Refund denied for a returned tent as deemed 'used' by removing it from box

Ergates

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

If the outside in question was clean and dry and you didn't mark or dirty the shoes - then any online shop (that sold shoes) would allow you to do that.  The expect people to try on the shoes they order, and if the shoes were clean then they'd have no way of knowing where you'd worn them nor any reason to object to you having worn them outside.

Plenty of running shoe shops will happily allow (and even encourage) you to put the shoes on and run for several minutes on a treadmill.

shiraz99

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

Have you actually purchased and owned a tent before?

Have you come across that wasn't a good fit?

Well if you have to ask, you clearly have no idea.

I'll go back to my earlier car analogy. All 4 seat cars should seat 4 adults, that doesn't mean they're all going to be a good fit for four adults. Not all 4 berth tents are going to have the same "fit" for four people.

Explain it then, how can you not establish the "fit" of a tent from the dimensions?

Give me a car brochure and I'd have an accurate idea of how much room I'd have in the back without a test drive. 

I give up. I've no intention in going down a rabbit hole on this with you. The fact remains the OP has a good claim of not being able to establish the nature, characteristic and functioning of a tent without erecting it first. At the end of the day, a judge would decide on this if it went that far.

Ergates

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

Have you actually purchased and owned a tent before?

Have you come across that wasn't a good fit?

Well if you have to ask, you clearly have no idea.

I'll go back to my earlier car analogy. All 4 seat cars should seat 4 adults, that doesn't mean they're all going to be a good fit for four adults. Not all 4 berth tents are going to have the same "fit" for four people.

Explain it then, how can you not establish the "fit" of a tent from the dimensions?

Give me a car brochure and I'd have an accurate idea of how much room I'd have in the back without a test drive. 

If a tent is 125cm across at the base, coming to an apex 90cm above the ground, how steeply do the walls curve in?  How much room would you have to maneuver in and out of the tent?  What if you had your bag in the tent with you?

shiraz99

Ergates said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

If the outside in question was clean and dry and you didn't mark or dirty the shoes - then any online shop (that sold shoes) would allow you to do that.  The expect people to try on the shoes they order, and if the shoes were clean then they'd have no way of knowing where you'd worn them nor any reason to object to you having worn them outside.

Plenty of running shoe shops will happily allow (and even encourage) you to put the shoes on and run for several minutes on a treadmill.

I once purchased a pair of running shoes from a "proper" running shop, that encouraged me to go outside to the car park and run up and down a few times to try at the fit, this was on top of a proper analysis on the treadmill with the same shoe. The last couple of mountain bikes I bought were from stores that let me go out and round them around outside.

DanDare999

Ergates said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

If the outside in question was clean and dry and you didn't mark or dirty the shoes - then any online shop (that sold shoes) would allow you to do that.  The expect people to try on the shoes they order, and if the shoes were clean then they'd have no way of knowing where you'd worn them nor any reason to object to you having worn them outside.

Plenty of running shoe shops will happily allow (and even encourage) you to put the shoes on and run for several minutes on a treadmill.

Show me an online retailer that states you can wear their footwear outdoor when trying them on? Still doesn't answer how it's checking a tent for a good fit.  

DanDare999

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

Have you actually purchased and owned a tent before?

Have you come across that wasn't a good fit?

Well if you have to ask, you clearly have no idea.

I'll go back to my earlier car analogy. All 4 seat cars should seat 4 adults, that doesn't mean they're all going to be a good fit for four adults. Not all 4 berth tents are going to have the same "fit" for four people.

Explain it then, how can you not establish the "fit" of a tent from the dimensions?

Give me a car brochure and I'd have an accurate idea of how much room I'd have in the back without a test drive. 

I give up. I've no intention in going down a rabbit hole on this with you. The fact remains the OP has a good claim of not being able to establish the nature, characteristic and functioning of a tent without erecting it first. At the end of the day, a judge would decide on this if it went that far.

In that case they should have complied with the retailers instructions on how it should have been done. 

shiraz99

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

shiraz99 said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

Have you actually purchased and owned a tent before?

Have you come across that wasn't a good fit?

Well if you have to ask, you clearly have no idea.

I'll go back to my earlier car analogy. All 4 seat cars should seat 4 adults, that doesn't mean they're all going to be a good fit for four adults. Not all 4 berth tents are going to have the same "fit" for four people.

Explain it then, how can you not establish the "fit" of a tent from the dimensions?

Give me a car brochure and I'd have an accurate idea of how much room I'd have in the back without a test drive. 

I give up. I've no intention in going down a rabbit hole on this with you. The fact remains the OP has a good claim of not being able to establish the nature, characteristic and functioning of a tent without erecting it first. At the end of the day, a judge would decide on this if it went that far.

In that case they should have complied with the retailers instructions on how it should have been done. 

A retailer's "instructions" do not override the law.

Ergates

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

If the outside in question was clean and dry and you didn't mark or dirty the shoes - then any online shop (that sold shoes) would allow you to do that.  The expect people to try on the shoes they order, and if the shoes were clean then they'd have no way of knowing where you'd worn them nor any reason to object to you having worn them outside.

Plenty of running shoe shops will happily allow (and even encourage) you to put the shoes on and run for several minutes on a treadmill.

Show me an online retailer that states you can wear their footwear outdoor when trying them on? Still doesn't answer how it's checking a tent for a good fit.  

At this point it's pretty clear you're just being intentionally obtuse.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

If the outside in question was clean and dry and you didn't mark or dirty the shoes - then any online shop (that sold shoes) would allow you to do that.  The expect people to try on the shoes they order, and if the shoes were clean then they'd have no way of knowing where you'd worn them nor any reason to object to you having worn them outside.

Plenty of running shoe shops will happily allow (and even encourage) you to put the shoes on and run for several minutes on a treadmill.

Show me an online retailer that states you can wear their footwear outdoor when trying them on? Still doesn't answer how it's checking a tent for a good fit.  

It doesn't matter what an online retailer states, the test is what a physical store would allow. 

This varies obviously, on the one hand as the internet has taken over there are less physical shops but on the other hand those that still exist need to do more to earn custom and things like detailed inspection/interaction with the goods may be one way of achieving this.

You said a store by you has tents pitched outside on the grass so there you go an example of how you can handle a tent in a manner you could do so in store, by trying it out on the grass! 

It's all very subjective but equally all academic without the correct durable info from the retailer. 

DanDare999

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

DanDare999 said:

Ergates said:

mr_stripey said:

you don't need to erect a tent to know how big it is - the dimensions on the packaging/website will tell you this

The dimensions on the website will tell you how big a shirt or a pair of shoes are too.  But they won't tell you if they're a good fit.

Go on then, tell us how you check a tent for a good fit. Can't see a tent seven foot in length pinching your toes a bit.

Interesting you mentioned shoes, can you give an example of a shop that would take them back after a ten minute walk outside?

If the outside in question was clean and dry and you didn't mark or dirty the shoes - then any online shop (that sold shoes) would allow you to do that.  The expect people to try on the shoes they order, and if the shoes were clean then they'd have no way of knowing where you'd worn them nor any reason to object to you having worn them outside.

Plenty of running shoe shops will happily allow (and even encourage) you to put the shoes on and run for several minutes on a treadmill.

Show me an online retailer that states you can wear their footwear outdoor when trying them on? Still doesn't answer how it's checking a tent for a good fit.  

It doesn't matter what an online retailer states, the test is what a physical store would allow. 

This varies obviously, on the one hand as the internet has taken over there are less physical shops but on the other hand those that still exist need to do more to earn custom and things like detailed inspection/interaction with the goods may be one way of achieving this.

You said a store by you has tents pitched outside on the grass so there you go an example of how you can handle a tent in a manner you could do so in store, by trying it out on the grass! 

It's all very subjective but equally all academic without the correct durable info from the retailer. 

That doesn't mean you can take another tent from the display and pitch it outside. But then you do think you can return anything you've used for a full refund just because you haven't been told how to cancel the order.