Neighbour using alley but has no right of access - wants to buy access

YoungBlueEyes

LilMissSunshine said:

I've made it absolutely clear all he can do is access it for maintaining the side of his house and thats it. If he does more works like throwing slate chippings down that's on him. Ill leave it for now if he continues to do stuff ill consider getting a letter sent to ensure he knows.

I agree with the first sentence of this quote, but none of the rest. He/they(?) knew what he was buying and now he’s trying it on cos he fancies a bit more of it. 

This guy’s a chancer who’s gone round you to your neighbour to get what he wants. Get it nipped in the bud. Don’t let it rumble on or you could be years at it. 

Bendy_House

LilMissSunshine said:

(1) He spoke to neighbour 1 and got permission to enter the garden pull the gate posts thsg have fallen down and attach the panel to the posts. I csnt stop neighbour 1 giving that permission. So long as what is done doesn't change my boundary like he had before. 

(2) I've made it absolutely clear all he can do is access it for maintaining the side of his house and thats it. If he does more works like throwing slate chippings down that's on him. Ill leave it for now if he continues to do stuff ill consider getting a letter sent to ensure he knows.

1) Why not? By putting a gate there he is threatening/intending to trespass, and the red line indicates the boundary of your land. Hmm, I think I'll just go and pop a gate in to my neighbour's fence...

That is YOUR land, and neighb No1 has a RoW over it. Full stop. End of. That's it. YOU give permission for anyone else to come on to your property, not anyone else. (There's obviously an implied right for posties, meter readers, visitors and all that malarkey, but not normally via an alleyway that's clearly designed solely to allow access to your back gardens.) Perhaps have a quiet word with that neighbour and explain your concerns, and make it clear that the new fellow is behaving in a manner that's causing you concern. Inform No1 that they should not be discussing this alleyway with anyone else. Why? Because it YOURS. THAT is what No1 should be saying to the new guy - "I don't own it, they do. Speak to them." Simple.

2) Gaining access without permission to, and/or putting down chippings in, that alleyway is, indeed, 'on him', as I'd be insisting he removes them right away. This guy is either a bit bonkers with little self-awareness, or he's a devious person with a plan. Either way, he should not be allowed to get away with doing anything to your property without your express permission. It really would be like you going in to his garden without his permission, and pouring out  a bag of chippings wherever you want - he needs to understand that direct parallel! He is certainly NOT trying to do you a favour. Nope.

You need to start evidencing everything that happens from now on. Any conversation you have with him, you record (either openly, or surreptitiously). You need to demonstrate that you have made it clear that he should not come on to your land without your express permission. If he does, and carries out any other act like tampering with the fences or putting down chippings, he needs a verbal and written notice to undo it all by x date. This sort of stuff can become very messy if it escalates, and suddenly everything you say about what has happened is simply your 'word'. I am telling you, you'll be tearing your hair out in frustration. I suspect that this new neighbour's behaviour - whilst pretty blatant and obvious to you - will come across as quite 'plausible' to others. They will consider him a 'nice bloke' who was just 'trying to be friendly' - because that is how he'll put himself across. Yes, many folk really ARE that devious. It is literally how they 'work'. Phony.

As I said before, he may just be incredibly ignorant - that's bad enough - but could easily be highly devious. Literally, a bit of a psycho! I don't mean that he's likely to string you up, but his brain might well not function like normal folk; they are entirely believing that they are entitled and in the right. When they don't get what they want, it's someone else fault, and the victim mentality can be truly staggering to observe. You think they are just 'trying it on', but often it is genuinely what's in their heads. It is incredible.

So, hopefully all you have is a bit of a twit.  :-)

LilMissSunshine

Section62 said:

LilMissSunshine said:

Section62 said:

Are you absolutely sure you own the part of the alley I've shaded in orange?

The typical ownership arrangements in this kind of situation is each property owns the section behind their property, i.e. that the orange part would belong to neighbour 2.  There's no hard and fast rule that must be the case, but it is the common way.

How have you confirmed your ownership?  Have you also checked Neighbour 2's deeds?

If you start making changes to the alley, such as putting a gate at the street end, you need to be absolutely sure you have the right to do so.

100%  my title plan is a super clear its marked exactly that way so I own all of it with a covenant for next door to have access

Have you checked neighbour 2's as well though... just in case their title plan shows they own it too?

Yes, their plan just shows house and garden, no alley. 

Norman_Castle

LilMissSunshine said:

I've made it absolutely clear all he can do is access it for maintaining the side of his house and thats it. If he does more works like throwing slate chippings down that's on him.

Hopefully you told him he needs to ask before using the alley to maintain his house.

LilMissSunshine

Norman_Castle said:

LilMissSunshine said:

I've made it absolutely clear all he can do is access it for maintaining the side of his house and thats it. If he does more works like throwing slate chippings down that's on him.

Hopefully you told him he needs to ask before using the alley to maintain his house.

Yes I was clear he needs to notify me even if its a note through the door. I have a feeling he isn't one to listen very well based on how he has been so far. Bit like my neighbour, won't listen to a woman and is really agreesive but will be fine if its a man. 

Norman_Castle

LilMissSunshine said:

Norman_Castle said:

LilMissSunshine said:

I've made it absolutely clear all he can do is access it for maintaining the side of his house and thats it. If he does more works like throwing slate chippings down that's on him.

Hopefully you told him he needs to ask before using the alley to maintain his house.

  Bit like my neighbour, won't listen to a woman and is really agreesive but will be fine if its a man. 

I'd wondered if he was treating you differently as a woman hence the suggestion to physically block the access. Its pointless arguing with a locked gate.