Should I remove the Gas Rayburn?

poimnb

I'm in the process of buying a house that has a mains gas powered Rayburn cooker (believe it's a 480AG) that is running the heating and hot water, along with an immersion heater hot water tank in a bathroom cupboard (poorly insulated). Also has two electric showers. 

It's a larger house than I've ever lived in - large 4 bed farmhouse semi vs 2-3 bed mid terraces. And I have slight concerns about the energy costs to run the property.

My current idea is
Install a gas combi boiler
Remove Rayburn
Install electric induction range cooker
Remove or isolate/disconnect hot water tank

What other options would people suggest in this situation?

I've not done the full maths on the above because it's hard to know exactly how much energy we'd use with the current setup before we're there... But I do have a feeling my replacement setup would pay back in a reasonable length of time. 

I also have a longer term plan to have a Solar PV system installed, hence wanting to keep the hot water tank in the property, but possibly temporarily isolate it. 

Rodders53

Ask current house owners for their energy use numbers for the past few years.  That'll give a clue as to whether you need urgently replace it or not.

Gas cooking is cheaper than electric... and a range all electric induction hob will cost £ks and use more expensive electricity to run.

In your shoes I'd live with it for 12-24 months to see how it goes?

Keep HW tank or replace with an unvented equivalent to provide mains pressure showers heated by gas.  Get rid of those electric showers - those will eat expensive electricity.

You'll want HW storage as backup to any boiler fail (via expensive electric immersion;  but it is a backup)... and could divert excess solar to immersion heaters when you get that installed.

AGA/Raeburn manual states:
Max / Min Nett Input to boiler bit is 27.5 / 21.0 kW
and Max / Min Output of boiler is 23.4 / 17.6 kW
So around  85 / 84% efficiency.  
Not that shabby for an open flue non condensing boiler.

NB they also quote a gross input figure but I read that modern boilers use the nett number ('cos it looks 'better'?). 

FreeBear

Rodders53 said:

Ask current house owners for their energy use numbers for the past few years.  That'll give a clue as to whether you need urgently replace it or not.

Gas cooking is cheaper than electric... and a range all electric induction hob will cost £ks and use more expensive electricity to run.

Some of the comparison web sites tap in to a national database and auto-fill current supplier & energy usage boxes. A breach of privacy in my opinion, but useful if you want to compare consumption figures.

Yes, an induction range is expensive, but so is an electric or dual fuel. On the flip side, an induction hob (even if on a range cooker) is going to be more efficient than a gas flame. The heat is generated in the base of a pan, so no wasted heat going up the side - Also much easier to keep clean. Gas is around 40% efficient, electric (ring or ceramic) 75%, and induction, 85%. With induction, there is no naked flame, so almost zero fire risk, and most (all ?) hobs have sensors that will cut power if it detects a pan boiled dry.

Downside to induction is you can not use copper, aluminium, or glass pans, so you need to be a little picky about your cookware. And if you have a pacemaker, you shouldn't get too close to one.

poimnb

Thanks for the reply. 

I think I'll be giving it minimum 3-6 months to get a handle on the costs then go from there. Just don't want to go into winter 23 and throw away money on energy just to stay relatively warm. 

The current owners don't live there and, from what we've been told, the property has been largely empty for a good while. It may have been used as a holiday/temporary let during that time, but I don't think any prolonged time living there in recent years. I'm under the impression they're fairly wealthy and, whilst I might be stereotyping, they're not overly concerned about energy costs. Noticed the immersion timer was set to be on for a total of 5hrs/day, which seemed excessive to me. And that's ignoring the property being empty.

Did take meter readings between viewings and the empty house is using around 4kWh/day. Some lights on timers, fridge/freezer, alarm, other viewings. Which tells me the immersion heater is currently off (estimate 5hrs would be around 15kWh, assuming 100% on for 5hrs and the EPC mentions no thermostat on the water tank, but that could be wrong) 

We currently have an electric induction range cooker (that will stay in the house we're selling), and whilst I agree gas is cheaper, we much prefer the induction hob.

Definitely want to get rid of the electric showers... Especially as I like a long shower at times!!! 

Apodemus

I've got the kerosene version of that Rayburn and find it hard to think of life without it.  I really can't imagine why the immersion would ever need to be used (especially if the showers are electric).  My advice would be to give it a full year - you can't evaluate a heating system over the summer, and you're going to love that warm lump of cast iron in the kitchen to rest your rear against on a cold day!

twopenny

I have happy memories of a range. Not only cooking, drying clothes after rain, after washing, warming clothes before wearing and just being warm on a freezing day. Not to mention cakes and stews.
I'm envious.
Are you using all the rooms? Could you turn the heating down in the ones you aren't using? 
I'd live with it for a year taking notes and seeing what you can do to mitigate any costs. I've left 3 big items on my house that I said I would get rid of on purchase. Realised they were a bonus once living with them.

Ectophile

You could fit a traditional boiler, rather than a combi, and keep the hot water tank.  Keep the immersion heater as a backup.

If it's an old tank, consider replacing it with a modern one.  The modern ones come coated in a thick layer of foam, and stay warm all day if you don't use all the hot water.

markin

Getting rid of it means no draft up the chimney, and no fresh air vent letting in a draft either, the only air would be controlled extractor vents, making the house far warmer.

Apodemus

markin said:

Getting rid of it means no draft up the chimney, and no fresh air vent letting in a draft either, the only air would be controlled extractor vents, making the house far warmer.

...and potentially far wetter!  The warmth and air-extraction of the Rayburn does a fantastic job of drying clothes and dehumidifying our house in winter.  Once you change one piece of a working system, you often find knock-on effects elsewhere, which is why I would recommend the OP to live with it for a full year, to learn how their house works with their lifestyle.

markin

Most people know to use a tumble dryer unless they want mold problems, even using a dehumidifier would cost less than having a gale blowing through the house.

As its been empty for years anyway it may be a good idea to run a dehumidifier anyway for a couple of months.

nologo

What does the EPC suggest the costs are likely to be?

nologo