Returning an opened but unused Laptop to Argos that I bought online 9 January at 2:42PM in Consumer rights 32 replies 2K views

SiliconChip

macman said:

Alderbank said:

macman said:

Why didn't you physically examine the same model in a 'real shop' before purchasing through Argos? It's like buying a car without road testing it.
CCR does certainly give you the right to return it, but you could have avoided the hassle.

Where is that wonderful shop?

Argos list over 200 different laptops, several of which are marked 'exclusive'.

My local Currys has about 10 laptops on display, of which 3 are also sold by Argos. A Tesco superstore 10 miles away has some on display, again 3 or 4 are also sold by Argos.
That's about it in the medium-sized Scottish town where I live.

 John Lewis would be another possibility?

Even John Lewis isn't the be all and end all. I bought the laptop I'm using now from them in 2019, I'd always intended to buy it online to give me more right to return but I attempted to view it in store before ordering, but they didn't have one available in either of the two stores that I visited. So I had to order blindly, and before I did I got confirmation in writing from JL customer services that I could return it after delivery and inspection but before turning it on. Fortunately it did meet my needs, although it has had to go back to JL (and then to ASUS) for repair once and I've paid for a independent repair after the warranty ended.

Undervalued

DullGreyGuy said:

MalMonroe said:

macman said:

Why didn't you physically examine the same model in a 'real shop' before purchasing through Argos? It's like buying a car without road testing it.
CCR does certainly give you the right to return it, but you could have avoided the hassle.

That's great but your comment is ableist in that it discounts those who are unable to get out and about and visit 'real shops' - for whatever reason.

Being able to buy online can be a great lifeline for those who cannot physically get out and about. In a perfect world, yes, maybe that would make sense but it's not a perfect world and online shopping has safeguards so that people who have to buy online don't have to visit shops in person.

I realise that the OP was able to go and collect the laptop after purchasing online but many others don't have that luxury. Also buying a car without road testing it is something that a lot of people have to do, unfortunately.  

Please spare a thought for those who can't easily get out and about. 

Part of the issue however may also be that the OP has decided to return it to store rather than follow an online returns process. In store staff are presumably much more used to dealing with in store purchases for which there are different statutory rights and potentially also a different returns policy.

Given we know the OP has visited the store twice out of their own free will rather than necessity its rather inappropriate to raise the "ist" flag 

I suspect they'd have less issues following the online return process than taking it to store. 

Quite.

Yes there are additional consumer rights / safeguards that come with an online / distance purchase. By and large that is a good thing. However all too often they are abused (although I am not suggesting that has happened in this thread) and ultimately we all end up paying.

Camera dealers are an example who suffer badly from this, especially with high end lenses costing, in many cases, thousands of pounds. They are frequently "bought", used for a few days and returned. All too often that is for commercial work when technically the consumer laws don't apply. However as most photographers are sole traders, operating in their own name, plus the fact that more high end gear is actually bought by enthusiasts than professionals it is almost unpoliceable.

macman

Manxman_in_exile said:

macman said:

Alderbank said:

macman said:

Why didn't you physically examine the same model in a 'real shop' before purchasing through Argos? It's like buying a car without road testing it.
CCR does certainly give you the right to return it, but you could have avoided the hassle.

Where is that wonderful shop?

Argos list over 200 different laptops, several of which are marked 'exclusive'.

My local Currys has about 10 laptops on display, of which 3 are also sold by Argos. A Tesco superstore 10 miles away has some on display, again 3 or 4 are also sold by Argos.
That's about it in the medium-sized Scottish town where I live.

... Rejecting it because the colour is not quite right is more akin to buyer's remorse than any quality issues.

Is that relevant?  Does it make it non-returnable?

I never suggested it was non-returnable. I suggested that, with an item of this nature, the issue could have possibly been avoided by a physical inspection prior to purchase.

DullGreyGuy

Undervalued said:
Camera dealers are an example who suffer badly from this, especially with high end lenses costing, in many cases, thousands of pounds. They are frequently "bought", used for a few days and returned. All too often that is for commercial work when technically the consumer laws don't apply. However as most photographers are sole traders, operating in their own name, plus the fact that more high end gear is actually bought by enthusiasts than professionals it is almost unpoliceable.

I'd be surprised if many true pro's are doing it, beyond a "try before you buy" type thing, as if you are weddings, corporate, architecture etc you will have a stable of workhorse lenses and will own them (or lease them) because you use them daily. If your mortgage is paid by touring offices doing corporate headshots you arent going to be asked to suddenly cover the football and rush out for a £20k RF-800L

Enthusiasts, who possibly are trying to break into being a Pro or occasionally do paid jobs then they are more likely to decide to do a one weekend upgrade of their non-L RF-800 when the local soccer team ask for some photos in the hope the £19k upgrade lens gets them more similar engagements (if they have a spare £20k to put down)

cmthephoenix

Ordinarily I would say since you purchased it online you have to contact online to arrange the return regardless of where you picked the item up from because they can be entirely separate business operations.

However, the link below makes it clear you have the right to return to store if you have purchase online.
Help & FAQs - Do I have to return my item to the store where I bought/ collected it? (argos.co.uk)

I would contact online where you purchased the item from, confirm in writing that you can return the opened and unused laptop to store and then take that to the store.

Undervalued

DullGreyGuy said:

Undervalued said:
Camera dealers are an example who suffer badly from this, especially with high end lenses costing, in many cases, thousands of pounds. They are frequently "bought", used for a few days and returned. All too often that is for commercial work when technically the consumer laws don't apply. However as most photographers are sole traders, operating in their own name, plus the fact that more high end gear is actually bought by enthusiasts than professionals it is almost unpoliceable.

I'd be surprised if many true pro's are doing it, beyond a "try before you buy" type thing, as if you are weddings, corporate, architecture etc you will have a stable of workhorse lenses and will own them (or lease them) because you use them daily. If your mortgage is paid by touring offices doing corporate headshots you arent going to be asked to suddenly cover the football and rush out for a £20k RF-800L

Enthusiasts, who possibly are trying to break into being a Pro or occasionally do paid jobs then they are more likely to decide to do a one weekend upgrade of their non-L RF-800 when the local soccer team ask for some photos in the hope the £19k upgrade lens gets them more similar engagements (if they have a spare £20k to put down)

I was thinking more of lenses in the £2K to £5K range (new and 2nd hand) and have it on good authority it happens quite a lot. Obviously it is slightly more difficult for most people to cover a £20K card transaction for a remote "sale".

Many years ago, in the largely pre digital days, I knew the manager of professional photographic dealer quite well. He told me that he sold at least three Hasselblads to amateurs / enthusiasts for every one they sold to professionals. Even then they would refuse mail order "sales" on expensive gear from customers they didn't know because too much of it came back! They would hire out their s/h stock, sometimes at little or no charge to trusted customers to encourage goodwill.

Undervalued

cmthephoenix said:

Ordinarily I would say since you purchased it online you have to contact online to arrange the return regardless of where you picked the item up from because they can be entirely separate business operations.

However, the link below makes it clear you have the right to return to store if you have purchase online.
Help & FAQs - Do I have to return my item to the store where I bought/ collected it? (argos.co.uk)

I would contact online where you purchased the item from, confirm in writing that you can return the opened and unused laptop to store and then take that to the store.

Assuming the OP's account is true and complete, I don't think anybody is disputing that they have a right to a refund and the manager has got this wrong.

oestcote

Hi all, thanks for your feedback. 

Have followed up with Argos and they are still refusing to refund the product. They are claiming it isn't covered by the the Consumer Contract Regulations and 14-Day grace period because, while it was an online purchase, it was collected in-store via click and collect instead of home delivery.

So, in-store said no. Phone team said no. Social media team said no. Final option is via email. Wish me luck.

 

jon81uk

oestcote said:

Hi all, thanks for your feedback. 

Have followed up with Argos and they are still refusing to refund the product. They are claiming it isn't covered by the the Consumer Contract Regulations and 14-Day grace period because, while it was an online purchase, it was collected in-store via click and collect instead of home delivery.

So, in-store said no. Phone team said no. Social media team said no. Final option is via email. Wish me luck.

 

As long as you didn't pay in-store they are wrong, the contract was formed off-site.

DullGreyGuy

Undervalued said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Undervalued said:
Camera dealers are an example who suffer badly from this, especially with high end lenses costing, in many cases, thousands of pounds. They are frequently "bought", used for a few days and returned. All too often that is for commercial work when technically the consumer laws don't apply. However as most photographers are sole traders, operating in their own name, plus the fact that more high end gear is actually bought by enthusiasts than professionals it is almost unpoliceable.

I'd be surprised if many true pro's are doing it, beyond a "try before you buy" type thing, as if you are weddings, corporate, architecture etc you will have a stable of workhorse lenses and will own them (or lease them) because you use them daily. If your mortgage is paid by touring offices doing corporate headshots you arent going to be asked to suddenly cover the football and rush out for a £20k RF-800L

Enthusiasts, who possibly are trying to break into being a Pro or occasionally do paid jobs then they are more likely to decide to do a one weekend upgrade of their non-L RF-800 when the local soccer team ask for some photos in the hope the £19k upgrade lens gets them more similar engagements (if they have a spare £20k to put down)

I was thinking more of lenses in the £2K to £5K range (new and 2nd hand) and have it on good authority it happens quite a lot. Obviously it is slightly more difficult for most people to cover a £20K card transaction for a remote "sale".

Many years ago, in the largely pre digital days, I knew the manager of professional photographic dealer quite well. He told me that he sold at least three Hasselblads to amateurs / enthusiasts for every one they sold to professionals. Even then they would refuse mail order "sales" on expensive gear from customers they didn't know because too much of it came back! They would hire out their s/h stock, sometimes at little or no charge to trusted customers to encourage goodwill.

I'd somewhat question how they know whos a pro and who's a pure amateur but it wouldnt suprise me if it werent the case that more pro kit is sold to non-pro's simply as the volumes of amateurs is vastly higher. I dont know how many pro-wildlife photographers there are but go to the nearest RSPB site to us on any weekend and there are 50+ amateurs all with kit in excess of £5k and some well in excess of £10k.

I struggle to see how a pro working circa 5 days a week can be ordering and returning their kit every 2 weeks. Most I know are into product, portraiture or weddings, they use 3-4 lenses and have 2 or 3 of each one in case one fails on a shoot... hard to buy a new RF85L even if you have the £3k when you are on a remote tropical island to get fashion shots for 2 days before flying off to the next gig.  Plus a difficult discussion with the bride that you cannot get the full wedding party in the shot because Amazon didnt deliver your lens on time so can they reschedule for next month. 

I can see, and have known, amatuers/trying to break into pro doing it for a holiday or their one in a few months gig in the hope the higher grade kit gets them the better shots which helps them move to full time.