one attach proof of payment without identifying the driver?

'Attached is proof of payment' - those words alone then attach screenshot of the payment on the app? 

Thanks

Easy when the registered keeper who paid is the passenger.

ok fantastic, an appeal will be submitted. Along with the words attached is proof of payment and the screenshot. That shouldn't implicate anyone as driver, one is correct to assume this?