URGENT request for advice on defence against Britannia Parking (BW Legal)

Mahule2

Mouse007 said:

Mahule2 said:

Thank you. I never thought about the evidence like that.  Can I use the last paragraph in my defence even though the carpark is ANPR operated, not human operated?

Of course you can - the purpose of displaying your ticket was to show you had paid. The presumption must be that a patrolling parking attendant would be able to see and check it.

Why else were you required to display a ticket? Think about that question.

When you returned to your car, to find there was no PCN notice attached thereto, what reason would you have to retain the ticket which had presumably done is job of preventing a PCN being issued?

Why should you speculate about how they enforce parking? ANPR or foot patrol.

So while I suspect this is actually about keying your VRN into the ticket machine - you have not mentioned this which suggests neither has the claimant. Without VRN entry how does the claimant know whether or not you paid and displayed? Do they have photos?

Thank you. That totally makes sense. The signs only say the carpark is monitored by ANPR but there's no mention about the car park not being manned.

To answer your questions about VRN; The have photos of my vehicle entering and leaving a carpark. They said they checked the record and allowed for keying errors and didn't find a matching payment. They provided a record from a machine/machines (not clear, not explained) showing 3 types of source of payment, date from-to, and partial VRN. They didn't include any explanation which source means what (Paybyphone, Flowbird - login x and API). Would these companies temper with their records or could there be a system error? Without a expert analysis of the records who knows.

Mahule2

1505grandad said:

"Is the partial landowner authority that you were sent, with the RIGHT Britannia (full name matches the name on the claim form exactly - word for word?)."

"The NTK says Britannia Parking Group Ltd t/a Britannia Parking and shows their company number which matches Companies House record"

So what exact name and company number is shown on the NTK, landowner authority and the signs in the cp?.

...

BRITANNIA PARKING GROUP LIMITED overview - Companies House 

...

BRITANNIA PARKING LIMITED overview - Companies House

Hello 1505grandad, thank you for your question.

The NTK is issued on a headed letter with Britannia Parking logo at the top and with 'Britannia Parking is a registered Trading Name of Britannia Parking Group Limited and any of its wholly owned subsidiaries' in the footer. Register No. is 08182990.

The first page of the lease agreement I was provided with is between landowner and BRITANNIA PARKING LIMITED. The last page (no.21) I was given doesn't show any BP details, only 'SIGNED as a Deed by V. Ltd acting by Director > signature, and Secretary > signature.

The signs in the carpark show the same logo as on the NTK and the company is Britannia Parking Group, Reg.No. 08182990.

Mahule2

1505grandad said:

"Is the partial landowner authority that you were sent, with the RIGHT Britannia (full name matches the name on the claim form exactly - word for word?)."

"The NTK says Britannia Parking Group Ltd t/a Britannia Parking and shows their company number which matches Companies House record"

So what exact name and company number is shown on the NTK, landowner authority and the signs in the cp?.

...

BRITANNIA PARKING GROUP LIMITED overview - Companies House 

...

BRITANNIA PARKING LIMITED overview - Companies House

Hello 1505grandad, thank you for your question.

The NTK is issued on a headed letter with Britannia Parking logo at the top and with 'Britannia Parking is a registered Trading Name of Britannia Parking Group Limited and any of its wholly owned subsidiaries' in the footer. Register No. is 08182990.

The first page of the lease agreement I was provided with is between landowner and BRITANNIA PARKING LIMITED. The last page (no.21) I was given doesn't show any BP details, only 'SIGNED as a Deed by V. Ltd acting by Director > signature, and Secretary > signature.

The signs in the carpark show the same logo as on the NTK and the company is Britannia Parking Group, Reg.No. 08182990.

Coupon-mad

You mention I am only at WS stage (PS: thanks, finally found Aphex's post) but the CF letter seems to suggest otherwise.

It doesn't...

Mahule2

Coupon-mad said:

You mention I am only at WS stage (PS: thanks, finally found Aphex's post) but the CF letter seems to suggest otherwise.

It doesn't...

I am sorry but I am confused. I thought that this direction which is mentioned on the Notice of hearing (SCT) means that besides the defence I also have to provide both sides with anything I wish to rely on at the hearing. Am I wrong?

'Each party must deliver to the other party and to the court office copies of all documents on which that party intends to rely at the hearing no later than 11 January 2023.'

Coupon-mad

Yes. WS and evidence, as we advised you.

Sounds like you need to re-read the 'WHAT HAPPENS WHEN' section under the red capitals heading in the 2nd post of the NEWBIES thread.

Defence (already done ages ago) is different from a WS bundle (due now).  As seen in aphex's thread that we signposted you to.

KeithP

Mahule2 said:

Coupon-mad said:

will attach all of the evidence when sending my defence documents.

You aren't sending defence docs. You are at WS stage and the regulars here told you how to do that bundle and we linked you to the profile that has the WS everyone adapts.

You realise you chose to reply to the one person who has just this ONE POST on this forum? Just because a person gives a long reply doesn't mean that's the reply to hang your hat on.  In fact it's not a bad reply and I mean no personal criticism (we all started somewhere) but be aware that reply is from an unknown (brand new) poster - and they are newer to posting than you are!

We get parking firms posting here - beware.  You should really be concentrating on the advice you get from those with thousands of posts. I have over 100k posts over more than 15 years here, for example.

Mouse007 is fine too, with over 700 posts and is here most days advising people.

You mention I am only at WS stage (PS: thanks, finally found Aphex's post) but the CF letter seems to suggest otherwise.

Forgive me, but what's a 'CF letter'?
It's not a term or phrase I recognise.

Mahule2

KeithP said:

Mahule2 said:

Coupon-mad said:

will attach all of the evidence when sending my defence documents.

You aren't sending defence docs. You are at WS stage and the regulars here told you how to do that bundle and we linked you to the profile that has the WS everyone adapts.

You realise you chose to reply to the one person who has just this ONE POST on this forum? Just because a person gives a long reply doesn't mean that's the reply to hang your hat on.  In fact it's not a bad reply and I mean no personal criticism (we all started somewhere) but be aware that reply is from an unknown (brand new) poster - and they are newer to posting than you are!

We get parking firms posting here - beware.  You should really be concentrating on the advice you get from those with thousands of posts. I have over 100k posts over more than 15 years here, for example.

Mouse007 is fine too, with over 700 posts and is here most days advising people.

You mention I am only at WS stage (PS: thanks, finally found Aphex's post) but the CF letter seems to suggest otherwise.

Forgive me, but what's a 'CF letter'?
It's not a term or phrase I recognise.

My apologies, it's not really a letter. I meant Claim Form

Coupon-mad

The hearing letter isn't a claim form but it doesn't matter.

Mahule2

My apologies to you all! I re-read the Newbies post and I finally understand. I have been talking about defence but as you pointed out, I had already done it (I hope I didn't completely mess it up as I didn't use any similar advice!).

I will draft my WS and a list of evidence which will accompany that. Is it wise to share it here the usuals here can advise if it is any good?