Advice pl. Keys stolen from unlocked house. Car on rd outside boundary stolen. Contents of car too

lazydave

Thank you Aretnap.  I really hope that is the case

lazydave

user1977 said:

lazydave said:

user1977 said:

Aretnap said:

user1977 said:

If you mean it was on the road immediately outside your house, I'm not sure that means your contents were really "away from your home" any more than they would be if the car was sitting on a driveway. I would interpret it as meaning taking the stuff away with you somewhere else, not them still being in the immediate environs of your house.

I think the items are either at your home or away from your home. I've never seen a policy which creates a third category of "sort of in the general vicinity of your home". It would be much more arguable that they were at home if the car was on a driveway.

If course if the car was on a driveway or otherwise "at home" the contents would still be covered - subject to any exclusions that apply to the theft from your home section. For example any cover limits for items in the garden would come into play.

It would help if the OP could let us see the rest of the policy.

It is possible that "at home" could be construed as meaning more than strictly within your title boundaries - after all, motor insurers distinguish between "parking on the street (at home)" and "parking on the street (somewhere completely different)".

And obviously the intention of such cover is to cover things you've taken with you while you're on an excursion away from home - not stuff you couldn't be bothered bringing in from the car after you get back, and then leave in a rather insecure manner.

Hi

All I have on personal possession is:
Under what is covered:  Personal possessions away from your property....personal possessions are covered in and away from the home in the United Kingdom, all year round, and anywhere else in the world for up to 60 days during the period of insurance.

and contents is:

Loss or damage to contents in your home (including in garages and outbuildings within the boundaries of your property).

The is no mention of unlocked anywhere and under what is not covered is the usual war, terrorism etc 

BUT

Under my obligations is "You must take reasonable care to protect your insured property and keep it in good condition and repair." which is where their argument will lie I guess

I can see this running for a while and ending up with the ombudsman

Is the policy available online? It was really the full wording I was wanting to see.

Hi

This is the policy document.  Thank you for taking some time to have a look 

https://www.hellogetsafe.com/documents/home_policy_gb.pdf

lazydave

cymruchris said:

Aretnap said:

cymruchris said:

If your thief had the key - my interpretation would be that the boot was no longer locked, so I would imagine that cover wouldn't apply, but happy to hear other's viewpoints.

By that logic cover would also not apply if the thief had acquired the key by forcing entry to the house, picking the OP's pocket, or by physically robbing him in the street. Clearly the fact that the thief got hold of the key cannot in itself be enough to deny cover and as the policy doesn't seem to require that the key be stored with any particular level of security I can't see any reason why a claim could be declined.

Did the policy say anything about cover for theft is the house is not locked of if there is no sign of forced entry? At a push a clause like that might apply, but it would be a push, and most policies don't have such clauses anyway.

I think the only reason my thoughts were that it wouldn't cover it - was that the key potentially wasn't forcibly removed from anywhere or anyone, whereas in the scenarios you list yes, forcibly removed would intimate that you'd be covered.

Whatever happens I hope the OP can get a positive outcome - and can keep us updated on their progress.

Thank you and I will do

Keep_pedalling

I think you are on a hiding to nothing as far as your photographic kit is concerned, you were clearly not away from home and the kit would have been far more secure in your house than in your car. This type of cover provides for where the policy owner is travelling with the insured items not for when you left them in your car a few yards from your home. 

lazydave

in_my_wellies said:

lazydave said:

in_my_wellies said:

My mothers car was stolen from her drive whilst she was loading her art boxes for her painting class. The keys were on the table in the porch. Mum bent over to pick up a box from the hall and became aware of someone behind her. She though it was the postman. He grabbed the keys a drove away with her car. 

At first the car insurance company refused to pay as 'she had left the car unlocked' but she went to a solicitor and eventually they paid up. 

The car was then used in a bank robbery and soon recovered. Rather stupid of the thieves to use a distinctive car for this purpose.

This is the bit for OP to read:
The police 'requested' her car for forensics (but she didn't have a choice) and informed her after three days that she could collect it. She was charged 3 days fee for it being in the police compound. They just said she had to pay and should claim on her insurance. Most annoying as there was no damage to the car so she would have had no claim otherwise
So, OP, get your car out ASAP

That is interesting thanks.  There was mention of storage fees by someone reading from a script but no mention of how much or how long.  It was collected on Friday so I guess they will charge me for the weekend even though they don't work weekends?!  Do you know how much they charged your mum?  Seems a bit cruel to be hitting victims of crime with legalised robbery on top!

I think it was £120 a day but it was about 8 years ago. It was the only claim she made in 60 years of driving. She was furious as she thought she was helping the police catch the bank robber 

I would have been livid as well!

lazydave

I have a nasty feeling you may be right, but my policy elsewhere mentions my house boundaries so I am not sure

lazydave

Just found this section in my policy 

We will cover loss or damage to your contents while they are in your home if:

a) this was caused by theft or attempted theft following forced and violent entry to your home; or

b) deception has been used to gain entry to your home.

So I guess I am screwed as there are no signs of forced entry.  Feel sick now

Aretnap

lazydave said:

Just found this section in my policy 

We will cover loss or damage to your contents while they are in your home if:

a) this was caused by theft or attempted theft following forced and violent entry to your home; or

b) deception has been used to gain entry to your home.

So I guess I am screwed as there are no signs of forced entry.  Feel sick now

But that clause only applies if the items were in your home - which they were not.

lazydave

Aretnap said:

lazydave said:

Just found this section in my policy 

We will cover loss or damage to your contents while they are in your home if:

a) this was caused by theft or attempted theft following forced and violent entry to your home; or

b) deception has been used to gain entry to your home.

So I guess I am screwed as there are no signs of forced entry.  Feel sick now

But that clause only applies if the items were in your home - which they were not.

That's what I am pinning my hopes on.  The car was separated by pavement and verge that are not mine so I have a hope.  If I am honest it's a bit of a horrible roller coaster dealing with all this, distraught kids, costs incurred etc

user1977

lazydave said:

user1977 said:

lazydave said:

user1977 said:

Aretnap said:

user1977 said:

If you mean it was on the road immediately outside your house, I'm not sure that means your contents were really "away from your home" any more than they would be if the car was sitting on a driveway. I would interpret it as meaning taking the stuff away with you somewhere else, not them still being in the immediate environs of your house.

I think the items are either at your home or away from your home. I've never seen a policy which creates a third category of "sort of in the general vicinity of your home". It would be much more arguable that they were at home if the car was on a driveway.

If course if the car was on a driveway or otherwise "at home" the contents would still be covered - subject to any exclusions that apply to the theft from your home section. For example any cover limits for items in the garden would come into play.

It would help if the OP could let us see the rest of the policy.

It is possible that "at home" could be construed as meaning more than strictly within your title boundaries - after all, motor insurers distinguish between "parking on the street (at home)" and "parking on the street (somewhere completely different)".

And obviously the intention of such cover is to cover things you've taken with you while you're on an excursion away from home - not stuff you couldn't be bothered bringing in from the car after you get back, and then leave in a rather insecure manner.

Hi

All I have on personal possession is:
Under what is covered:  Personal possessions away from your property....personal possessions are covered in and away from the home in the United Kingdom, all year round, and anywhere else in the world for up to 60 days during the period of insurance.

and contents is:

Loss or damage to contents in your home (including in garages and outbuildings within the boundaries of your property).

The is no mention of unlocked anywhere and under what is not covered is the usual war, terrorism etc 

BUT

Under my obligations is "You must take reasonable care to protect your insured property and keep it in good condition and repair." which is where their argument will lie I guess

I can see this running for a while and ending up with the ombudsman

Is the policy available online? It was really the full wording I was wanting to see.

Hi

This is the policy document.  Thank you for taking some time to have a look 

https://www.hellogetsafe.com/documents/home_policy_gb.pdf

Ok, I can't see anything specific which would exclude a claim.

But I think you'll have a fight on your hands given the "reasonable care" clause, particularly as it says you've to lock up before going to bed.