Duty and Vat, invoice after delivery - New question not previous addressed

DullGreyGuy

saltcod1 said:

Interestingly, I have just got off the phone to a senior advisor at Trading Standards.  

He informed me that absolutely do have the legal right to refuse to accept an unsolicited parcel and that, should DHL attempt to recover any customs fees they have paid, albeit "on my behalf" through the courts, they would have to demostrate my "consideration of contract"... a legal requirement for any contract to be valid. Since DHL denied me this right by simply dropping off the parcel at my home address and the parcel was not signed for.. there is no contract and therefore their claim against me is unlikely to be successful. 

As an aside.. he also said that he has been waiting for a case such as this to actually go through the courts. 

But you have the parcel so cannot refuse delivery.

They dont need to prove a contract exists, the postal act gives them a statutory right to charge

Aylesbury_Duck

saltcod1 said:

Interestingly, I have just got off the phone to a senior advisor at Trading Standards.  

He informed me that absolutely do have the legal right to refuse to accept an unsolicited parcel and that, should DHL attempt to recover any customs fees they have paid, albeit "on my behalf" through the courts, they would have to demostrate my "consideration of contract"... a legal requirement for any contract to be valid. Since DHL denied me this right by simply dropping off the parcel at my home address and the parcel was not signed for.. there is no contract and therefore their claim against me is unlikely to be successful. 

As an aside.. he also said that he has been waiting for a case such as this to actually go through the courts. 

Interesting.  How did you manage to get hold of a senior advisor at Trading Standards?

saltcod1

Aylesbury_Duck said

Interesting.  How did you manage to get hold of a senior advisor at Trading Standards?

Well.. it took a while.. but after speaking to a number of advisors both at HMRC and Trading Standards who felt they could not answer my specific question regarding a statutory right to refuse an unsolicited delivery, a "formal" query was create at Trading Standards, the case sent up the "food chain" and he called me. 

user1977

saltcod1 said:

Interestingly, I have just got off the phone to a senior advisor at Trading Standards.  

He informed me that absolutely do have the legal right to refuse to accept an unsolicited parcel and that, should DHL attempt to recover any customs fees they have paid, albeit "on my behalf" through the courts, they would have to demostrate my "consideration of contract"... a legal requirement for any contract to be valid. Since DHL denied me this right by simply dropping off the parcel at my home address and the parcel was not signed for.. there is no contract

But you're liable [or at least would be under normal circumstances...] under statute, not as a matter of contract.

saltcod1

You're correct, the postal act does indeed give them the statutory right to charge me but only if I accept the parcel. My acceptance of the parcel being under law the required "consideration of contract". DHL, by denying me the chance to accept or refuse delivery have, according to the Trading Standards adviser, denied my statutory rights under that same act... thererby making their claim against me seemingly hard to succesfully pursue. 

That said.. I am considering making a payment to DHL under protest and then taking them to court in order for the issue to be clarfied. 

saltcod1

user1977 said:

But you're liable [or at least would be under normal circumstances...] under statute, not as a matter of contract.

Under the relavent statute, I apparently (according to trading standards) do have the right to refuse delivery. 

DullGreyGuy

saltcod1 said:

You're correct, the postal act does indeed give them the statutory right to charge me but only if I accept the parcel. My acceptance of the parcel being under law the required "consideration of contract". DHL, by denying me the chance to accept or refuse delivery have, according to the Trading Standards adviser, denied my statutory rights under that same act... thererby making their claim against me seemingly hard to succesfully pursue. 

That said.. I am considering making a payment to DHL under protest and then taking them to court in order for the issue to be clarfied. 

I'd strongly contest that any contract is formed with receiving a parcel... a contract in England requires offer, acceptance and consideration. Consideration is normally payment but ultimately its what you do in exchange for what the other party is offering. 

What offer are DHL making?
How did you accept?
The act of accepting itself cannot be the consideration.

The Postal Act makes no reference to contract creation etc.

In Scotland you dont even need consideration to form a contract.

user1977

saltcod1 said:

You're correct, the postal act does indeed give them the statutory right to charge me but only if I accept the parcel. My acceptance of the parcel being under law the required "consideration of contract". 

But contracts don't come into it at all. Your senior adviser is confused.

tightauldgit

In the 'good old days' someone would turn up at your door and tell you that there is a parcel that requires £x in fees to be paid in order to collect it. You had a choice to leave it or pay and pick it up. 

You should absolutely have a right to reject delivery of a parcel but in this day and age of 'we left in you recycling bin' and 'charges turning up after you already received the parcel' then I don't know how that is applied in reality. 

saltcod1

I have taken your thoughts back to the Trading Standards. I am informed that both DHL and myself both have statutory rights under the Postal Act and that, (in their opinion) the specific manner in which DHL delivered the parcel (simply leaving it on my doorstep after having only confirmed I lived at the address) denied my statutory right to accept or refuse an unsolicited parcel. 

I geuss it'll be for the court now to decide which right trumps the other..

Thank so so much for all your advice and opinions, I've learnt a lot and greatly appreciate your time and imput.