Tui Package holiday, lost day to delay, advice please?

Westin

SMDTS said:

Think I am going to hand this to a solicitor. 3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.
They make it impossible to appeal and try to deny responsibility at every point. had a good conversation with a couple at the local tui who were about to book and are now looking at alternatives as they already had doubts about tui and speaking to someone first hand confirmed their doubts, so hopefully saved someone else from this hassle and cost tui a bit of custom.
I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

How much will you spend on appointing a solicitor?  Have you considered the legal outlay vs your claim for a lost evening of entertainment and drinks and your Bk meal at NCL?

onashoestring

SMDTS said:

Think I am going to hand this to a solicitor. 3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.
They make it impossible to appeal and try to deny responsibility at every point. had a good conversation with a couple at the local tui who were about to book and are now looking at alternatives as they already had doubts about tui and speaking to someone first hand confirmed their doubts, so hopefully saved someone else from this hassle and cost tui a bit of custom.
I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

The  adjudicator  AviationADR are approved by the CAA, cover TUI flights  . You can submit your complaint here – there's no fee if your claim's unsuccessful.

eskbanker

SMDTS said:

3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.

As I understood it, the delay rules use the scheduled arrival time as the baseline, and I'd agree that common sense would dictate that this should be the time published for the last three months up to and including departure rather than one applicable at the time of booking.  I don't recall seeing anything about this rescheduling issue in other threads, so it'll be interesting to see if anyone can identify a precedent or something that determines the correct interpretation....

SMDTS said:

I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

It was never going to be particularly likely that store staff, who are effectively just a sales team, would be in a position to advise on legal rights, etc.

SMDTS said:

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

I don't have any direct experience of ambulance-chasers but https://www.bottonline.co.uk/flight-delay-compensation are often cited for their expertise in this area - they'd take a sizable chunk of anything they secure for you, in return for 'no win, no fee'.  Having said that, the ADR process mentioned above would seem a more obvious starting point, or are you still hopeful of making some sort of a case beyond the flight delay?

SMDTS

Westin said:

SMDTS said:

Think I am going to hand this to a solicitor. 3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.
They make it impossible to appeal and try to deny responsibility at every point. had a good conversation with a couple at the local tui who were about to book and are now looking at alternatives as they already had doubts about tui and speaking to someone first hand confirmed their doubts, so hopefully saved someone else from this hassle and cost tui a bit of custom.
I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

How much will you spend on appointing a solicitor?  Have you considered the legal outlay vs your claim for a lost evening of entertainment and drinks and your Bk meal at NCL?

The solicitor is more in regard to the fact that they are trying to wriggle out of the £1360 of flight delay compensation by using incorrect timings, and refusing to enter into the matter with me. I would use a no win no fee mob such as bott, and something is better than nothing.

SMDTS

onashoestring said:

SMDTS said:

Think I am going to hand this to a solicitor. 3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.
They make it impossible to appeal and try to deny responsibility at every point. had a good conversation with a couple at the local tui who were about to book and are now looking at alternatives as they already had doubts about tui and speaking to someone first hand confirmed their doubts, so hopefully saved someone else from this hassle and cost tui a bit of custom.
I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

The  adjudicator  AviationADR are approved by the CAA, cover TUI flights  . You can submit your complaint here – there's no fee if your claim's unsuccessful.

Thank you. If I use the adjudicator and they dont agreee is it binding, would that preclude me from using a solicitor if it is unsuccessful?

SMDTS

eskbanker said:

SMDTS said:

3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.

As I understood it, the delay rules use the scheduled arrival time as the baseline, and I'd agree that common sense would dictate that this should be the time published for the last three months up to and including departure rather than one applicable at the time of booking.  I don't recall seeing anything about this rescheduling issue in other threads, so it'll be interesting to see if anyone can identify a precedent or something that determines the correct interpretation....

SMDTS said:

I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

It was never going to be particularly likely that store staff, who are effectively just a sales team, would be in a position to advise on legal rights, etc.

SMDTS said:

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

I don't have any direct experience of ambulance-chasers but https://www.bottonline.co.uk/flight-delay-compensation are often cited for their expertise in this area - they'd take a sizable chunk of anything they secure for you, in return for 'no win, no fee'.  Having said that, the ADR process mentioned above would seem a more obvious starting point, or are you still hopeful of making some sort of a case beyond the flight delay?

Thank you. Bott was who I had in mind from google searches and other forum posts but I will look into the ADR process first.
The reason I approached staff in store first is because I booked and paid 100% in store and from pretty much every piece of consumer advice you read states you form your contract of sale with the entity you paid and agreed the sale with and should start any grievances with the party you entered into the contract with. Advice on this site says you shouldn't accept being fobbed off to third parties who you never entered into a contract with if you dont want to.
The branch staff are claiming that the airline is nothing to do with the branch, even though I never entered any contract with the airline, I booked a full package with the branch and my redress starts with them.
They suggested I try to claim from the airport and swissport, and that they didnt have to give me contact info for their claims department and I should claim through citizens advice. 

SMDTS

And a quick question to those who suggest I shouldnt pursue the missing evening, if i came to your house, quoted for a 16 camera cctv system, went to install it and found out that for unforseen reasons outside my control I could only fit 15 cameras, If I still billed you the full amount for installing 16 cameras would you just accept it without complaining or demanding an appropriate reduction in price?
If so I would love you as a customer. Any normal person expects to get what they were sold. I was sold a holiday where we arrived at a reasonable time of the evening where we could be fed watered and entertained. We specifically asked about arrival time, transfer time and restraunt and entertainment time at the point of booking with the person at the local branch who taken full payment.

eskbanker

SMDTS said:

The reason I approached staff in store first is because I booked and paid 100% in store and from pretty much every piece of consumer advice you read states you form your contract of sale with the entity you paid and agreed the sale with and should start any grievances with the party you entered into the contract with. Advice on this site says you shouldn't accept being fobbed off to third parties who you never entered into a contract with if you dont want to.
The branch staff are claiming that the airline is nothing to do with the branch, even though I never entered any contract with the airline, I booked a full package with the branch and my redress starts with them.
They suggested I try to claim from the airport and swissport, and that they didnt have to give me contact info for their claims department and I should claim through citizens advice. 

While your point about prime contractors is generally sound, the flight delay regulations are clear that it is the responsibility of the operating carrier (i.e. the airline) to reimburse expenses and/or pay compensation, so the tour operator, while retaining liability for matters within the scope of the Package Travel Regulations, is indeed a separate entity in this particular context, despite having subcontracted the flight component of the holiday to another entity within the same group.

So the branch staff are correct to point this out, although their steer about pursuing airport, ground support supplier, Citizens Advice, etc, is the sort of nonsense to be expected from underpaid and underinformed sales reps!

Having said that, while the airline is the right place to go for flight delay compensation, other aspects of your trip are the responsibility of the tour operator, so your grievance about the missing evening is one for them.  As covered already in the thread, it's nothing like as simple as the flawed analogy you're trying to make in the above post, so there's a big difference between arriving late at the hotel and the tour operator being contractually liable to offer redress for the consequences of this.

Caz3121

SMDTS said:

3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time

how much was the flight brought forward? did they charge you extra for having longer use of the facilities on day of arrival compared to what was originally booked?

onashoestring

SMDTS said:

onashoestring said:

SMDTS said:

Think I am going to hand this to a solicitor. 3 months before the holiday they changed the flight time to an earlier time. The ticket displayed the earlier time, the departure board in the airport and check in and boarding gates were all operating on the earlier time, but for the puproses of compensation they are referring to the original time from a year ago which doesn't qualify as it was supposed to leave later in the day.
They make it impossible to appeal and try to deny responsibility at every point. had a good conversation with a couple at the local tui who were about to book and are now looking at alternatives as they already had doubts about tui and speaking to someone first hand confirmed their doubts, so hopefully saved someone else from this hassle and cost tui a bit of custom.
I started off very polite but was completely stonewalled. The staff in the tui store insinuated that I should be claiming direct from the airport, which is utter bs.

Any recommendations on a claims solicitor?

The  adjudicator  AviationADR are approved by the CAA, cover TUI flights  . You can submit your complaint here – there's no fee if your claim's unsuccessful.

Thank you. If I use the adjudicator and they dont agreee is it binding, would that preclude me from using a solicitor if it is unsuccessful?

I am not a legal expert ,IMO a solicitor will advise you that you would need to follow the appeals process approved by CAA first , before taking it to court .