Cancelled Flight, Who pays equivalent flight rebooking difference?

Tyro123_2
Tyro123_2 Posts: 10 Forumite
Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
edited 19 November 2022 at 6:45PM in Flight delay compensation
Hello Money Savers, 

We booked flights for our family, with Turkish Airline in June, 2022 to go see folks at Christmas. Last week (3 weeks before our trip) Turkish cancelled our flights citing operational reasons and have offered, either a full refund or alternative flights. 

Issue with alternative flights is layover. It's around 24+ hours, compared to layover on our initial flights, which was only 3 hours! Travelling with kids, such a long layover isn't practical. Turkish say they don't have any other options and are pushing us towards taking a full refund. 

My wife and I feel cheated because it seems Turkish kept our money (£2K) for almost 6 months (probably earned interest on it) and have now, most likely sold our tickets to someone else who is willing to pay more. If we were to now book like for like flights with a 3 hour layover, as our initial booking, we would end up paying £3K (£1K more than we initially paid), and not seeing folks is not an option either. 

We spoke to our travel insurer (Nationwide in this case) and were told, they are not liable to pay the difference for booking equivalent flights.

As CAA compensation only kicks in 2 weeks before departure, it seems there is a loop hole Turkish are exploiting by cancelling flights 3 weeks before departure and selling to others at a higher price, leaving family like ours in the ditch.

What are our options? Has any one of you encountered this same scenario before and if so, how did you deal with it? Also why don't insurance providers cover this use case part of their standard policy? It seems there is little point in booking flights early if we are going to be cheated like this.

We are looking for advice, which will be hugely appreciated.

Comments

  • eskbanker
    eskbanker Posts: 31,034 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper Photogenic First Post
    Tyro123_2 said:
    Turkish cancelled our flights citing operational reasons and have offered, either a full refund or alternative flights. 

    [...]

    Turkish kept our money (£2K) for almost 6 months (probably earned interest on it) and have now, most likely sold our tickets to someone else who is willing to pay more.

    [...]

    it seems there is a loop hole Turkish are exploiting by cancelling flights 3 weeks before departure and selling to others at a higher price, leaving family like ours in the ditch.
    I'm not sure I follow your logic about reselling tickets here - is the flight itself actually cancelled or not?

    Anyway, assuming you've been told that the flight is cancelled (and that the flights are within scope of the UK/EU regulations, e.g. departing from the UK) then the airline is obliged to offer "re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their final destination at the earliest opportunity".  I think there's a pretty strong argument that introducing a 24+ hour layover isn't in any way comparable to a 3 hour one, so if the latter is available (even if with a different airline) then it should be offered to you at no extra cost.

    Maybe worth reading the CAA guidance on suitability of rerouting options:

    http://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/Re-routing Guidance (CAP2155).pdf
  • Westin
    Westin Posts: 5,940 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper Photogenic First Post
    +1 on above post.  I would drop the idea of the conspiracy theories.

    It sounds like a rescheduling on a connecting flight which places you outside of the minimum connection time at Istanbul. A computer has just rescheduled your itinerary.

    Time for you to do some investigative work before calling Turkish with a suggestion of alternatives. 

    Is there an earlier TK flight ex UK you can take? Is there an alternative TK flight from another U.K. airport (LHR rather than LGW, BHX rather than MAN) which will get you to IST for the longhaul flight?  Check through their website. Look for options, write down the flight details of something that suits, then contact TK.
  • The answer to your question is YOU.

    Turkish have offered all they can, so either accept the change or take the full refund.

    You are not being cheated and there is no valid conspiracy in place, these things happen.
  • The answer to your question is YOU.

    Turkish have offered all they can, so either accept the change or take the full refund.

    You are not being cheated and there is no valid conspiracy in place, these things happen.
    No they haven't. These things simply don't happen, unless there is a known world event like the pandemic / etc. All other airlines like Emirates / Etihad have seats available.

    Reading link shared by @eskbanker (thank you for sharing) - http://publicapps.caa.co.uk/docs/33/Re-routing Guidance (CAP2155).pdf, and referring more specifically to following excerpts contained therein: 

    The case of Rusu v SC Blue Air4 confirms that Article 8 requires airlines to offer passengers the option of reimbursement or re-routing. It also states that airlines must provide comprehensive information to passengers about the re-routing options, including flights on other airlines, to allow them to make an informed choice. The Court also found that there was no obligation on the passenger to do their own research to find information on alternative flights. In addition, the Court found that airlines were responsible for offering and organising re-routing and had the burden of proving that the re-routing offered was at the earliest opportunity.

    and 

    Next, Article 8 of Regulation No 261/2004, entitled ‘Right to reimbursement or re-routing’, states, in paragraph 1 thereof, that passengers are to be offered the choice between three options which are specified therein, in essence: (i) reimbursement of the ticket cost and, when relevant, a return flight to the first point of departure, at the earliest opportunity; (ii) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their final destination at the earliest opportunity; and (iii) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to that destination at a later date at the passenger’s convenience, subject to availability of seats.

    Turkish have made no efforts to do ii whatsoever. CAA regulations also state that Turkish should have clearly made us aware of these three options, which they didn't either. All Turkish have said is. take a full refund or go on another flight with 24+ hour layover. Flight they are offering with a similar layover sits outside school holidays in the off peak season (14+ days after our initial outbound flight). Schools will be open then and this is simply a no go. Despite asking for a flight under comparable transport conditions, their response is, we have none.

    I find it hard the believe that an airline like Turkish, which is part of Star Alliance are unable to provide a flight under comparable transport conditions. Legislation states Turkish should be making every effort possible to book us on comparable transport, even if it is with another airline or a Star Alliance partner. 

    @Westin, may be I have been overthinking this a little and agree with dropping the idea of conspiracy theories. My reason for thinking this was because, I find it hard to believe that during peak season, Turkish have simply ceased all flights to our destination (which is quite popular) due to an operational reason, they refuse to state. It's not that we are being rigid either. We are happy to move a few days +/- but not change our trip altogether from going in peak season, to off peak season just because it suits Turkish.

  • You said the layover of the offered alternative is around 24 hours, that is inconvenient but not unreasonable if they have changed their schedules.

    That would seem to satisfy the "earliest opportunity" part you have highlighted.

    You obviously do not work in the industry, these things do happen.
  • Tyro123_2
    Tyro123_2 Posts: 10 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    edited 20 November 2022 at 12:33PM
    @The_Fat_Controller I appreciate what you are saying. If my Mrs or I were travelling by ourselves, we would have gone for it. I am getting to a point in life, where I don't want to pick every battle that comes my way. We are travelling with two small kids, who will really struggle with 24+ hour layover. 

    We paid a premium for our initial booking to ensure we specifically had a small layover due to travelling with children. 

    I agree that these things do happen. Having said that, CAA legislation is there for a reason. We are not asking Turkish to book us on a private jet, to get us to our destination. We are simply asking Turkish to do the right thing and give us like for like. This is not a huge ask for a flight that was supposed to take off from LHR, being one of the busiest airports in the world. We booked 6 months in advance to not have to pay extortionate prices at the last minute and unfortunately with Turkish's attitude, they have left us in exactly that situation. Turkish are not following CAA rules, and that is extremely disappointing.
  • and also given the cost of living crisis we are all living through right now, having to fork out an additional £1K through no fault or our own hurts quite a lot
  • k3lvc
    k3lvc Posts: 4,174 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    As others have said whilst it may not be your responsibility to find a more suitable alternative it seems in this instance this is probably the only way you're going to get something. They've made their offer - it's up to you to go back with a counter-proposal. If not then you're stuck with one of their two suggestions




  • Thanks every one for taking the time to respond. I am most grateful for this.
  • eskbanker
    eskbanker Posts: 31,034 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper Photogenic First Post
    Tyro123_2 said:
    All Turkish have said is. take a full refund or go on another flight with 24+ hour layover. Flight they are offering with a similar layover sits outside school holidays in the off peak season (14+ days after our initial outbound flight).
    Tyro123_2 said:
    CAA legislation is there for a reason.

    [...]

    Turkish are not following CAA rules, and that is extremely disappointing.
    It would be worth establishing exactly which legislation, rules and regulations apply to your situation, which will vary according to route.  A flight from the UK via Turkey to a final destination outside the EU should come under the UK legislation (which isn't 'CAA legislation' as such but they oversee compliance) or the Turkish equivalent, but for a flight back in the other direction (on a non-UK/EU airline) you're dependent on the Turkish legislation, or that applying where you start your return journey - the Turkish version does broadly follow the UK/EU equivalent though.

    Tyro123_2 said:
    Legislation states Turkish should be making every effort possible to book us on comparable transport, even if it is with another airline or a Star Alliance partner. 
    Which legislation includes a reference to 'making every effort possible'?

    Tyro123_2 said:
    I find it hard to believe that during peak season, Turkish have simply ceased all flights to our destination (which is quite popular) due to an operational reason, they refuse to state.
    If you clarify your intended dates of travel and final destination, others on here may be able to offer insight about changes to the Turkish schedules and/or potential alternative routings that you (or Turkish) may not have considered.
Meet your Ambassadors

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 343.2K Banking & Borrowing
  • 250.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 449.7K Spending & Discounts
  • 235.3K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 608K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 173.1K Life & Family
  • 247.9K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 15.9K Discuss & Feedback
  • 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards