Looking for a Torque Convertor Auto - motability car

MouldyOldDough

daydotz said:

the renault is a dct with the 1.3 tce 

daydotz said:

the renault is a dct with the 1.3 tce 

So that's renault out too 

Keep_pedalling

If smooth and quiet is a major criteria, how about an EV?

Bigwheels1111

As I said above the EAT 6 & EAT 8 boxes have torque converters.
So Citroen, Peugeot and Vauxhall use them.Maybe others use them.
My friend has an Insignia and the box looks like mine.

Goudy

Things have changed a lot with auto gearboxes.
A lot dropped the TC's and started using DCT, CVT's and Automated manuals, now some are reverting back to TC's but DCT's have moved on a little since some disastrous attempts earlier on.

Renault do use the DCT with the 1.3 TCe engine but it's a wet clutch system rather than a dry clutch system that many had trouble with.

I have it in my car.
After testing many of the alternatives I thought it performed better than the rest.
It's very smooth, you hardly notice the changes which are pretty much instant, you certianly can't feel them. It's very positive, there's no sense it's slipping or any untoward engine revving at all.
It's also very efficient, I would say mpg is comparable with a manual.

It's worked perfectly. No untoward or suddern hard changes, totally fuss free but once in gear the drive to the wheels just feels like a manual.
I'm not worried about relablity, the car came with a 5 year warranty, so far (3 years) it's been perfect.

I found some VAG models tended to fuss about over gearchanges, I got the feeling when mated to a less powerful engine (1.0 95hp) they can make a few hard shifts in some inoppertune moments and stutter a little when the car hasn't quite stopped and you pull away again.
I had a DSG Seat Ibiza loaner a while ago and it started tripping into some ECO mode, down hill it just felt like it was coasting until you brushed the brakes, then it slammed it into gear, which felt like reverse gear!

I found CVTs just too annoying. I can't ignore the difference between road speed and engine speed, it just does my head in!

Most TC's to me feel just too slushy, that laboured slippy crescendo before the changes just doesn't do it for me, it doesn't feel satisfying.

Most automated manuals just don't creep which makes slow maneuvering a pain in the backside.

Before you write them out, try some test drives.
Take a few over a weekend and see which drives better.

UncleZen

Well described by @Goudy although personally I think that the CVT is the ultimate gearbox tech.

Ganga

I know how torque convertors work having worked on large earth moving machines but do not know how /what 
DCT ,DSG and CVT gearboxes are or how they work ,can one of you well informed let me know ( and probably many other on this site ) 

facade

Ganga said:

I know how torque convertors work having worked on large earth moving machines but do not know how /what 
DCT ,DSG and CVT gearboxes are or how they work ,can one of you well informed let me know ( and probably many other on this site ) 

DCT and DSG are the same thing. Dual clutch transmission/direct shift gearbox/dual shaft gearbox.

It is a manual gearbox with 2 mainshafts , both driven, and either can be clutched to the output shaft  with a multplate clutch like a motorbike. Early ones used a dry clutch, but they burnt out on the way home from the showroom, so pretty much all of them use oil soaked clutches like in conventional autos/motorbikes now.

One mainshaft has all the odd gears, the other all the even.

The gearbox queues up the gears ready to go, e.g. 1&2.  When you start off the odd clutch slips as usual and at the right speed it opens as the even clutch engages and drags down the engine speed to match the output shaft. Then the odd shaft engages 3rd ready for the next up change.

The advantage is they are super fast at upchanging and perfect for a motorcycle style change lever/flappy paddles, but if the controller isn't too good, the "spare" shaft could be in the "up" gear, and it takes a while to swap to the next gear down.

A CVT uses a pair of adjustable conical pulleys with a band between them for the drive.

The pulleys can clamp together and force the band to move outwards, effectively driving on a larger diameter. (Meanwhile the other one relaxes and lets the band slip inwards to a smaller diameter) This provides an infinitely (in theory) variable gear ratio between two limits. (like about 3:1)

To start off there is a torque converter that provides torque multiplication, slippage and the lower gear necessary to get it moving until the speed is within the range of the cones, when the TC locks up.

The advantage of the CVT is that the engine can be screaming away at max power or max efficiency all the time, and the CVT keeps it matched to the road speed. This actually frightens drivers, so some CVTs have discrete ratio steps, and let the engine speed up & slow down like a normal auto/manual.

Hybrids use a CVT.

CVTs had a big knockback because Nissan managed to make one where the belt disintegrates at ridiculously low mileages, and scraps the gearbox.

Ganga

facade said:

Ganga said:

I know how torque convertors work having worked on large earth moving machines but do not know how /what 
DCT ,DSG and CVT gearboxes are or how they work ,can one of you well informed let me know ( and probably many other on this site ) 

DCT and DSG are the same thing. Dual clutch transmission/direct shift gearbox/dual shaft gearbox.

It is a manual gearbox with 2 mainshafts , both driven, and either can be clutched to the output shaft  with a multplate clutch like a motorbike. Early ones used a dry clutch, but they burnt out on the way home from the showroom, so pretty much all of them use oil soaked clutches like in conventional autos/motorbikes now.

One mainshaft has all the odd gears, the other all the even.

The gearbox queues up the gears ready to go, e.g. 1&2.  When you start off the odd clutch slips as usual and at the right speed it opens as the even clutch engages and drags down the engine speed to match the output shaft. Then the odd shaft engages 3rd ready for the next up change.

The advantage is they are super fast at upchanging and perfect for a motorcycle style change lever/flappy paddles, but if the controller isn't too good, the "spare" shaft could be in the "up" gear, and it takes a while to swap to the next gear down.

A CVT uses a pair of adjustable conical pulleys with a band between them for the drive.

The pulleys can clamp together and force the band to move outwards, effectively driving on a larger diameter. (Meanwhile the other one relaxes and lets the band slip inwards to a smaller diameter) This provides an infinitely (in theory) variable gear ratio between two limits. (like about 3:1)

To start off there is a torque converter that provides torque multiplication, slippage and the lower gear necessary to get it moving until the speed is within the range of the cones, when the TC locks up.

The advantage of the CVT is that the engine can be screaming away at max power or max efficiency all the time, and the CVT keeps it matched to the road speed. This actually frightens drivers, so some CVTs have discrete ratio steps, and let the engine speed up & slow down like a normal auto/manual.

Hybrids use a CVT.

CVTs had a big knockback because Nissan managed to make one where the belt disintegrates at ridiculously low mileages, and scraps the gearbox.

Sounds like the drive system that DAF used to use on their cars.

facade

Ganga said:

facade said:

Ganga said:

I know how torque convertors work having worked on large earth moving machines but do not know how /what 
DCT ,DSG and CVT gearboxes are or how they work ,can one of you well informed let me know ( and probably many other on this site ) 

DCT and DSG are the same thing. Dual clutch transmission/direct shift gearbox/dual shaft gearbox.

It is a manual gearbox with 2 mainshafts , both driven, and either can be clutched to the output shaft  with a multplate clutch like a motorbike. Early ones used a dry clutch, but they burnt out on the way home from the showroom, so pretty much all of them use oil soaked clutches like in conventional autos/motorbikes now.

One mainshaft has all the odd gears, the other all the even.

The gearbox queues up the gears ready to go, e.g. 1&2.  When you start off the odd clutch slips as usual and at the right speed it opens as the even clutch engages and drags down the engine speed to match the output shaft. Then the odd shaft engages 3rd ready for the next up change.

The advantage is they are super fast at upchanging and perfect for a motorcycle style change lever/flappy paddles, but if the controller isn't too good, the "spare" shaft could be in the "up" gear, and it takes a while to swap to the next gear down.

A CVT uses a pair of adjustable conical pulleys with a band between them for the drive.

The pulleys can clamp together and force the band to move outwards, effectively driving on a larger diameter. (Meanwhile the other one relaxes and lets the band slip inwards to a smaller diameter) This provides an infinitely (in theory) variable gear ratio between two limits. (like about 3:1)

To start off there is a torque converter that provides torque multiplication, slippage and the lower gear necessary to get it moving until the speed is within the range of the cones, when the TC locks up.

The advantage of the CVT is that the engine can be screaming away at max power or max efficiency all the time, and the CVT keeps it matched to the road speed. This actually frightens drivers, so some CVTs have discrete ratio steps, and let the engine speed up & slow down like a normal auto/manual.

Hybrids use a CVT.

CVTs had a big knockback because Nissan managed to make one where the belt disintegrates at ridiculously low mileages, and scraps the gearbox.

Sounds like the drive system that DAF used to use on their cars.

It is, except DAF used rubber belts which pulled, CVTs use a clockspring band covered in wedge shaped segments that push. (Nissan's problem is the band snapping and filling the gearbox with the metal wedges, presumably it fatigues with the repeated flexing)

IIRC, DAF didn't have a differential, there was a belt to each wheel, and the dif action was from the pulleys changing diameter, both front pulleys were locked together, and you could carry on with one wheel drive if a belt snapped

daveyjp

Some modern CVTs have stepped 'gears' and are now so close to a TC, offering kickdown, paddle shift between steps etc anyone not in the know would struggle to notice the difference between the two.