Wood burner - would you?

artyboy

Entirely hypothetical at this stage, but am starting to think about the possibility of getting a wood burner. I'd need to do a fair bit of research on costs, but the reality is that I've got extensive woodland behind my house with a LOT of dead wood from fallen branches/trees lying around; and a double garage where I could store a huge amount if needed. I'm sure I've got an axe somewhere and the exercise would do me good!

For those on here that already have wood burners, do they:

1) do a good job of heating a large open plan space or are they best suited to smaller rooms
2) do you get any benefit on higher floors from a warm chimney stack?
3) What was your ROI in terms of payback time of lower energy bills versus upfront costs?

If we did this, it would be so it was ready for winter 2023 when our current energy fix ends, but appreciate wood needs to be dry, so would need to think about collecting/storing it a lot sooner!

FreeBear

artyboy said:  For those on here that already have wood burners, do they:

1) do a good job of heating a large open plan space or are they best suited to smaller rooms
2) do you get any benefit on higher floors from a warm chimney stack?
3) What was your ROI in terms of payback time of lower energy bills versus upfront costs?

1) You size the stove according to the dimensions of the room. So for a small room, get something like a Hobbit. If you have a big space to heat, a Sumo may be more appropriate.

2) Yes, do gain a little by having the chimney warmed by the fire downstairs. The chimney is typically around 25°C which takes the chill off overnight.

3) By the time I've accounted for the cost of purchasing wood (and smokeless coal), there is little saving to be had over heating with gas. The stove was installed as part of an overall home improvement plan which includes insulating & draught proofing. It is the latter which is making the biggest saving (ROI).

If you have the space to store a couple of years worth of fuel, and have access to free/cheap logs, a stove may be worthwhile. For those living in the middle of a town, it is just going to be an expensive lifestyle statement.

artyboy

Brilliant, thank you FreeBear. That's given me a good starting point. I've been googling stoves and there are some you can get that are inset into an existing fireplace, which looks like potentially a neat option for us.

Also googling, I see the question of collecting deadwood from a forest is a bit of a legally tricky one - ours is an ancient woodland and site of special scientific interest, but apparently owned by the local council. In practical terms, there would be no problem getting a big bagful every day as it's very much a quiet wood only really used by locals, but I do try and be a law abiding chap for the most part 

mark_cycling00

There are a few things to consider in terms of cost and practicalities

1. installation and updates to chimney if needed (could be a 6+ month wait) could easily run into thousands
2. you should have the chimney cleaned annually otherwise you might be accumulating larger costs in the future
3. proper storage for your logs with airflow so they don't rot
4. You really need a lot of logs just to have a fire for a few hours each evening. It takes some fuel to get it going ... probably 4cubic meters minimum for a winter?

5. If you're in a town, you can sadly expect people (who don't have wood burners) to demand that they are banned. This has just happened in Ireland.

Not really sure there is a big payback unless you go out less in the evenings. People do talk about turning all the heating off in other rooms and just staying in the living room but when mould starts appearing then these unheated rooms, maybe they have to stop doing that. 

Additionally, timber is probably prone to growing demand and fixed supply issues that could raise the price substantially in the future.

FreeBear

artyboy said: I've been googling stoves and there are some you can get that are inset into an existing fireplace, which looks like potentially a neat option for us.

My stove (yes, the glass needs a clean)....

Space underneath to store a couple or three days worth of logs. Need to be very careful not to knock an ember out of the fire otherwise it could set the carpet or logs on fire.

If I were to do this again, I'd probably go for a Stovax Riva 50 with a warm air ducting kit.

As for collecting logs from a wood - Unless you have permission from the land owner, it is theft. From an SSSI woodland, you could be disturbing an important, protected habitat and be in line for some pretty hefty fines.

dunstonh

I'm sure I've got an axe somewhere and the exercise would do me good!

Using an axe is not how it looks on the TV.     

1) do a good job of heating a large open plan space or are they best suited to smaller rooms

We have three burners.  All are 8kw burners within three different chimney stacks.  The rooms they heat are high ceilings 16x16.  The hallway burner  (which is also 16x16) is the most effective as it has one of the stairways and multiple rooms coming off it.    The heat travels with that one.  The other two just heat the rooms they are in.   They do it very effectively, but no heat travels beyond the room.  

2) do you get any benefit on higher floors from a warm chimney stack?

No.   If you turn the burners on in the morning and they are constant, then the brickwork is not cold but it's not enough to give any notable air heating.   Our chimneys are very large.  Smaller ones may benefit more from that.

3) What was your ROI in terms of payback time of lower energy bills versus upfront costs?

Most rural properties in our area are on oil-fired central heating, and most will have burners on to reduce their oil use.

In our case, the hallway burner prevents 3 radiators from coming on (and often the underfloor heating in one of the adjacent rooms).   The other two rooms prevent the pair of radiators in each from coming on.

In a milder winter when oil is cheap, we would likely have one burner on and switch to the hallway one later in the day.  When oil is expensive and/or it's particularly cold, we will run two burners together.  We have never had all three on at once.       

One of the things that is notable is that the central heating goes off earlier in the year and comes on later in the year as the burners take the spring/autumn chills away without needing the central heating to be fired up.

We supply most of our own wood but certain years we have to top up from external sources.    That makes it cheap heating for us.  If we had to buy all of the wood, it would be broadly equivalent in cost to the oil (noting that oil has moved between 20p and 120p a litre over recent years -  at 20p oil was cheap.  At 120p wood would beat it.)

If we didn't have our own wood, then I would still use the burners.   I love the ambience.  The rain hitting big windows, the wind noise down the chimney and the occasional crackle on the fire (less noticeable in burners than open) along with the glow and more intense heat.

One thing you really need to be aware of is that not all burners are equal.  You could have two 8kw burners in the same location and one would be next to useless and the other brilliant.   And you could have three chimneys with three identical burners in them and heat benefit will vary.        Houses with good internal airflow tend to benefit more than sealed boxes.  Stove fans help the airflow along with leaving window vents open.

artyboy

Thank you all - lots to think about, but I think the key point is that unless I own some woodland, having a burner is always going to be a lifestyle decision rather than a chance to save any significant money. That said, in the dim distant past when I lived in an ancient cottage, I really enjoyed my open fires in winter...

And DunstonH - the axe comment was just a little flippant   

FreeBear

If you currently have (and use) an open fire, fitting a stove will make better use of your fuel. An open fire is probably 25% efficient as much of the heat will be disappearing up the chimney. A stove can be anywhere from 65% to 80% efficient depending on model & mix of fuel. But if you have a pile of regular house coal, you should not be burning it in a stove - Smokeless only.

Bianchiintenso

We have a 14kw built in fan stove with 2 ducting outlets, it can and does heat the entire bungalow 164 square metres, not an option to shut the living room doors during normal operation. ASHP fitted today, the log burner is looking a better financial option for the foreseeable 

mumf

We have 2 x 8kw stoves. Ours are multifuel. We’ve used them for 25+ years,and they work well for us. However; as it is primary heating for us,it is also a lifestyle situation. Coal we have to buy,and we are always monitoring prices. Wood we don’t buy. If we had to ,it would break us! Over the years,I have developed relationships with landscape gardeners,local farmers etc. We always hold two years of firewood. We have a large garden! 

Because of this,I have two chainsaws,splitting mauls,splitting wedges,hatchet and lump hammer. Also two saw horses.With the chainsaws,there are servicing tools,petrol,oil,chain oil,safety helmet,gloves and trousers.Boots too. More than just an axe!

I also sweep my own chimneys,and that’s another load of kit…but for all the work,it pays - but it means work.

PennyForThem_2

I live about 3 miles from Cardiff centre.  I have a Morso in a small room and a larger Morso in a knocked through sitting/dining room.  Both chimneys are lined (aluminium tube).  

I used to buy wood which is semi seasoned until this season when Welsh Government said had to be sold fully seasoned / kiln dried.  A 2.75 ish cu.m costs about £300 and will last me for my small stove from end oct to about April - I am a single.

I have found, yes, it does heat the chimney therefore the upper room.  

CAVEAT:  My CH thermostat is set most of winter at 14-16 degrees