Understanding disparity around us

MACKEM99

zagfles said:

MACKEM99 said:

Albermarle said:

I find it vaguely amusing to see all these highly paid newsreaders and politicians, trying to make out that they are all personally worrying about the increased cost of living, along with the poor downtrodden masses.

Personally I think the stories about more people not eating etc., are isolated cases hyped up by the media as in reality the cost of living issues are only just starting to bite. By the Autumn, pretty much everything we buy will have gone up in price, sometimes more than once and then the cold weather will come and the real impact of the energy prices will be felt. Then the squeeze will really start to be felt in the lower income sections of society. Xmas might keep the tills ringing but in the dark days after that, many people will be really feeling  the pinch.

People eating less -  there are loads who could do with that these days.

Indeed - but how often do you hear the fatuous explaination (excuse the pun) that obesity is a symptom of poverty because healthy food costs more? Usually coming from journalists on £100k+ salaries who've probably never in their lives had to count the pennies while shopping. If they had, they might notice that stuff like fresh fruit, veg etc is far cheaper than stuff like crisps and chocolate bars.

zagfles said:

MACKEM99 said:

Albermarle said:

I find it vaguely amusing to see all these highly paid newsreaders and politicians, trying to make out that they are all personally worrying about the increased cost of living, along with the poor downtrodden masses.

Personally I think the stories about more people not eating etc., are isolated cases hyped up by the media as in reality the cost of living issues are only just starting to bite. By the Autumn, pretty much everything we buy will have gone up in price, sometimes more than once and then the cold weather will come and the real impact of the energy prices will be felt. Then the squeeze will really start to be felt in the lower income sections of society. Xmas might keep the tills ringing but in the dark days after that, many people will be really feeling  the pinch.

People eating less -  there are loads who could do with that these days.

Indeed - but how often do you hear the fatuous explaination (excuse the pun) that obesity is a symptom of poverty because healthy food costs more? Usually coming from journalists on £100k+ salaries who've probably never in their lives had to count the pennies while shopping. If they had, they might notice that stuff like fresh fruit, veg etc is far cheaper than stuff like crisps and chocolate bars.

carrots 40p for 1kg. Spuds 30p per pound - shall I go on?

zagfles

Linton said:

Millyonare said:

UK today in 2022 has full employment, record household disposable income, and the 11th highest level of net wealth on planet Earth.

Yes, but it is spread very unevenly.  That is the problem.  There are plenty of people with the means to live comfortably for the rest of their lives without working and others who have very much a hand to mouth existance.

Usually as much if not more down to spending habits rather than income. I know couples on over £100k between them who live "hand to mouth". A couple on min wage will earn close to £40k between them. Min wage jobs are easy to get these days, employers are crying out for them in loads of areas.

Now look at Sea Shell's nuts thread, she has the means to retire comfortably on an income far less than min wage. Because of spending habits, not income.

zagfles

MACKEM99 said:

zagfles said:

MACKEM99 said:

Albermarle said:

I find it vaguely amusing to see all these highly paid newsreaders and politicians, trying to make out that they are all personally worrying about the increased cost of living, along with the poor downtrodden masses.

Personally I think the stories about more people not eating etc., are isolated cases hyped up by the media as in reality the cost of living issues are only just starting to bite. By the Autumn, pretty much everything we buy will have gone up in price, sometimes more than once and then the cold weather will come and the real impact of the energy prices will be felt. Then the squeeze will really start to be felt in the lower income sections of society. Xmas might keep the tills ringing but in the dark days after that, many people will be really feeling  the pinch.

People eating less -  there are loads who could do with that these days.

Indeed - but how often do you hear the fatuous explaination (excuse the pun) that obesity is a symptom of poverty because healthy food costs more? Usually coming from journalists on £100k+ salaries who've probably never in their lives had to count the pennies while shopping. If they had, they might notice that stuff like fresh fruit, veg etc is far cheaper than stuff like crisps and chocolate bars.

carrots 40p for 1kg. Spuds 30p per pound - shall I go on?

Indeed - whereas a 25g bag of crisps, even a cheap one, is at least 30p. A pound is 453 grams, so crisps are 18 times the cost of potatoes which is the main ingredient.

I remember a trivial pursuit questions that was something like "what very expensive way to sell potatoes was invented by ????"

Sea_Shell

zagfles said:

Linton said:

Millyonare said:

UK today in 2022 has full employment, record household disposable income, and the 11th highest level of net wealth on planet Earth.

Yes, but it is spread very unevenly.  That is the problem.  There are plenty of people with the means to live comfortably for the rest of their lives without working and others who have very much a hand to mouth existance.

Usually as much if not more down to spending habits rather than income. I know couples on over £100k between them who live "hand to mouth". A couple on min wage will earn close to £40k between them. Min wage jobs are easy to get these days, employers are crying out for them in loads of areas.

Now look at Sea Shell's nuts thread, she has the means to retire comfortably on an income far less than min wage. Because of spending habits, not income.

Partially 😉

Well, there were some years when we were raking it in....with DH being a HR tax payer.   We maxed out joint earnings of c.£60k gross, at one point.

But we did squirrel a lot of it 😉

zagfles

Sea_Shell said:

zagfles said:

Linton said:

Millyonare said:

UK today in 2022 has full employment, record household disposable income, and the 11th highest level of net wealth on planet Earth.

Yes, but it is spread very unevenly.  That is the problem.  There are plenty of people with the means to live comfortably for the rest of their lives without working and others who have very much a hand to mouth existance.

Usually as much if not more down to spending habits rather than income. I know couples on over £100k between them who live "hand to mouth". A couple on min wage will earn close to £40k between them. Min wage jobs are easy to get these days, employers are crying out for them in loads of areas.

Now look at Sea Shell's nuts thread, she has the means to retire comfortably on an income far less than min wage. Because of spending habits, not income.

Partially 😉

Well, there were some years when we were raking it in....with DH being a HR tax payer.   We maxed out joint earnings of c.£60k gross, at one point.

But we did squirrel a lot of it 😉

I'm sure you did, that's the point! And even with the upcoming massive energy price rises I'm sure you'll be OK even on income under min wage.

PS I hope you don't mind being used as an example, but that's what comes of having a famous thread

Daliah

Isn't it amazing that so many people have plenty of income and/or assets but very little if not no apparent compassion. Sure, there are benefit scroungers, just like there are tax evaders and other criminals. Everyone has the opportunity to report such scoundrels, and we have enough authorities that can deal with them.

Most of the people living in poverty in the UK - even if it's 'merely' relative poverty - find it impossible to get out of it, and it's not for want of trying. Brushing their plight away on the grounds that there are even poorer people in other countries is quite shocking.

I am not sure, though, whether this complex subject is really suitable for the Savings and Investment board.

Albermarle

zagfles said:

MACKEM99 said:

Albermarle said:

I find it vaguely amusing to see all these highly paid newsreaders and politicians, trying to make out that they are all personally worrying about the increased cost of living, along with the poor downtrodden masses.

Personally I think the stories about more people not eating etc., are isolated cases hyped up by the media as in reality the cost of living issues are only just starting to bite. By the Autumn, pretty much everything we buy will have gone up in price, sometimes more than once and then the cold weather will come and the real impact of the energy prices will be felt. Then the squeeze will really start to be felt in the lower income sections of society. Xmas might keep the tills ringing but in the dark days after that, many people will be really feeling  the pinch.

People eating less -  there are loads who could do with that these days.

Indeed - but how often do you hear the fatuous explaination (excuse the pun) that obesity is a symptom of poverty because healthy food costs more? Usually coming from journalists on £100k+ salaries who've probably never in their lives had to count the pennies while shopping. If they had, they might notice that stuff like fresh fruit, veg etc is far cheaper than stuff like crisps and chocolate bars.

It can make sense for someone on a very low budget, with a family to feed, to buy cheap filling food, high in carbohydrate and fat . Not crisps, but bags of cheap frozen pizzas, pies, sausages, chips etc . Fresh good quality meat or fish is expensive and you can not feed kids just with fresh vegetables.

I agree that this line about a healthy diet being always more expensive is a bit dubious, but there is a bit more to it than just comparing carrots with bags of Monster Munch .

zagfles

Daliah said:

Isn't it amazing that so many people have plenty of income and/or assets but very little if not no apparent compassion. Sure, there are benefit scroungers, just like there are tax evaders and other criminals. Everyone has the opportunity to report such scoundrels, and we have enough authorities that can deal with them.

Most of the people living in poverty in the UK - even if it's 'merely' relative poverty - find it impossible to get out of it, and it's not for want of trying. Brushing their plight away on the grounds that there are even poorer people in other countries is quite shocking.

I am not sure, though, whether this complex subject is really suitable for the Savings and Investment board.

Isn't it amazing that in a country where we all get free education, free healthcare and one of the best means tested benefits system in world, people seem to have no apparent compassion for people who have to walk 3 miles just to get safe drinking water, children who have to work 12 hours days in sweat shops to make our clothes, countries where 8% of children die before their 5th birthday. Nah - forget that poverty, just redefine "absolute poverty" as 60% of equivalised median income within the borders of the UK in some random year in the past. That's what everyone thinks poverty means, right? That's the real problem isn't it? That's what we need to tackle, right?

OTOH, do a bit of travelling and maybe you'll see the in-country relative definitions as the xenophobic rubbish they are. Someone on min wage in the UK is not "in poverty", they're earning far more than the average income in the world even in PPP terms.

I do understand though that my views aren't widely shared. I'm one of these loony "internationalists" who happen to think people in other countries are just as human and have just as much right to live a happy and prosperous life as people who happen to be geographically closer to me.

RG2015

Daliah said:

Isn't it amazing that so many people have plenty of income and/or assets but very little if not no apparent compassion. Sure, there are benefit scroungers, just like there are tax evaders and other criminals. Everyone has the opportunity to report such scoundrels, and we have enough authorities that can deal with them.

Most of the people living in poverty in the UK - even if it's 'merely' relative poverty - find it impossible to get out of it, and it's not for want of trying. Brushing their plight away on the grounds that there are even poorer people in other countries is quite shocking.

I am not sure, though, whether this complex subject is really suitable for the Savings and Investment board.

The OP is talking about understanding the disparity.

People on this board are discussing saving and investing surplus cash. Compare this with people in this country who are struggling to make ends meet.

The word poverty is being used to describe the plight of people in the UK and also people in poorer parts of the world. The word means two different things making it relative.

I agree with the OP. This is absolutely the right place for their post. 

zagfles

Albermarle said:

zagfles said:

MACKEM99 said:

Albermarle said:

I find it vaguely amusing to see all these highly paid newsreaders and politicians, trying to make out that they are all personally worrying about the increased cost of living, along with the poor downtrodden masses.

Personally I think the stories about more people not eating etc., are isolated cases hyped up by the media as in reality the cost of living issues are only just starting to bite. By the Autumn, pretty much everything we buy will have gone up in price, sometimes more than once and then the cold weather will come and the real impact of the energy prices will be felt. Then the squeeze will really start to be felt in the lower income sections of society. Xmas might keep the tills ringing but in the dark days after that, many people will be really feeling  the pinch.

People eating less -  there are loads who could do with that these days.

Indeed - but how often do you hear the fatuous explaination (excuse the pun) that obesity is a symptom of poverty because healthy food costs more? Usually coming from journalists on £100k+ salaries who've probably never in their lives had to count the pennies while shopping. If they had, they might notice that stuff like fresh fruit, veg etc is far cheaper than stuff like crisps and chocolate bars.

It can make sense for someone on a very low budget, with a family to feed, to buy cheap filling food, high in carbohydrate and fat . Not crisps, but bags of cheap frozen pizzas, pies, sausages, chips etc . Fresh good quality meat or fish is expensive and you can not feed kids just with fresh vegetables.

I agree that this line about a healthy diet being always more expensive is a bit dubious, but there is a bit more to it than just comparing carrots with bags of Monster Munch .

Really? Many kids I know are vegetarians, they manage perfectly fine. My kids went veggie at uni, mainly to save money even though they didn't really have to. Eating meat especially red/fatty meat frequently is unhealthy as well as being expensive and environmentally unfriendly.

As for stuff like chips, why? We never fed our kids chips, they didn't even choose them when we went out. Potatoes are cheap, filling and relatively healthy if you don't soak them in fat.

Have a look at the food shopping boards here, plenty of ways to eat healthily for not much.