We're aware that some users are experiencing technical issues which the team are working to resolve. See the Community Noticeboard for more info. Thank you for your patience.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!

Buying new car in cash

Options
1356

Comments

  • motorguy
    motorguy Posts: 22,611 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    motorguy said:
    They will qualify you, yes, but it'll be subtle and correct 98% of the time.

    Well, I must be doing something wrong then as I've been "qualified out" more times than I can remember. 

    On several occasions, I've just given up and stuck with the car I want (a new car is a large and discretionary purchase, so if the vendor doesn't want the sale, I don't need to give it to them).

    Not the full urban myth you mention, but on two occasions I've been in the Dealership with my cheque book ready to place a deposit for a brand new car and walked out to then place the business elsewhere.  A short interval of time later, the Dealer will phone asking if I plan to go ahead and I'll tell them the order is gone elsewhere and the response has been "I'd have matched that if you came back to me".  In these modern days, Dealers must be aware that serious buyers have already researched market-price and discounts ahead of attending the showroom.  (Both were before COVID disruptions).

    I genuinely find that bizarre.

    Personally, i ring the dealer in advance, ask to speak to someone in new car sales / used car sales depending on what i'm looking at, explain to them what i'm looking for, confirm they have it available to view / test drive, arrange an appointment to do so, give them any trade in details i might have.  I will also tell them if i will be ready to buy on the day if we can agree on price, etc.

    How do you let yourself walk back out of a showroom, checkbook in hand without being able to buy the car you want?  Surely the nuclear option if you cant get the salesman to take you seriously is to ask to speak to their sales manager?

    I'd have thought it nigh on impossible to NOT buy a car off a salesman?   Fundamentally its - "i want to buy that car, if we can agree a palatable price today, i will buy it".

    Last car i bought in December, i did the above.  Turned up at the agreed time, he had the car sitting ready to test drive, he handed me the keys, i test drove it, came back we negotiated a bit on the price (already the cheapest on the market anyway so just needed tweaking), handed him a cash deposit and we did the rest via email / bank transfer.  Turned up at the start of the following week and he handed me the keys, i shook his hand and that was that.


  • motorguy
    motorguy Posts: 22,611 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    motorguy said:
    They will qualify you, yes, but it'll be subtle and correct 98% of the time.



    Car Dealers are no different to any high-end product retailer. 
    In May this year, my wife and I were killing time in a shopping centre and popped into a jewellers, where my wife saw a lovely (but absurdly expensive and unaffordable) watch.  The sales representative quickly turned to "are you buying this watch, or leave my shop".  That was a busy Saturday and we were in scruffs.
    It so happened that on Thursday this week, I was in the same shopping centre killing time, so I looked at the same watch and the sales representative was keen to make a sale.  The only obvious difference being that I was in a suit, though perhaps my mention that the watch was on display at 25% higher than I'd seen earlier in the year had an impact - but that conversation only happened after I had been initially "qualified in".
    Sorry - but the qualification based on appearances is real and current.
    The key difference was it was a busy saturday first time and the person was using a sales technique to get you to either commit or allow them to move on to the next customer.  I'd suggest on the saturday it was clear by your movement around the shop that initially at least you were there to kill time (as you've said yourself), so the sales person put you on the spot.  They probably get dozens of people a day in just killing time looking at stuff they wont buy.

    What happened subsequently was you arrived at a quiet time already having viewed the watch you wanted.  You almost certainly would have walked straight to the watch in question too.

    As i said 98% of the time they can qualify correctly (or at least a good car sales person can).  Sometimes they get it wrong but thats factored in.  They dont have an unlimited amount of time to speak to every customer and try to do whatever it takes to do every sale so they either qualify you in or out and at some point put pressure on you to buy or leave.  That frees up their time to move on to the next potentially more viable customer.

    I sold cars decades ago and was young, naive and keen when i started.  The older more experienced salesperson knew who were the customers who were going to consume a load of time and probably not buy, whereas i'd stupidly spend hours and hours with them with no sale at the end of it.  But you get to know that.  Sometimes its not even a conscious decision but you get to know.  
  • zagfles
    zagfles Posts: 21,435 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Chutzpah Haggler
    motorguy said:
    They will qualify you, yes, but it'll be subtle and correct 98% of the time.

    Well, I must be doing something wrong then as I've been "qualified out" more times than I can remember. 

    On several occasions, I've just given up and stuck with the car I want (a new car is a large and discretionary purchase, so if the vendor doesn't want the sale, I don't need to give it to them).

    Not the full urban myth you mention, but on two occasions I've been in the Dealership with my cheque book ready to place a deposit for a brand new car and walked out to then place the business elsewhere.  A short interval of time later, the Dealer will phone asking if I plan to go ahead and I'll tell them the order is gone elsewhere and the response has been "I'd have matched that if you came back to me".  In these modern days, Dealers must be aware that serious buyers have already researched market-price and discounts ahead of attending the showroom.  (Both were before COVID disruptions).

    Car Dealers are no different to any high-end product retailer. 
    In May this year, my wife and I were killing time in a shopping centre and popped into a jewellers, where my wife saw a lovely (but absurdly expensive and unaffordable) watch.  The sales representative quickly turned to "are you buying this watch, or leave my shop".  That was a busy Saturday and we were in scruffs.
    It so happened that on Thursday this week, I was in the same shopping centre killing time, so I looked at the same watch and the sales representative was keen to make a sale.  The only obvious difference being that I was in a suit, though perhaps my mention that the watch was on display at 25% higher than I'd seen earlier in the year had an impact - but that conversation only happened after I had been initially "qualified in".
    Sorry - but the qualification based on appearances is real and current.
    I know someone who used to work in a high end jewellers, he had a sales technique he used when couples came in looking at jewellery together. If they didn't look posh, but were looking at the expensive stuff, he'd look them up and down with disdain and then point out they also have another (cheaper) range that they "might be more interested in". 
    This would often get the bloke's testosterone surging and he'd make clear they're not interested in the cheap stuff, and wanted to have a proper look at the expensive stuff, he'd sigh and get the tray out, point out that they don't offer credit, and then quite often get a sale on a ridiculously expensive item just so the bloke could prove him wrong and prove to his gf/wife what a great provider he is and that she doesn't have to settle for the cheap stuff :D

  • fred990
    fred990 Posts: 379 Forumite
    Seventh Anniversary 100 Posts Name Dropper
    Even if you're worth a few quid you'll be treated with disdain/contempt at a BMW dealer!

    I've yet to work out how to be 'qualified' by these salesmen. 
    Funnily, i've been pondering a small Caddy sized van to facilitate a side project i'm going to work on. I havent seen much movement yet, but in theory markets like pickups and vans are likely to be hit by the upcoming downturn.
    Would be interesting to hear if anyone has direct experience?

    Why? So you can argue with them?
  • Grumpy_chap
    Grumpy_chap Posts: 18,273 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    motorguy said:
    How do you let yourself walk back out of a showroom, checkbook in hand without being able to buy the car you want?  Surely the nuclear option if you cant get the salesman to take you seriously is to ask to speak to their sales manager?

    I'd have thought it nigh on impossible to NOT buy a car off a salesman?   

    You would think so.  I agree it's bizarre not to be the case.

    It is very surprising how many car Sales Representatives really don't want to sell cars.
    I actually agree with @fred990

    Let's consider the purchase of my Mum's Jazz, ordered late 2015 for March 2016 delivery.
    Mum visited the local Dealer, test drove, chose the options / colour etc she wanted and the Dealer then said the list price is the price.  Suspect this was a case of thinking that Mum was a "gullible old dear".
    She asked me whether I thought there was any discount so I looked on line.  IIRC, list price was £18,023 and best online was £17,012.
    So, we made an appointment to go back to the local Dealer at 9 am on Thursday with the intent to place an order if the price was right.  We were aiming for around £17,250 - £17,300 ish as there is value in a relationship with the local Dealer (especially if there is an issue post purchase), the local Dealer had done all the "sales effort", and the "best online" price was not definitely secured.
    Sat with the Sales Representative, loads of waffle and then the "I need to see my Manager..." after a long wait he came back with the best he could do was to round down to £18k.
    So, we left to "think about it".

    By lunch time, the order was placed with the best online price.  It moved up a little from the advert price to £17,309.50 for the exact options etc that Mum wanted.

    Mid afternoon, the original Dealer phoned to ask Mum whether she'd had any further thoughts to which she replied that she'd ordered at the agreed price.  Only for the local Dealer to say, if we had phoned him back, he'd have matched that.  Well, what changed between 9 am when we were sat there with cheque book and pen ready to place a deposit and mid-afternoon.

    Car Dealers are really one of the worst collective groups of people to try to trade with.
  • zagfles
    zagfles Posts: 21,435 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Chutzpah Haggler
    fred990 said:
    Even if you're worth a few quid you'll be treated with disdain/contempt at a BMW dealer!

    I've yet to work out how to be 'qualified' by these salesmen. 
    The top-end market in anything is a strange world. Top end restaurants are notorious for rude staff, and impossibility of getting tables unless you book a month in advance, or know the maitre d. Try to buy a Rolex and you might find you can't even if you have the money https://www.telegraph.co.uk/fashion/style/cant-buy-rolex-not-price/ Similar with top end sports cars, there might be a 5 year waiting list and strict criteria to even get on it.
    You'd have thought if demand exceeds supply they'd either increase supply or just jack the price up even further until demand matched supply, usual rule of economics. But that doesn't seem to work at the top end - possibly down to the reason people buy top end products in the first place, ie to show off, to demonstrate their status.
    It's probably a bit vulgar for wealth to be the only thing they're showing off about, so there's also the element of how well connected you are, your status with the suppliers of the top-end product. You know the maitre d at Restaurant du Posh so you can get a table tomorrow whereas those without status have to wait a month. You have status with the posh jewellers so you are "allowed" to buy a Rolex. You're not just rich, you're well connected.
  • Grumpy_chap
    Grumpy_chap Posts: 18,273 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    zagfles said:
    fred990 said:
    Even if you're worth a few quid you'll be treated with disdain/contempt at a BMW dealer!

    I've yet to work out how to be 'qualified' by these salesmen. 
    The top-end market in anything is a strange world. 
    A lot of the BMW range is not top-end but fleet-market.
  • motorguy
    motorguy Posts: 22,611 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    zagfles said:
    fred990 said:
    Even if you're worth a few quid you'll be treated with disdain/contempt at a BMW dealer!

    I've yet to work out how to be 'qualified' by these salesmen. 
    The top-end market in anything is a strange world. 
    A lot of the BMW range is not top-end but fleet-market.
    Agreed.  They make their most money selling cooking variants, not high end stuff.

    I've never had a particular issue with BMW dealers.  i dont see Freds posts as i've him on my block list but i would imagine if he gets on in real life like he does on here, its not a surprise that hes treated with disdain.  Treating people who you want to be treated goes a long way in life.

  • motorguy
    motorguy Posts: 22,611 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    motorguy said:
    How do you let yourself walk back out of a showroom, checkbook in hand without being able to buy the car you want?  Surely the nuclear option if you cant get the salesman to take you seriously is to ask to speak to their sales manager?

    I'd have thought it nigh on impossible to NOT buy a car off a salesman?   

    You would think so.  I agree it's bizarre not to be the case.

    It is very surprising how many car Sales Representatives really don't want to sell cars.
    I actually agree with @fred990

    Let's consider the purchase of my Mum's Jazz, ordered late 2015 for March 2016 delivery.
    Mum visited the local Dealer, test drove, chose the options / colour etc she wanted and the Dealer then said the list price is the price.  Suspect this was a case of thinking that Mum was a "gullible old dear".
    She asked me whether I thought there was any discount so I looked on line.  IIRC, list price was £18,023 and best online was £17,012.
    So, we made an appointment to go back to the local Dealer at 9 am on Thursday with the intent to place an order if the price was right.  We were aiming for around £17,250 - £17,300 ish as there is value in a relationship with the local Dealer (especially if there is an issue post purchase), the local Dealer had done all the "sales effort", and the "best online" price was not definitely secured.
    Sat with the Sales Representative, loads of waffle and then the "I need to see my Manager..." after a long wait he came back with the best he could do was to round down to £18k.
    So, we left to "think about it".

    By lunch time, the order was placed with the best online price.  It moved up a little from the advert price to £17,309.50 for the exact options etc that Mum wanted.

    Mid afternoon, the original Dealer phoned to ask Mum whether she'd had any further thoughts to which she replied that she'd ordered at the agreed price.  Only for the local Dealer to say, if we had phoned him back, he'd have matched that.  Well, what changed between 9 am when we were sat there with cheque book and pen ready to place a deposit and mid-afternoon.

    Car Dealers are really one of the worst collective groups of people to try to trade with.
    Thats not what we were discussing though.  We were discussing being qualified out by salespeople based on the clothes you wear.

    You werent qualified out.  He just didnt offer you the deal you told him you needed to do the deal before you left.


  • motorguy
    motorguy Posts: 22,611 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    zagfles said:
    fred990 said:
    Even if you're worth a few quid you'll be treated with disdain/contempt at a BMW dealer!

    I've yet to work out how to be 'qualified' by these salesmen. 
    The top-end market in anything is a strange world. Top end restaurants are notorious for rude staff, and impossibility of getting tables unless you book a month in advance, or know the maitre d. Try to buy a Rolex and you might find you can't even if you have the money https://www.telegraph.co.uk/fashion/style/cant-buy-rolex-not-price/ Similar with top end sports cars, there might be a 5 year waiting list and strict criteria to even get on it.
    You'd have thought if demand exceeds supply they'd either increase supply or just jack the price up even further until demand matched supply, usual rule of economics. But that doesn't seem to work at the top end - possibly down to the reason people buy top end products in the first place, ie to show off, to demonstrate their status.
    It's probably a bit vulgar for wealth to be the only thing they're showing off about, so there's also the element of how well connected you are, your status with the suppliers of the top-end product. You know the maitre d at Restaurant du Posh so you can get a table tomorrow whereas those without status have to wait a month. You have status with the posh jewellers so you are "allowed" to buy a Rolex. You're not just rich, you're well connected.
    Theres a lot of speculators try to buy in to premium cars, trying to make a quick buck flipping the cars.

    So its not unreasonable that the dealers want to make sure you're not going to do that, and that you're a known quantity to them.

    I'm on Pistonheads and you do hear of people on there who have went in to Porsche to buy some limited edition high end GT3 or whatever (or at least, to speculatively put the deposit down on the waiting list) and to be point blank refused.

    Even with regular Porsches like a 911 its quite usual for a year old 911 to cost 10% more than a new one - because the waiting list for a new one is two years.



Meet your Ambassadors

🚀 Getting Started

Hi new member!

Our Getting Started Guide will help you get the most out of the Forum

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 351K Banking & Borrowing
  • 253.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 453.6K Spending & Discounts
  • 244K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 598.9K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 176.9K Life & Family
  • 257.3K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 16.1K Discuss & Feedback
  • 37.6K Read-Only Boards

Is this how you want to be seen?

We see you are using a default avatar. It takes only a few seconds to pick a picture.