Gas consumption

Anni_nOMin_oustwo

Hi, this may be of interest to a few people out there and there may be one or two gas engineers reading this. I have just had a smart meter fitted and when I played around on my account I saw a flat blue line constant throughout the day except when my heating was on or I was cooking. So I put my mouse over it to discover the pilot on my boiler was consuming 0.015/0.016 cubic meters per every 30 mins. I photographed the Indoor Display Unit and noted the time and value displayed, then 8 hours later, not using any gas whatsoever photographed the screen again and I had used 30p multiply this by 3 for 24hrs and that is a staggering 90p per day for my pilot light £328.50 per year 3 x the gas standing charge. My boiler heats hot water and central heating so has to remain on continuously. Now here's where any engineers out there could advise me, do new boilers have pilot lights or do they ignite only when switched on. Regards in advance.

[Deleted User]

No engineer needed. Modern condensing boilers do not have a pilot light. How old is your boiler; manufacturer and model number?

PS: the standing charge is irrelevant. You pay it when there is a meter fitted.

Raxiel

In the winter at least, it's not so bad because the heat from that flame still ends up in the circulated water and effectively offsets a tiny bit of main burner use. During the summer its mostly lost unfortunately.

ic

If your boiler has a pilot light, its probably very old - and therefore generally inefficient.  In the past year I've swapped a 40 year old boiler and tank for a combi boiler with weather compensation. Even though this was done alongside a loft conversion and addition of a new extension (so the house is bigger), our gas use has reduced by almost a third.  Given current high prices, you could probably expect to recoup the replacement cost in a few years.

Leon_W

I posted about this a little while ago. Can't remember where.

We have an old gas Rayburn that did the heating, hot water and cooking.  I made roughly the same calculation as you regarding the cost of the pilot light but the only difference is the Rayburn has TWO pilot lights !!!  One for the cooking and hot water and one for the heating side (winter only) . We were looking at over £400 a year just for pilot lights

So, disconnected the Rayburn from all water services, had a combi boiler fitted and now just use it for cooking.  The savings are huge.

The only thing we miss is the warmth from the Rayburn in our kitchen which ran continuously on a "low" setting (large family room with sofa etc) where we mainly sit so have fitted a multifuel stove on which we burn COAL which has worked out far cheaper to heat a single room. We very rarely put gas central heating on because of this.  Even with the energy price hikes we are spending LESS than last year after changing heating arrangements.

Anni_nOMin_oustwo

Thanks for all the comments and feedback, I didn't expect to see anything for days.
My boiler 40 years old. It is a glow-worm space-saver mark II. I knew it had a flame thrower for a pilot light, but not until the smart meter had been fitted, had I any idea of it's actual cost. I have stuck my head in the sand thinking... if it aint broke don't fix it but I think the time has come to replace it. Can't fault Glow-Worm for reliability, one new thermacouple in 40 years and I hear so much about people having trouble with condensing boilers. My bank balance head says get rid now and the sooner it will pay for itself but i'll feel guity getting rid. I have seen all in quotes of £2.2 -2.8k, so 6 -9 years it will have paid for itself not including any efficency savings.Now I just have to decide on the installer.

[Deleted User]

Anni_nOMin_oustwo said:

Thanks for all the comments and feedback, I didn't expect to see anything for days.
My boiler 40 years old. It is a glow-worm space-saver mark II. I knew it had a flame thrower for a pilot light, but not until the smart meter had been fitted, had I any idea of its actual cost. I have stuck my head in the sand thinking... if it aint broke don't fix it but I think the time has come to replace it. Can't fault Glow-Worm for reliability, one new thermacouple in 40 years and I hear so much about people having trouble with condensing boilers. My bank balance head says get rid now and the sooner it will pay for itself but i'll feel guity getting rid. I have seen all in quotes of £2.2 -2.8k, so 6 -9 years it will have paid for itself not including any efficency savings.Now I just have to decide on the installer.

Don’t put a new boiler on an old heating system without considering whether your radiators are big enough. Your old boiler was designed to run at 80C with a 12C flow to return differential. A modern condensing boiler needs to have a return temperature below 56C to recover heat from the exhaust gases. The flow to return temperature differential of a modern boiler should be in the region of 20C which may not be possible without increasing some of the radiator sizes. The ‘old’ system needs to be power flushed or chemically cleaned as fitting a new boiler can disturb radiator sludge/debris. If any sludge blocks the new boiler’s heat exchanger, the warranty is invalidated.

Anni_nOMin_oustwo

Thanks for the advice 'Dolor' I know my system is filthy judging from the ocasional radiator bleed I have done in recent times, when what can only be described as black ink emerged. Heatable and iheat say they will chemically flush the system and apply filters, but maybe I need a survey to determine radiator sizing?

markin

All rads should really be swapped for modern ones with the metal fins on the back, not actually longer or higher, Just thicker.

Presuming the rads are all 40 years old.




 

Anni_nOMin_oustwo

4 of the 8 rads are more modern like in your details, but 4 are single old style (no fins) 3 of which I think are probably 
original the other is a 1 for 1 swap sometime during the life of the system. Btw they are all on 10mm microbore pipework under flooring onto which I have since laid laminate flooring on top. Please don't say the pipework needs replacing too.

markin

Only a wet heatpump would need 15mm pipes, so thats a problem for 15 years away.