Money Moral Dilemma: Should I still put up my Christmas lights display given the energy crisis?

WayneyP

Get a diesel generator and run them off it. Although it's an initial up front cost, generators are handy to have anyway. Or just absorb the cost, LEDs don't use up much £

Sea_Shell

Do what feels right to you.

So much of today's MMDs seem to be down to peer pressure in some form or another.

To either DO something, or NOT DO something, depending on which way the wind is blowing amongst "the masses".


It could be that you can't "win" and please everyone, so you may as well please yourself.

donkeyk22

Given the very real possibility that load shedding will be required at some point this winter, I personally can't see the justification in wasting energy on outdoor Xmas lighting - even for a justifiable cause such as charity. (And before anyone jumps on me for being a grinch - I normally put lights outside at Xmas.) I'd have banned them this winter, personally - but that would of course be political suicide.

With the added factor that it is the poorest and most vulnerable that suffer from increased energy prices, I dread to think how bad load shedding would affect them. I simply can't make a good moral argument for putting Xmas lights outside this year.

If you are going to do it, I would suggest using timers to automatically limit the number of hours they are on each evening.

The_Green_Hornet

Christmas LED lights really don't use that much energy.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/utilities/energy-saving-tips/#christmaslights

[Deleted User]

donkeyk22 said:

Given the very real possibility that load shedding will be required at some point this winter, I personally can't see the justification in wasting energy on outdoor Xmas lighting - even for a justifiable cause such as charity. (And before anyone jumps on me for being a grinch - I normally put lights outside at Xmas.) I'd have banned them this winter, personally - but that would of course be political suicide.

With the added factor that it is the poorest and most vulnerable that suffer from increased energy prices, I dread to think how bad load shedding would affect them. I simply can't make a good moral argument for putting Xmas lights outside this year.

If you are going to do it, I would suggest using timers to automatically limit the number of hours they are on each evening.

Keeping lights on when load shedding is actually happening - some might disagree with.

Removing lights because at some unspecified point in the future there is a chance that someone might wish to think about doing some load shedding?  Seems like a massive over-reaction.

Mstty

Visiting (walking) to local Christmas lights with the kids is a very cheap adventure.

Also once you have been out in the cold the bonus is your house normally feels warmer when you get home even with lower thermostats this year.

MattMattMattUK

WayneyP said:

Get a diesel generator and run them off it. Although it's an initial up front cost, generators are handy to have anyway. Or just absorb the cost, LEDs don't use up much £

A cheap diesel generator will need a lot of work and be annoyingly loud, a silent one will be expensive £2k+, even a cheap petrol generator will cost a few hundred, a good low noise one £500+. Even if it is run a maximum efficiency which will be difficult with LED lights it would still cost considerably more than using mains electricity, with the likely efficiency being below it's peak it could easily be 2-5 times the cost of mains electricity to power the lights. 

MattMattMattUK

donkeyk22 said:

Given the very real possibility that load shedding will be required at some point this winter, I personally can't see the justification in wasting energy on outdoor Xmas lighting - even for a justifiable cause such as charity. (And before anyone jumps on me for being a grinch - I normally put lights outside at Xmas.) I'd have banned them this winter, personally - but that would of course be political suicide.

With the added factor that it is the poorest and most vulnerable that suffer from increased energy prices, I dread to think how bad load shedding would affect them. I simply can't make a good moral argument for putting Xmas lights outside this year.

If you are going to do it, I would suggest using timers to automatically limit the number of hours they are on each evening.

No more than anyone else who does not have a backup power source such as batteries or a generator, or alternative heating options. If the power goes out for three hours a day someone who has to economise on their energy bills is in the same position as someone who does not, sat in the dark.

donkeyk22

[Deleted User] said:

donkeyk22 said:

Given the very real possibility that load shedding will be required at some point this winter, I personally can't see the justification in wasting energy on outdoor Xmas lighting - even for a justifiable cause such as charity. (And before anyone jumps on me for being a grinch - I normally put lights outside at Xmas.) I'd have banned them this winter, personally - but that would of course be political suicide.

With the added factor that it is the poorest and most vulnerable that suffer from increased energy prices, I dread to think how bad load shedding would affect them. I simply can't make a good moral argument for putting Xmas lights outside this year.

If you are going to do it, I would suggest using timers to automatically limit the number of hours they are on each evening.

Keeping lights on when load shedding is actually happening - some might disagree with.

Removing lights because at some unspecified point in the future there is a chance that someone might wish to think about doing some load shedding?  Seems like a massive over-reaction.

I'd like to think most would agree keeping Xmas lights (along with our trivial electricity usages) on during periods of load shedding would be morally unacceptable, no?

I take the point that load shedding happening during the festive period is unlikely - it'd probably be during the new year. And that there are much more effective ways of reducing electricity if there was a need to legally enforce such a measure.

One thing I forgot mention previously is that all our energy is currently being subsidized by the government: the more that is used, the higher the burden placed on public spending - that in turn reduces spending in other areas. Are Xmas lights the best use of that government money?

I guess I was trying to address the moral question posed by the OP - we as a society have become profligate with our electricity consumption. During a time when people are struggling to make ends meet and/or heat their homes, is it morally acceptable to use electricity on such trivial things? Yes, there is a certain 'thin end of the wedge' element to that argument, but I would hope this energy crisis would encourage people to think differently about their energy consumption and ask themselves whether all of it is justifiable - whether they can afford it or not.

I'm certainly not going to accost my neighbors if they elect to put Xmas lights up, and ultimately it is for each individual to decide - but I feel uneasy that people still seem to be taking our energy security for granted. 

[Deleted User]

Load shedding is rotated by area - remember all those letter codes and tables that were being discussed here a few weeks ago?

What level of use is "morally unacceptable" when it is not your area's turn on the schedule?  50W of Christmas lights is apparently unacceptable, so what about the 200W of television or the 3000W of kettle?  After all, you could listen to the 20W radio instead, or play a 0W board game, so using that television is clearly four times as immoral.

We're now saying, in the unlikely event of load shedding, that when it is your turn to have power, you have a moral duty not to use it because some other people do not?