Argos watch bought but not in box; accused of stealing

MalMonroe

This is terrible. What a disappointment for your partner. I don't understand these two parts of your post - "the assistant said the box does not come sealed - and that staff are not allowed to open the box so it was not checked in store."

It doesn't make sense. Why on earth are staff not 'allowed to open the box' before a customer takes a watch away - particularly if the box does not come sealed? That's a red flag for any customer.

And how did the manager know - "the box was "not that light" when it was given to my partner". Were they there at the time of the purchase? Also how did that manager know whether the box was sealed or not?

I'd have insisted it be opened anyway - whether it was sealed or not - because that's just nonsense. You say "The box was given unsealed, but my partner didn't think anything of it at the time because nothing was construed as amiss." But something was amiss. Your partner wasn't given the opportunity to look inside the unsealed box so he didn't know that the unsealed box was empty. That's definitely amiss.

Now it's come down to Argos' staff word versus your partner's word. Do they have CCTV? Would it show that your partner was just given a package without it being checked? Surely that is an Argos failing?

I think that the Argos staff know that they've done things incorrectly because they should have checked that the item was in the box before they let your partner take it. And the fact that they have admitted that fact is very damning for them. Somebody is going to be in trouble and they don't want it to be them. 

You should push this matter with Sainsbury's customer service. Point out that nobody checked the watch was there and your partner was told that it wasn't unusual for the box to be unsealed. That really is total nonsense.

I would also report this to the police as it is a theft and once your partner has a crime number then yes, Argos should take this matter more seriously. 

I do hope he gets his watch or money back, that's a lot to lose. 

diystarter7

NBLondon said:

LetsGoMets34 said:

The box was given unsealed, but my partner didn't think anything of it at the time because nothing was construed as amiss.

I know this doesn't help in your case but if they noticed it was unsealed perhaps they could have questioned it at the time or opened it in front of the cashier which would have immediately shown the problem.   In fact, I would refuse an unsealed item from Argos on principle and any electronics from anywhere.

NBLondon said:

LetsGoMets34 said:

The box was given unsealed, but my partner didn't think anything of it at the time because nothing was construed as amiss.

I know this doesn't help in your case but if they noticed it was unsealed perhaps they could have questioned it at the time or opened it in front of the cashier which would have immediately shown the problem.   In fact, I would refuse an unsealed item from Argos on principle and any electronics from anywhere.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing to have. The OH did question it and was told it was ok and I and millions of others would have accepted that. Importantly, many would not have noticed.

Reading stuff/experiences like this keeps one alert but it can still happen

Slighty OT but a few months back we were in a local shopping area and had bought a writing pad A4. As they charge money for a bag and plastic is not good and we had no bag I decided to carry it and went into another shop that sold school stuff/toys/writing/reading stuff and Mrs Diy apprached the pay desk the cashier blurted out (as I was standing behind my wife) "do you want to pay for that." - I said we have paid for it at another shop and do you want to see the receipt. He said not "just asking"  - thankfully we always ask for a receipt even when it is not offered especially if we are going from shop to another one

elsien

diystarter7 said:

OP
A thought, challenge them to call the cops and prove your OH stole it as you have nothing to fear and everything to gain as I would do theat if it happened to me. Though they would not, I'd tell the cops to search our house and look at everything.
What do you and others think about this recommendation?

A waste of everyone’s time, quite honestly. Because Argos haven’t lost out so have no reason to call the police. If they did, the police wouldn’t attend.
And even if they did, anyone who has nicked a watch and has challenged the police to do something about it isn’t going to be leaving it around the house for them to find.
The absence of an item proves nothing. 

DanDare999

MalMonroe said:

This is terrible. What a disappointment for your partner. I don't understand these two parts of your post - "the assistant said the box does not come sealed - and that staff are not allowed to open the box so it was not checked in store."

It doesn't make sense. Why on earth are staff not 'allowed to open the box' before a customer takes a watch away - particularly if the box does not come sealed? That's a red flag for any customer.

And how did the manager know - "the box was "not that light" when it was given to my partner". Were they there at the time of the purchase? Also how did that manager know whether the box was sealed or not?

I'd have insisted it be opened anyway - whether it was sealed or not - because that's just nonsense. You say "The box was given unsealed, but my partner didn't think anything of it at the time because nothing was construed as amiss." But something was amiss. Your partner wasn't given the opportunity to look inside the unsealed box so he didn't know that the unsealed box was empty. That's definitely amiss.

Now it's come down to Argos' staff word versus your partner's word. Do they have CCTV? Would it show that your partner was just given a package without it being checked? Surely that is an Argos failing?

I think that the Argos staff know that they've done things incorrectly because they should have checked that the item was in the box before they let your partner take it. And the fact that they have admitted that fact is very damning for them. Somebody is going to be in trouble and they don't want it to be them. 

You should push this matter with Sainsbury's customer service. Point out that nobody checked the watch was there and your partner was told that it wasn't unusual for the box to be unsealed. That really is total nonsense.

I would also report this to the police as it is a theft and once your partner has a crime number then yes, Argos should take this matter more seriously. 

I do hope he gets his watch or money back, that's a lot to lose. 

What theft? 

DanDare999

diystarter7 said:

NBLondon said:

LetsGoMets34 said:

The box was given unsealed, but my partner didn't think anything of it at the time because nothing was construed as amiss.

I know this doesn't help in your case but if they noticed it was unsealed perhaps they could have questioned it at the time or opened it in front of the cashier which would have immediately shown the problem.   In fact, I would refuse an unsealed item from Argos on principle and any electronics from anywhere.

NBLondon said:

LetsGoMets34 said:

The box was given unsealed, but my partner didn't think anything of it at the time because nothing was construed as amiss.

I know this doesn't help in your case but if they noticed it was unsealed perhaps they could have questioned it at the time or opened it in front of the cashier which would have immediately shown the problem.   In fact, I would refuse an unsealed item from Argos on principle and any electronics from anywhere.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing to have. The OH did question it and was told it was ok and I and millions of others would have accepted that. Importantly, many would not have noticed.

Reading stuff/experiences like this keeps one alert but it can still happen

Slighty OT but a few months back we were in a local shopping area and had bought a writing pad A4. As they charge money for a bag and plastic is not good and we had no bag I decided to carry it and went into another shop that sold school stuff/toys/writing/reading stuff and Mrs Diy apprached the pay desk the cashier blurted out (as I was standing behind my wife) "do you want to pay for that." - I said we have paid for it at another shop and do you want to see the receipt. He said not "just asking"  - thankfully we always ask for a receipt even when it is not offered especially if we are going from shop to another one

I bet given it wasn't sealed more than not would have looked in the box before walking away. Considering this was something they had been saving for some time to buy. 

DanDare999

Jacob_Jones said:

DanDare999 said:

user1977 said:

DanDare999 said:

Jacob_Jones said:

THIS IS NOT LEGAL NOR FINANCIAL ADVICE: 

The OP could (in theory) take Argos to the Small Claims Court. 
Argos may fail to respond or turn up and the plaintiff gets a default win (judgement). 
I've seen similar happen before. 

Even if Argos did turn up, it would go on the balance of probabilities. 

Argos say it was in the box, the OP's partners says it wasn't. What evidence have they got to tip the balance to 51%?

The court might find their testimony more persuasive than that of Argos's evidence. Often these things come down to whom the judge considers more believable on the day.

Possibly, I think they key evidence would be the unsealed box and Argos change of mind about that which may swing it. 

I would guess the evidence from Argos would be Person A, picked the package and Person B dispatched it. If both say it was sealed then without evidence of the customer taking an unsealed package and the change in story then it's most likely it left sealed. 

THIS IS NOT LEGAL NOR FINANCIAL ADVICE: 

That's if Argos bother to reply to a Small Claims Court claim. 

If the OP made a claim, Argos could: 

1. Ignore it - OP wins by default. 
2. Send a written statement to the court, but not turn up in person. 
3. Send an employee along to argue their case in court. 
4. Settle out of court. 
5. Try and get the case thrown out on some kind of technicality. 

You missed out 6. Argos could defend it properly. 

DanDare999

Jacob_Jones said:

DanDare999 said:

Jacob_Jones said:

DanDare999 said:

user1977 said:

DanDare999 said:

Jacob_Jones said:

THIS IS NOT LEGAL NOR FINANCIAL ADVICE: 

The OP could (in theory) take Argos to the Small Claims Court. 
Argos may fail to respond or turn up and the plaintiff gets a default win (judgement). 
I've seen similar happen before. 

Even if Argos did turn up, it would go on the balance of probabilities. 

Argos say it was in the box, the OP's partners says it wasn't. What evidence have they got to tip the balance to 51%?

The court might find their testimony more persuasive than that of Argos's evidence. Often these things come down to whom the judge considers more believable on the day.

Possibly, I think they key evidence would be the unsealed box and Argos change of mind about that which may swing it. 

I would guess the evidence from Argos would be Person A, picked the package and Person B dispatched it. If both say it was sealed then without evidence of the customer taking an unsealed package and the change in story then it's most likely it left sealed. 

THIS IS NOT LEGAL NOR FINANCIAL ADVICE: 

That's if Argos bother to reply to a Small Claims Court claim. 

If the OP made a claim, Argos could: 

1. Ignore it - OP wins by default. 
2. Send a written statement to the court, but not turn up in person. 
3. Send an employee along to argue their case in court. 
4. Settle out of court. 
5. Try and get the case thrown out on some kind of technicality. 

You missed out 6. Argos could defend it properly. 

That's what I meant by: 3. Send an employee along to argue their case in court.

That's not doing it properly.

It would be cheaper for them to pay up, which is sadly the case with a number of matters. 

DanDare999

Jacob_Jones said:

DanDare999 said:

You missed out 6. Argos could defend it properly. 

That's what I meant by: 3. Send an employee along to argue their case in court.

That's not doing it properly.

So how would Argos "defend it properly", in your opinion? 

My opinion on how Argos should defend it is of no benefit to the OP.

DanDare999

Jacob_Jones said:

DanDare999 said:

Jacob_Jones said:

DanDare999 said:

You missed out 6. Argos could defend it properly. 

That's what I meant by: 3. Send an employee along to argue their case in court.

That's not doing it properly.

So how would Argos "defend it properly", in your opinion? 

My opinion on how Argos should defend it is of no benefit to the OP.

You never know. 
It may help them decide whether to take it to the small claims court. 

It's irrelevant, as I've already said it'll be cheaper to pay £300. 

turnitround

I cant understand why anyone spending £300 on an item would wait to get home before opening the box if it was unsealed upon collection.

The OP has checked the thread a couple of times since the opening post but does not seem to want to comment on any of the replies.
 
OP, have you followed up on the suggestion that it may have been a returns box or display box your partner was given?