want to get out of parents

CSI_Yorkshire

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

Exodi said:

I've been following this thread for quite some time now and think it's pretty obvious the OP doesn't want to move out. Their head and their heart seem to be in different places. Many of the things said recently have been said umpteen times over the past 4 months / 23 pages, the OP will continue to move the goalposts and create arbitrary criteria until they address the underlying issues first.

Are they anxious about being alone? Scared of change? Fear they'll make the wrong decision or regret their choice of house? Worried about upsetting parents? I'm not sure, maybe a bit of each.

As others have pointed out, they have a staggeringly large amount of savings, they could move out tomorrow if they truly wished to.

Yes, but as pointed out numerous times in the thread, why wast those savings on a housing bubble with interest rates rising at their fastest pace ever! It just makes no sense....

Owning your own home, if you choose to do so, is not "wasting those savings" despite how many times you decide to tell others what to do.

Similarly, investing in whatever index-linked special-money fund that you keep talking about, if you choose to do so, is not wasting it either.

Adults make choices and then live by the consequences of those choices, whether we would have made the same choice or not.

Both could turn out to be something that makes your savings disappear forever, but one is liquid (you can exit at the click of a mouse) the other is not (you could chase the market down for years and never get your money back)

Are you seriously saying that investments, that can go up and down by massive margins in a single moment (tens, hundreds or even thousands of percent) and have a chance of ending up with zero value, are safer than property purchasing that results in the ownership of a physical asset?

I was giving your finance knowledge the benefit of the doubt, but that's just idiotic.  Pushing an agenda without rationality.

MultiFuelBurner

If you keep feeding them, they just want more @CSI_Yorkshire

Most I have on the ignore list now in their various guises of one or two people as the moderator's just don't want to get a handle on this issue.

It's dangerous advice that some may take to be fact.

Phantom151

MultiFuelBurner said:

It's dangerous advice that some may take to be fact.

You mean I won't be able to pick up my next mansion for a tenner? Gutted...

Sarah1Mitty2

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

Exodi said:

I've been following this thread for quite some time now and think it's pretty obvious the OP doesn't want to move out. Their head and their heart seem to be in different places. Many of the things said recently have been said umpteen times over the past 4 months / 23 pages, the OP will continue to move the goalposts and create arbitrary criteria until they address the underlying issues first.

Are they anxious about being alone? Scared of change? Fear they'll make the wrong decision or regret their choice of house? Worried about upsetting parents? I'm not sure, maybe a bit of each.

As others have pointed out, they have a staggeringly large amount of savings, they could move out tomorrow if they truly wished to.

Yes, but as pointed out numerous times in the thread, why wast those savings on a housing bubble with interest rates rising at their fastest pace ever! It just makes no sense....

Owning your own home, if you choose to do so, is not "wasting those savings" despite how many times you decide to tell others what to do.

Similarly, investing in whatever index-linked special-money fund that you keep talking about, if you choose to do so, is not wasting it either.

Adults make choices and then live by the consequences of those choices, whether we would have made the same choice or not.

Both could turn out to be something that makes your savings disappear forever, but one is liquid (you can exit at the click of a mouse) the other is not (you could chase the market down for years and never get your money back)

Are you seriously saying that investments, that can go up and down by massive margins in a single moment (tens, hundreds or even thousands of percent) and have a chance of ending up with zero value, are safer than property purchasing that results in the ownership of a physical asset?

I was giving your finance knowledge the benefit of the doubt, but that's just idiotic.  Pushing an agenda without rationality.

So you are saying that an ETF or basic index fund tracking say one of the FTSE indexes or maybe one of the U.S indexes or a money market account could move by thousands of % and could end up with zero value? Can you tell us when this has happened? I am aware of a 40% or so drop on some investments during March 2020, that was the biggest hit I had seen to that point on my investment accounts (most well run money market accounts/funds stayed liquid throughout the crisis period)

Are you aware of the definitions "Liquid" and "Illiquid", and the asset classes that are normally considered to be part of each definition?

elsien

Riveting though this is, I think it may have drifted away just a tad from the type of information the OP was looking for. 

Sarah1Mitty2

MultiFuelBurner said:

If you keep feeding them, they just want more @CSI_Yorkshire

Most I have on the ignore list now in their various guises of one or two people as the moderator's just don't want to get a handle on this issue.

It's dangerous advice that some may take to be fact.

I think the use of the word "forever" caused the confusion, I shouldn`t have used that term, but most people understand that it is easier to get savings back from a savings account or money market fund than it is from trying to sell a house.

jimbog

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

Exodi said:

I've been following this thread for quite some time now and think it's pretty obvious the OP doesn't want to move out. Their head and their heart seem to be in different places. Many of the things said recently have been said umpteen times over the past 4 months / 23 pages, the OP will continue to move the goalposts and create arbitrary criteria until they address the underlying issues first.

Are they anxious about being alone? Scared of change? Fear they'll make the wrong decision or regret their choice of house? Worried about upsetting parents? I'm not sure, maybe a bit of each.

As others have pointed out, they have a staggeringly large amount of savings, they could move out tomorrow if they truly wished to.

Yes, but as pointed out numerous times in the thread, why wast those savings on a housing bubble with interest rates rising at their fastest pace ever! It just makes no sense....

Owning your own home, if you choose to do so, is not "wasting those savings" despite how many times you decide to tell others what to do.

Similarly, investing in whatever index-linked special-money fund that you keep talking about, if you choose to do so, is not wasting it either.

Adults make choices and then live by the consequences of those choices, whether we would have made the same choice or not.

Both could turn out to be something that makes your savings disappear forever, but one is liquid (you can exit at the click of a mouse) the other is not (you could chase the market down for years and never get your money back)

Are you seriously saying that investments, that can go up and down by massive margins in a single moment (tens, hundreds or even thousands of percent) and have a chance of ending up with zero value, are safer than property purchasing that results in the ownership of a physical asset?

I was giving your finance knowledge the benefit of the doubt, but that's just idiotic.  Pushing an agenda without rationality.

 I am aware of a 40% or so drop on some investments during March 2020, that was the biggest hit I had seen to that point on my investment accounts 

Ouch! I remember that. And you were unable to access your accounts too

Divorcing_Dad

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

Exodi said:

I've been following this thread for quite some time now and think it's pretty obvious the OP doesn't want to move out. Their head and their heart seem to be in different places. Many of the things said recently have been said umpteen times over the past 4 months / 23 pages, the OP will continue to move the goalposts and create arbitrary criteria until they address the underlying issues first.

Are they anxious about being alone? Scared of change? Fear they'll make the wrong decision or regret their choice of house? Worried about upsetting parents? I'm not sure, maybe a bit of each.

As others have pointed out, they have a staggeringly large amount of savings, they could move out tomorrow if they truly wished to.

Yes, but as pointed out numerous times in the thread, why wast those savings on a housing bubble with interest rates rising at their fastest pace ever! It just makes no sense....

Owning your own home, if you choose to do so, is not "wasting those savings" despite how many times you decide to tell others what to do.

Similarly, investing in whatever index-linked special-money fund that you keep talking about, if you choose to do so, is not wasting it either.

Adults make choices and then live by the consequences of those choices, whether we would have made the same choice or not.

Both could turn out to be something that makes your savings disappear forever, but one is liquid (you can exit at the click of a mouse) the other is not (you could chase the market down for years and never get your money back)

Are you seriously saying that investments, that can go up and down by massive margins in a single moment (tens, hundreds or even thousands of percent) and have a chance of ending up with zero value, are safer than property purchasing that results in the ownership of a physical asset?

I was giving your finance knowledge the benefit of the doubt, but that's just idiotic.  Pushing an agenda without rationality.

So you are saying that an ETF or basic index fund tracking say one of the FTSE indexes or maybe one of the U.S indexes or a money market account could move by thousands of % and could end up with zero value? Can you tell us when this has happened? I am aware of a 40% or so drop on some investments during March 2020, that was the biggest hit I had seen to that point on my investment accounts (most well run money market accounts/funds stayed liquid throughout the crisis period)

Are you aware of the definitions "Liquid" and "Illiquid", and the asset classes that are normally considered to be part of each definition?

You seem to be an expert on the housing market. Could you tell us your experiences in buying and selling, particularly where you've made a killing or a loss?

If I'm reading this right, what you're saying is.....

Spending capital on a house is not a wise thing to do. It's better to live in a rented house and then invest a small amount of money into an index fund.

That makes no sense. I'll take Mr Average renting vs buying.

Buying:

in 2003, he bought a house with a 20 year mortgage with a 10% deposit for £128,000. Today, that house is worth £285,000.

His monthly mortgage payments (based on 10 year fixed) were:

2003 - 2013 £783.37  and 2013-2023 £725.36

Today, if he sells his house, he has £285,000 in his pocket.

Renting:

Since 2003, the average rental (that I can find - it's hard to find figures between 2003 and 2008) appears to be somewhere around £700 a month. But hey, I'll give you £650 just to be fair.

Let's invest the difference. That's £133.37 between 2003-13 and £75.36 between 2013-23. We'll add the £13,300 you've put in.

You now have £25,823.In an S&P investment, putting it all in in 2003, you've made 555% profit.

You've only got £169,140 in your pocket. And you've been living on your landlord's whim, filling his pockets with no rights. And realistically, you didn't put all the money in at the beginning,  and that makes an assumption you had no fees.

And what's worst in the above scenario is.... if after paying his mortgage off rather than sell, he puts his mortgage payments into his S&P, he'll have a bigger investment 20 years later and you're still going to have to pay the rent.

Sarah1Mitty2

Divorcing_Dad said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Sarah1Mitty2 said:

Exodi said:

I've been following this thread for quite some time now and think it's pretty obvious the OP doesn't want to move out. Their head and their heart seem to be in different places. Many of the things said recently have been said umpteen times over the past 4 months / 23 pages, the OP will continue to move the goalposts and create arbitrary criteria until they address the underlying issues first.

Are they anxious about being alone? Scared of change? Fear they'll make the wrong decision or regret their choice of house? Worried about upsetting parents? I'm not sure, maybe a bit of each.

As others have pointed out, they have a staggeringly large amount of savings, they could move out tomorrow if they truly wished to.

Yes, but as pointed out numerous times in the thread, why wast those savings on a housing bubble with interest rates rising at their fastest pace ever! It just makes no sense....

Owning your own home, if you choose to do so, is not "wasting those savings" despite how many times you decide to tell others what to do.

Similarly, investing in whatever index-linked special-money fund that you keep talking about, if you choose to do so, is not wasting it either.

Adults make choices and then live by the consequences of those choices, whether we would have made the same choice or not.

Both could turn out to be something that makes your savings disappear forever, but one is liquid (you can exit at the click of a mouse) the other is not (you could chase the market down for years and never get your money back)

Are you seriously saying that investments, that can go up and down by massive margins in a single moment (tens, hundreds or even thousands of percent) and have a chance of ending up with zero value, are safer than property purchasing that results in the ownership of a physical asset?

I was giving your finance knowledge the benefit of the doubt, but that's just idiotic.  Pushing an agenda without rationality.

So you are saying that an ETF or basic index fund tracking say one of the FTSE indexes or maybe one of the U.S indexes or a money market account could move by thousands of % and could end up with zero value? Can you tell us when this has happened? I am aware of a 40% or so drop on some investments during March 2020, that was the biggest hit I had seen to that point on my investment accounts (most well run money market accounts/funds stayed liquid throughout the crisis period)

Are you aware of the definitions "Liquid" and "Illiquid", and the asset classes that are normally considered to be part of each definition?

You seem to be an expert on the housing market. Could you tell us your experiences in buying and selling, particularly where you've made a killing or a loss?

If I'm reading this right, what you're saying is.....

Spending capital on a house is not a wise thing to do. It's better to live in a rented house and then invest a small amount of money into an index fund.

That makes no sense. I'll take Mr Average renting vs buying.

Buying:

in 2003, he bought a house with a 20 year mortgage with a 10% deposit for £128,000. Today, that house is worth £285,000.

His monthly mortgage payments (based on 10 year fixed) were:

2003 - 2013 £783.37  and 2013-2023 £725.36

Today, if he sells his house, he has £285,000 in his pocket.

Renting:

Since 2003, the average rental (that I can find - it's hard to find figures between 2003 and 2008) appears to be somewhere around £700 a month. But hey, I'll give you £650 just to be fair.

Let's invest the difference. That's £133.37 between 2003-13 and £75.36 between 2013-23. We'll add the £13,300 you've put in.

You now have £25,823.In an S&P investment, putting it all in in 2003, you've made 555% profit.

You've only got £169,140 in your pocket. And you've been living on your landlord's whim, filling his pockets with no rights. And realistically, you didn't put all the money in at the beginning,  and that makes an assumption you had no fees.

And what's worst in the above scenario is.... if after paying his mortgage off rather than sell, he puts his mortgage payments into his S&P, he'll have a bigger investment 20 years later and you're still going to have to pay the rent.

The thread is about someone trying to decide whether to live at home or buy a house, there was a guy on SKY news recently who had been paying 700 pm on his mortgage and now, because interest rates are returning to normal, he is paying  1400, the guy said he has to work 80 hours a week just to keep up with his debt payments. On the other hand the OP has minimal housing costs and is building a savings/investment pot for the future, which one would you rather be? Hypothetical discussions based on how much we hope someone in the future will pay for a house are fine, but for most people it is the cash outlay in the here and now that counts, and for people coming off 2 and 5 year fixes they will in many cases regret the amount of mortgage debt they have signed up for in my opinion.

CSI_Yorkshire

Changing the topic when someone has a better argument than you.  Super.

Did your man on sky news (who seems to be the only person you ever reference) say that he wished he'd been giving the £700pm to someone else to pay to their mortgage instead?  Thought not.

This OP says they don't want to be in their present situation with the 'minimal housing costs' that you are so keen on, so saying "just stay there and buy EFTs" is entirely unhelpful.