PCN issued for parking in my own space

mr_gk99

Hi Fellow Forum members

Firstly I thank you all for posting such a valuable knowledge and experiences.

Background of my case:

I have been issued 2 Parking charge notices for not displaying the permit by PCM UK limited.

The bay where I parked is my own numbered bay that I bought with my flat(leasehold)

As I am one of the directors of the resident management company I asked PCM UK limited to cancel the ticket from a Estate manager capacity as these were not needed and actually does not achieve the objective of deterring unauthorized parking and they refused to cancel the tickets

I also asked them to provide the directors rights to cancel any such future tickets and they refused to agree to change the contract. Therefore other directors and I terminated their contract and we have negotiated with another parking management company that will provide us the same service with unlimited cancellation of any unnecessary tickets. 

I went ahead with PCM's internal appeals. Got rejected. Then appealed with IAS and got rejected too.

My grounds of appeal were:

1. The permit was there in the windshield when I left the car but it fell off due to environmental factors and aging. I got issued ticket number 1

2. I refixed the permit using tape then after few days it fell again.  And another ticket was issued. Again due to environmental factors such as moisture. The permit was there when I left the car. Now I have fixed it in the dashboard as for some reason it just didn't work on the widescreen.

3. There are no loss to the parking company as i don't have to pay for my parking anyways

4. I have the right to park as part of my lease agreement. 

IAS responded with a dismissal of the appeal and asked me to refer to Beavis vs Parking eye case.

Now, PCM is chasing me to pay £200 for 2 tickets by 12.11.2022

Your help needed:
I am thinking of sending them a final letter as below as that I can avoid saving everone's time before they decide to hand over my case to debt collectors and eventually to the court. Can someone please review and let me know if I need to amend anything?

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Dear PCM UK Limited

This is regards to the alleged Contravention - Parked without clearly displaying a valid PCM UK Ltd permit (at time of enforcement).

You previously rejected my appeal and IAS also rejected my appeal. You also rejected our resident association directors' request to cancel the tickets as these are not valid tickets.

IAS in their communication said that their decision is not legally binding and I either pay the charge £100 or get legal advice. They also asked me to refer to Judgement of PARKINGEYE LIMITED and BARRY BEAVIS [2015] EWCA Civ 402.

After this, I have received my legal advice and it is as below:

PARKINGEYE LIMITED and BARRY BEAVIS [2015] EWCA Civ 402 does not apply in this case. Because, as a leaseholder of my flat in  XXXX, I have a bilateral agreement (Lease agreement) with the landowner XXXXX to park my car in my allocated bay and there is no requirement to display any permit. A third party like PCM UK Limited cannot unilaterally alter those terms in the leasehold agreement to ask me to display a permit. This is called Primacy of Contract. In those instances where there is no primacy of contract it is likely the contract will be formed by signage on site such as in PARKINGEYE LIMITED and BARRY BEAVIS [2015] EWCA Civ 402. Therefore in my case, your signage on the site does not override my lease agreement. My solicitor hence has advised me that I should contest this demand to pay the charge of £100. There are plenty of court hearings and judgement against parking companies asking lease holders to pay a charge. You can refer to such an example: Pace v Mr N [2016]. I have attached a copy of the judgement transcript for you.

I will produce my leasehold agreement in the court if needed.

And note, residents association directors at xxxxxx saw your conduct of business as an abuse of the system and has terminated your contract to operate in our premises. Judge in the above example case Pace v Mr N [2016] also saw this as an abuse. 

Therefore, I would ask you to re-consider my appeal to cancel the ticket so that you can save time for everyone involved most importantly the court and the Judge's time that could be used to deal with some real problems in the society and may be some real case where you are really owed a charge. 

Thanking you

XXXXXXX

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Coupon-mad

That's not going to get anywhere.  Don't send it, the stuff about losing at IAS and the Beavis case literally add nothing.

Just wait for your court claim and win then!

 we have negotiated with another parking management company that will provide us the same service with unlimited cancellation of any unnecessary tickets. 

Oh dear, who?

And why? You don't need a PPC at a residential site. You could do it yourself with a few cheap signs and an annual reminder to the flat owners & tenants about parking considerately. 

mr_gk99

Hi Coupon-mad, thanks for your response.
I thought the same i.e. this letter wouldn't go anywhere
however, before I decide not to send it. one question: would sending this letter put me in a weaker position in the court?

mr_gk99

Coupon-mad said:

That's not going to get anywhere.  Don't send it, the stuff about losing at IAS and the Beavis case literally add nothing.

Just wait for your court claim and win then!

 we have negotiated with another parking management company that will provide us the same service with unlimited cancellation of any unnecessary tickets. 

Oh dear, who?

And why? You don't need a PPC at a residential site. You could do it yourself with a few cheap signs and an annual reminder to the flat owners & tenants about parking considerately. 

I agree, we dont need it in the residential parking. we would need it in a private road which is our primary access for emergency services where we see people parking overnight inspite of notices. 

Coupon-mad

Do you need it though?  Is that road actually blocked, or are some tenants just whinging?

Do not send that reply because I'm afraid it makes you look weak and will encourage PCM.  It's really not a robust response (sorry).

mr_gk99

Coupon-mad said:

Do you need it though?  Is that road actually blocked, or are some tenants just whinging?

Do not send that reply because I'm afraid it makes you look weak and will encourage PCM.  It's really not a robust response (sorry).

yes, in the absence of a controlled zone, we had issued people parking there all the time. 

How can I make my response robust? any tips please?

Umkomaas

How can I make my response robust? any tips please?

Don't bother, it will make no difference. Nor do I believe it will make any difference (for or against) at any potential court hearing. 

You seem to have avoided telling us with which PPC you intend to contract, but if it's UKCPM, UKPC, UKCPS, it's out of the frying pan .....  There again almost any PPC is well capable of causing grief among residents, examples litter this forum.

Coupon-mad

Or Link Parking, or PPM, or PPS, or OPS, or Flashpark, or UKPPO, or Euro Parking, or Excel Parking, or VCS...

Sorry to say, there are NO fair PPCs that operate in residential estates, in our experience.

Is it not feasible just to put your own larger signs up on the roadway (they are really cheap to do) and maybe a boulder or two as a 'barrier', or double red lines? And just do your own self-ticketing, if the residents honestly believe there is a problem overnight in that roadway area that a gate or a couple of cheap parking bollards (with keys) can't solve?

Don't set everyone up to fail with a yet another scam permit scheme to threaten all the genuine residents all over again. It's just not needed, especially in these hard times.

I hope you can get out of the new contract quickly when it all goes wrong.  Sad to say but it will.  No PPC or pseudo 'controlled zone' is likely to be needed, and it will ruin yet more ordinary people's lives in our experience.

mr_gk99

Coupon-mad said:

Or Link Parking, or PPM, or PPS, or OPS, or Flashpark, or UKPPO, or Euro Parking, or Excel Parking, or VCS...

Sorry to say, there are NO fair PPCs that operate in residential estates, in our experience.

Is it not feasible just to put your own larger signs up on the roadway (they are really cheap to do) and maybe a boulder or two as a 'barrier', or double ted lines? And just do your own self-ticketing, if the residents honestly believe there is a problem overnight in that roadway area that a gate or a couple of cheap parking bollards (with keys) can't solve?

Don't set everyone up to fail with a yet another scam permit scheme to threaten all the genuine residents all over again. It's just not needed, especially in these hard times.

I hope you can get out of the new contract quickly when it all goes wrong.  Sad to say but it will.  No PPC or pseudo 'controlled zone' is likely to be needed, and it will ruin yet more ordinary people's lives in our experience.

That's for your input. I will speak to other directors about these points.

I just noticed in my lease there is a line that do say the below:

“ Provided Always That the Landlord or the Manager shall be permitted to create reasonable additional regulations in the interests of good estate management by notice in writing to the Tenant”

Will this go against me in my case? 

The directors at the residents association are on my side though. 

mr_gk99

@Coupon-mad

Apologies I didn't mean not to mention the PPC. It is P. Eye. 

Fruitcake

mr_gk99 said:

@Coupon-mad

Apologies I didn't mean not to mention the PPC. It is P. Eye. 

In that case you had better sell up and move out now before they cause property prices to drop.