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FPN for littering in the local area, 2 streets away
Comments
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I would also forget about any threats of prosecution.
I would also be making a formal complaint.
The letter you were sent clearly states " you were witnesses" when that isn't the case.
Making false statement to indue a payment is a big no-no.
Let's Be Careful Out There0 -
ifti said:RhondaD said:Forget about cameras and being asleep at the time. It sounds like they just found some rubbish a couple of streets away with some correspondence in it with your address on. In theory a letter addressed to you could have been posted to the wrong address (it happens a lot) and they just binned it then dumped their rubbish. In going through it the letter was found and you now become the dumper as a result because your address was with the rubbish in the bag. In that case the only evidence they will need is a piece of correspondence with your details on, and it sounds like that's what they have.i still dont umderstand how they actualy planning to prove it was me who actually dumped it, i did mention whats to stop me dumping some rubbish linking it to frame my neighbour, theres only one i dont like ?i havent heard anything back for a few days now, maybe in 3 months they may actually send somthing to procesute me!
Make sure you come back and tell us if they do.1 -
ifti said:RhondaD said:Forget about cameras and being asleep at the time. It sounds like they just found some rubbish a couple of streets away with some correspondence in it with your address on. In theory a letter addressed to you could have been posted to the wrong address (it happens a lot) and they just binned it then dumped their rubbish. In going through it the letter was found and you now become the dumper as a result because your address was with the rubbish in the bag. In that case the only evidence they will need is a piece of correspondence with your details on, and it sounds like that's what they have.i still dont umderstand how they actualy planning to prove it was me who actually dumped it, i did mention whats to stop me dumping some rubbish linking it to frame my neighbour, theres only one i dont like ?i havent heard anything back for a few days now, maybe in 3 months they may actually send somthing to procesute me!3
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The legislation states that you are responsible for ensuring that your waste is disposed of correctly which is why you do not need to have done it personally.0
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sheramber said:The legislation states that you are responsible for ensuring that your waste is disposed of correctly which is why you do not need to have done it personally.
A person is guilty of an offence if he throws down, drops or otherwise deposits any litter in any place to which this section applies and leaves it.
The OP claims "he" neither threw down, dropped or otherwise deposited of said litter and "he" did disposed of correctly.
If it was as simple as just removing a black bag from someones bin and dumping it, thereby getting that person a fine, I think there would be a glut of them when neighbour disputes get nasty.
Let's Be Careful Out There0 -
HillStreetBlues said:sheramber said:The legislation states that you are responsible for ensuring that your waste is disposed of correctly which is why you do not need to have done it personally.
A person is guilty of an offence if he throws down, drops or otherwise deposits any litter in any place to which this section applies and leaves it.
The OP claims "he" neither threw down, dropped or otherwise deposited of said litter and "he" did disposed of correctly.
If it was as simple as just removing a black bag from someones bin and dumping it, thereby getting that person a fine, I think there would be a glut of them when neighbour disputes get nasty.
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HillStreetBlues said:sheramber said:The legislation states that you are responsible for ensuring that your waste is disposed of correctly which is why you do not need to have done it personally.
A person is guilty of an offence if he throws down, drops or otherwise deposits any litter in any place to which this section applies and leaves it.
The OP claims "he" neither threw down, dropped or otherwise deposited of said litter and "he" did disposed of correctly.
If it was as simple as just removing a black bag from someones bin and dumping it, thereby getting that person a fine, I think there would be a glut of them when neighbour disputes get nasty.
My advice would be to let sleeping dogs lie on this one. I certainly wouldn't be making a complaint now the other party has gone silent.0 -
Nearlyold said:You don't have to witnessed in the act of dumping rubbish to be fined:- https://www.northlincs.gov.uk/news/two-people-fined-for-dumped-rubbish/
One person admitted paying someone to dump it (that is an offense, and I would never say otherwise)
Second person paid the fine, so is unknown if he dumped the bags (or got someone else to do it) or for whatever reason paid up.
What needs to be found to prove your point is someone that denies guilt and is convicted solely on what is contained in the bag.
Let's Be Careful Out There0 -
Ectophile said:HillStreetBlues said:
Environmental Protection Act 1990 Secti on 33 which prohibits the deposit of controlled waste, or knowingly cause or knowingly permit controlled waste to be deposited in or on any land unless an environmental permit authorising the deposit is in force and the deposit is in accordance with the license.
So seems they have no prove you deposited the bag.
So for second part they need to prove that you knew your bag would be dumped there.
This could be that you let someone take the bag and you have a reasonable believe that it would be dumped.
So even if you gave the neighbor the bag in believe they would put in their bin, but they just dumped it, you aren't liable.
If all the council has is a name in a bag, then at best they are sabre rattling, at worse they are knowingly issuing penalties that have no basis in law.
Section 33 is about controlled substances. So unless the OP has been disposing of hazardous waste, I don't see how it's relevant.Section 87 deals with littering.HillStreetBlues said:ifti said:this shows us they dont have a clue about the Enviromential Protection Act.
But they still need to prove it was you dumping the sack there or had believe that you knew it would be dumped there.
Although the FPN refers to a litter offence under s87, the email from the council dated 13 January refers (for some unknown reason) to fly-tipping under s33 which has nothing to do with the FPN.
Terribly poor communication all round from Ealing...1 -
Good spot
I did wonder why I linked to the incorrect section, when rechecked I just looked at the FPN.
So to try and get OP to pay FPN they have lied about being witnessed and quoting S87 that has a a much higher sentence limit.
Let's Be Careful Out There0
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