VAT Charge @ Poundland

Ath_Wat

user1977 said:

outtatune said:

I suspect the till operator is deliberately skimming off a pound here and there on cash transactions.

£1.50 though. Does that seem at all likely, or even worthwhile? Especially in the sort of chain store where the staff are no doubt carefully monitored. Bit different from "no, that was only a tenner you gave me" etc.

And of course the operator would have to say "£5.75 please" with 4.25 clearly showing on the display, and at that point not knowing how the OP intended to pay and therefore how much the change might be.  (I mean, they could have been standing there holding out a £10 note, but even if that were the case it still makes no real sense to calculate what the change would be and use that, trusting to them to misread a standard receipt later).

Ath_Wat

p00hsticks said:

outtatune said:

I suspect the till operator is deliberately skimming off a pound here and there on cash transactions.

Even when I worked in a supermarket forty years ago that would have been easily picked up as they counted and balanced the cash in the till with the end-of-shift totals on the register. Now with far less cash changing hands and more up to date tills I think it woudl be far more obvious. I think it far more likely that the OP is simply mistaken, and in looking at their receipt later has mis-read 'Change' for 'Charge' and come her to complain.

Eh, just to muddy the water though, the till would balance.  Here's how I would do it if I was going to - you see the OP standing there holding out a £10 note and looking like they are not paying attention so you ring in the payment of £10, which then means the till shows 5.75 change.  You then say "5.75 please" and the OP looks at the display, sees, 5.75, and gives you the tenner.  You put it in the till and take out 5.75, so the till is correct.  You then give 4.25 to the OP and pocket £1.50.  Till is right, you are 1.50 up and OP is 1.50 down.

I really don't think this happened but it could, if the OP was sufficiently distracted and the cashier was willing to take the significant risk of being caught for £1.50..

Aylesbury_Duck

Ath_Wat said:

p00hsticks said:

outtatune said:

I suspect the till operator is deliberately skimming off a pound here and there on cash transactions.

Even when I worked in a supermarket forty years ago that would have been easily picked up as they counted and balanced the cash in the till with the end-of-shift totals on the register. Now with far less cash changing hands and more up to date tills I think it woudl be far more obvious. I think it far more likely that the OP is simply mistaken, and in looking at their receipt later has mis-read 'Change' for 'Charge' and come her to complain.

Eh, just to muddy the water though, the till would balance.  Here's how I would do it if I was going to - you see the OP standing there holding out a £10 note and looking like they are not paying attention so you ring in the payment of £10, which then means the till shows 5.75 change.  You then say "5.75 please" and the OP looks at the display, sees, 5.75, and gives you the tenner.  You put it in the till and take out 5.75, so the till is correct.  You then give 4.25 to the OP and pocket £1.50.  Till is right, you are 1.50 up and OP is 1.50 down.

I really don't think this happened but it could, if the OP was sufficiently distracted and the cashier was willing to take the significant risk of being caught for £1.50..

I like it!  It's also quite a bit of quick mental arithmetic to perform, whilst judging which customers to try it with.  Anyone able to do that sufficient times a day to make it all worthwhile should be earning more elsewhere, because that would show a level of mental arithmetic and speed of thought significantly above that of most people.

p00hsticks

Ath_Wat said:

p00hsticks said:

outtatune said:

I suspect the till operator is deliberately skimming off a pound here and there on cash transactions.

Even when I worked in a supermarket forty years ago that would have been easily picked up as they counted and balanced the cash in the till with the end-of-shift totals on the register. Now with far less cash changing hands and more up to date tills I think it woudl be far more obvious. I think it far more likely that the OP is simply mistaken, and in looking at their receipt later has mis-read 'Change' for 'Charge' and come her to complain.

Eh, just to muddy the water though, the till would balance.  Here's how I would do it if I was going to - you see the OP standing there holding out a £10 note and looking like they are not paying attention so you ring in the payment of £10, which then means the till shows 5.75 change.  You then say "5.75 please" and the OP looks at the display, sees, 5.75, and gives you the tenner.  You put it in the till and take out 5.75, so the till is correct.  You then give 4.25 to the OP and pocket £1.50.  Till is right, you are 1.50 up and OP is 1.50 down.

I really don't think this happened but it could, if the OP was sufficiently distracted and the cashier was willing to take the significant risk of being caught for £1.50..

As Aylesbury Duck says, a lot of mental jiggery pokery to do.

If it's going to be done at all, but far the easiest way is to request the right amount, put the right amount in the till and simply short change the customer by giving them back say £4.75 instead of £5.75 (in the particular case using the excuse that you don't have any £5 notes). In my experience very few customers thouroughly check their change and wouldn't notice that they're a pound short, especially if there are quite a few coins involved. And if the customer does spot it and challenge you, it;s easy to just say you must have mis-counted and give them the £1

user1977

Aylesbury_Duck said:

Ath_Wat said:

p00hsticks said:

outtatune said:

I suspect the till operator is deliberately skimming off a pound here and there on cash transactions.

Even when I worked in a supermarket forty years ago that would have been easily picked up as they counted and balanced the cash in the till with the end-of-shift totals on the register. Now with far less cash changing hands and more up to date tills I think it woudl be far more obvious. I think it far more likely that the OP is simply mistaken, and in looking at their receipt later has mis-read 'Change' for 'Charge' and come her to complain.

Eh, just to muddy the water though, the till would balance.  Here's how I would do it if I was going to - you see the OP standing there holding out a £10 note and looking like they are not paying attention so you ring in the payment of £10, which then means the till shows 5.75 change.  You then say "5.75 please" and the OP looks at the display, sees, 5.75, and gives you the tenner.  You put it in the till and take out 5.75, so the till is correct.  You then give 4.25 to the OP and pocket £1.50.  Till is right, you are 1.50 up and OP is 1.50 down.

I really don't think this happened but it could, if the OP was sufficiently distracted and the cashier was willing to take the significant risk of being caught for £1.50..

I like it!  It's also quite a bit of quick mental arithmetic to perform, whilst judging which customers to try it with.  Anyone able to do that sufficient times a day to make it all worthwhile should be earning more elsewhere, because that would show a level of mental arithmetic and speed of thought significantly above that of most people.

Plus they'll need the ability to surreptitiously waddle off at the end of their shift with pockets full of coins...

Brie

But the best and most successful long term fraud is often done in tiny increments.  If this cashier had given £4.25 change to the OP and pocketed 50p then the till would be up at the end of the day and management wouldn't be too too fussed (as long as it wasn't a lot up which would show incompetence). 

There was a time when cashiers would have to ensure their takings matched their till total at the end of the shift and could and did pocket the excess or put in a bit if it was short so as to keep their jobs.  I suspect that these days there's a locked cash drawer going to the back office that a different individual balances against that particular till display and can prevent such easy fraud. 

But also a quick minded cashier could be pocketing small amounts throughout the day mentally and just ensuring that a tenner falls into their pocket before the shift end.  An extra £10 a day would make a big difference to a lot of people and may well be worth the risk.  

RobM99

In this case, if I were expecting £5.75 change I'd expect a £5 note.

Ath_Wat

p00hsticks said:

Ath_Wat said:

p00hsticks said:

outtatune said:

I suspect the till operator is deliberately skimming off a pound here and there on cash transactions.

Even when I worked in a supermarket forty years ago that would have been easily picked up as they counted and balanced the cash in the till with the end-of-shift totals on the register. Now with far less cash changing hands and more up to date tills I think it woudl be far more obvious. I think it far more likely that the OP is simply mistaken, and in looking at their receipt later has mis-read 'Change' for 'Charge' and come her to complain.

Eh, just to muddy the water though, the till would balance.  Here's how I would do it if I was going to - you see the OP standing there holding out a £10 note and looking like they are not paying attention so you ring in the payment of £10, which then means the till shows 5.75 change.  You then say "5.75 please" and the OP looks at the display, sees, 5.75, and gives you the tenner.  You put it in the till and take out 5.75, so the till is correct.  You then give 4.25 to the OP and pocket £1.50.  Till is right, you are 1.50 up and OP is 1.50 down.

I really don't think this happened but it could, if the OP was sufficiently distracted and the cashier was willing to take the significant risk of being caught for £1.50..

As Aylesbury Duck says, a lot of mental jiggery pokery to do.

If it's going to be done at all, but far the easiest way is to request the right amount, put the right amount in the till and simply short change the customer by giving them back say £4.75 instead of £5.75 (in the particular case using the excuse that you don't have any £5 notes). In my experience very few customers thouroughly check their change and wouldn't notice that they're a pound short, especially if there are quite a few coins involved. And if the customer does spot it and challenge you, it;s easy to just say you must have mis-counted and give them the £1

That doesn't work for the OP's scenario though, as they are adamant they were charged 5.75. In your case they were charged  4.25 and then short changed.

(Again, I don't think it happened, I am just sketching out a way in which it could have).

Ath_Wat

Brie said:

But the best and most successful long term fraud is often done in tiny increments.  If this cashier had given £4.25 change to the OP and pocketed 50p then the till would be up at the end of the day and management wouldn't be too too fussed (as long as it wasn't a lot up which would show incompetence). 

Why would they do this rather than give 4.25 change to the OP and pocket £1.50, meaning the till was square?  

Stevebills

MMonroe said:

I bought a couple of things at Poundland today that came to £4.25.  However, when I went to the till I was charged £5.75 (70p VAT charge) was included on the receipt.  I was wondering why I was charged VAT separately and not included within the price of the items as this has never happened before.  Have I been conned?

Your reading the reciept wrong your confused